Those who want Danny Ferry gone.

[OldTimeHawk]

Good grief I'm so tired of this conversation...

 

It's important to know who stands where in this debacle.  Anyone that can profit from this story is going after Ferry - that would be the media, politicians, and general race baiters.  All this stuff about Ferry and Levenson falls into that conversation, and it's nauseating.  

 

Racism is not the issue and there aren't many, if any, Squawkers buying into that hoopla.

 

Then there's the "sheople" crowd.  These are general NBA fans & non-sports fans who heard that "the Atlanta Hawks made some racist comments about black people and Africa."  They don't know the story or any of the names involved, except maybe Danny Ferry.  Drama is drama and people eat it up like candy.  The key thing to note here is that the mainstream/casual crowd falls into this category and no matter how much you crusade, you will not be able to sway the lazy opinion of this crowd.  "Danny Ferry and the Hawks are racist - they need to do something about that."  This is all those people understand.

 

Which is where WE the last group of people come into the conversation.  We are not fans of Danny Ferry's work or his "vision" first of all.  As fans who spend our money at the games and have been loyal to the franchise guess what?  We're entitled to that opinion.  The thing is, this is not good for the franchise.  People have already forgotten our years 50+ win seasons and continual playoff success (as evidenced by our free agent draw, attendance, and media snubbing).  We are already seen as a "dull and boring" franchise with no hope of advancing to the ECF's...now, we go and smother that crap cake with "racist" frosting.

 

But get ol' Danny back in the office and he'll fix'er up! {/sarcasm}

 

The media, race baiters, and the casual fans WILL forget about us (most already have).  When a potential high-profile free agent looks at us though, they will pause...and the stigma will remind them who we are.  If Danny Ferry is our GM - sweet lord people, is it so hard to understand?  Really.

 

 

He didn't say "puts Atlanta back."  He said, "puts Atlanta back even further."  We need a player of that kind of profile to take us seriously.  For all you people who question why I write a rant about our need...well, there ya go.  If you understand that we need a star, then you should see the problem with keeping Danny Ferry.  His whole damn strategy is basically built upon the hope of landing a big free agent star.  However, the belief among these kinds of players is that we are a joke - and even more so now "BECAUSE the racist attitudes of the Atlanta Hawks and Danny Ferry."

I dont think his strategy is solely about landing a precieved star - I think its more about building a team  with players that understand their roles - having a bonafide star can make things easier , but we dont need a Carmello and his ego / baggage that has never been  high on developing  as a team player regardless of the talent around him .  Its always been about Carmello first , so what Carmello thinks means nothing to any intelligent player.

 

 Again , instead of  being gutless and afraid the Hwaks should have come out strongly and said the report came from Cleveland and was distributed around the league and the MBA should investigate Cleveland if they feel the contents were or are racist - that puts Cleveland on the defensive instead of Atlanta  taking ownership of the words.   Atlanta can have a star player, they just wont get them from the lottery because they are too good for it , and they cant compete with the bigger markets for one.  They will simply have to get lucky in the draft and develop one , but I personally like a team that has players that each bring unique skills to the table that makes for a strong overall unit.

[OldTimeHawk]

Yeah.........................

pc apologist talk ....... and once again why isnt the media asking  for Clevelands role ????

[Wretch]

I dont think his strategy is solely about landing a precieved star - I think its more about building a team  with players that understand their roles - having a bonafide star can make things easier , but we dont need a Carmello and his ego / baggage that has never been  high on developing  as a team player regardless of the talent around him .  Its always been about Carmello first , so what Carmello thinks means nothing to any intelligent player.

 

 Again , instead of  being gutless and afraid the Hwaks should have come out strongly and said the report came from Cleveland and was distributed around the league and the MBA should investigate Cleveland if they feel the contents were or are racist - that puts Cleveland on the defensive instead of Atlanta  taking ownership of the words.   Atlanta can have a star player, they just wont get them from the lottery because they are too good for it , and they cant compete with the bigger markets for one.  They will simply have to get lucky in the draft and develop one , but I personally like a team that has players that each bring unique skills to the table that makes for a strong overall unit.

 

No, his plan is exactly what you say it's about - building a complete team of players that know their roles.  It's about finding high character guys that won't give excuses.  His plan is about the lack of size, low post scoring, and a prolific scorer...being compensated by ball movement, player movement, and shooters.  His vision is putting a quality team on the floor that works hard and competes.  To which end, he will borrow from the Spurs playbook, substituting lost parts with similar replacements into a "system" that keeps us competitive.

 

Problem is...there's nothing about our record with or without Al Horford that suggests were are anywhere close to being a contender.  Just homer-ish hope that we are better than people give us credit for.  I love this team, but I've no delusions about where we stand.  Do we seriously believe that this team can compete with the top 4 teams in the league?  If so, then there really isn't much point in furthering this conversation.  Otherwise, we are in need of an elite/high profile talent.  

 

It's hard to land a star player in the lottery.  So, what sense does it make to build a strategy around drafting players OUTSIDE of the lottery where your chances of landing a star are microscopic?  It doesn't.  It'd be foolish to put our eggs in that basket.   You really need to brush up on your draft history if you think otherwise.  Nobody is giving us a star for Teague + filler, so any trade we make is likely to be a lateral move.

 

So, if you strike the draft from the scope of logical possibility and you concede that a blockbuster trade is not likely to happen.  What's left for Danny Ferry's marvelous plan?  

 

Free agency...  

 

Problem is, high profile talents LIKE Carmelo Anthony (not necessarily him) have no respect for us on the court and now off the court as well.

 

(BTW...all contenders have good coaches, players that know their roles, play the right way, and work hard.  Having all that is nice, but it gives us no advantage whatsoever.  Especially when we are at a disadvantage by not having an elite talent.)

Edited September 29, 2014 by Wretch

[Wretch]

pc apologist talk ....... and once again why isnt the media asking  for Clevelands role ????

 

This is our apology letter, admitting who we are and what our problems are.  Not sure passing the buck to Cleveland, rather than owning up to what's going on inside of our organization, is the best way to go there.  Also not sure that exaggerating the circumstance, i.e. - embellishing our negative stigma - is a wise strategy.  I take Koonin's comments to mean that we have some serious internal flaws to deal with starting with Levenson and the administration, to include Danny Ferry, that he personally put into place.

[Guest]

the point once again is the origin - it was a scouting report that was sent out to the Hawks - why isnt there an investigation into who knew of the report , emails related to any correspondance concerning the report, teams that were given the report ?? Why is it assumed only the Hawks recieved and used the report to elavuate players?? Basically Ferry is being used as the scapegoat , Cleveland which knowingly distributed the report is unscatched . Its not so much about the scout as it is about who knew about the report. Dont tell me the Hawks were the only team to get that report.

Yes the Hawks could have stood up for Ferry and stood by him - and in turn asked the NBA to investigate the source of the report and who internally knew. Instead Ferry is expected to take the blame for the reason top free agents wont come to Atlanta even though free agents have historically avoided Atlanta .

I've been cool with Ferry as the Hawks GM before and after, but passing the buck and ratting out the author/team that provided the scouting report would be seen as DF and the Hawks avoiding their OWN missteps in the matter. It would make it even more difficult for DF to interact with agents and other GM's.

DF has taken responsibility and apologized for his role, no need for him to drag others into it (that's the media's job if they are do inclined).

[OldTimeHawk]

I've been cool with Ferry as the Hawks GM before and after, but passing the buck and ratting out the author/team that provided the scouting report would be seen as DF and the Hawks avoiding their OWN missteps in the matter. It would make it even more difficult for DF to interact with agents and other GM's.

DF has taken responsibility and apologized for his role, no need for him to drag others into it (that's the media's job if they are do inclined).

nothing wrong with taking responsibility for your role , but why does Ferrys role exceed what should be obvious - that  in all likelihood this scouting report was used around the NBA and Cleveland was well aware of the comtents BEFORE it was sent around the NBA.

 Its not like it was an entrapment sting and Ferry was the only one that took the bait. 

[Guest]

nothing wrong with taking responsibility for your role , but why does Ferrys role exceed what should be obvious - that in all likelihood this scouting report was used around the NBA and Cleveland was well aware of the comtents BEFORE it was sent around the NBA.

Its not like it was an entrapment sting and Ferry was the only one that took the bait.

Well since Ferry was the only one (that we know of) that referenced it and said it falls on him.

He's owned it. End of story.

[OldTimeHawk]

Well since Ferry was the only one (that we know of) that referenced it and said it falls on him.

He's owned it. End of story

makes perfect sense - sending out sterotypical reports  should only effect the  organization that actually has a gm  read those reports aloud.  Its only racist if you read them , not if you write them .  Ferry is such a nit wit . So if you read wors that are interpreted as racist only the actuall reader is racist .  

 we all know why Cleveland isnt  effected , its cause it would upset the NBA marketing campaign featuring his highness.

[Guest]

makes perfect sense - sending out sterotypical reports should only effect the organization that actually has a gm read those reports aloud. Its only racist if you read them , not if you write them . Ferry is such a nit wit . So if you read wors that are interpreted as racist only the actuall reader is racist .

we all know why Cleveland isnt effected , its cause it would upset the NBA marketing campaign featuring his highness.

Dude / you need to give it a rest. I don't know how many times it's been said - nobody thinks DF is a racist. The author of the report no longer works for an NBA team.

[OldTimeHawk]

Dude / you need to give it a rest. I don't know how many times it's been said - nobody thinks DF is a racist. The author of the report no longer works for an NBA team.

why should I change my opinion or " give it a rest "?? Its bs that the organization the report came from and has been sent out throughout the NBA is basically  given a free pass to continue business as usual , but the full effect of the media and pc police  come down on Atlanta .  And  Ferry is still being  referred to as a racist  in the media and to some extent here.  Why do you think he took a leave after being punished internally ?? Hes doing his best to lay low and hope that the goodwill he has built up throughout his career  helps  shift the public perception of him .

[Guest]

Sigh - and with that I'm exiting stage left!

The season is starting, DF's fate now rests with the new majority owner.

[AHF]

The report didn't come from Cleveland. It came from a former Cleveland employee. It would be like investigating the Hawks for a scouting report written by Billy Knight.

Remember too that the NBA didn't want the Hawks stuff going public and dressed down Gearon for taking it public. Why would the NBA want to recreate the scrutiny it didn't want in Atlanta somewhere else?

You should be pissed at Gearon for exposing this and deliberately doing it in the most inflammatory way possible. He didn't release the whole report on Deng - only the ugly, offensive comments from Ferry. He wanted this maximum impact. The NBA didn't.

[OldTimeHawk]

the point is this - the NBA has took a font and center stance on any percieved racism and gave Sterling a lifetime ban  for comments he made privately.  Yet the NBA tries to cover up sterotypical scouting reports because they know that reports like this are probably not the exception they are they norm.  They dont want their house of cards falling and give Sterling any ammo whatsoever to blast them in a potential lawsuit. You guys that accuse Ferry of Elitism kinda missed  the whole boat with whats  probably been going on for years going on behind the scenes.

[OldTimeHawk]

BTW, I have yet to see anything that has said the scout was a former Cavs scout.

[Guest]

Sigh - and with that I'm exiting stage left!

The season is starting, DF's fate now rests with the new majority owner.

 

Lol, I gave up earlier.  I think @Wretch did too.

 

Look on the bright side, now you can go run your pot business ...

[AHF]

BTW, I have yet to see anything that has said the scout was a former Cavs scout.

 

Try reading the actual scouting report.  It uses language attributing the remark to something like "the Cavs former _______ (blacked out)."  If you read the report, you know just by reading it that the source is a former Cavs employee or agent.  

 

Also, there is no way that comments like that are the norm in scouting reports for two reasons:

 

(1)  First and foremost, they are of no value whatsoever.  You think a lot of scouts are reporting on how much "African" a player has in him?  Get out of here.  That is worthless dribble.  (Which is why people question Ferry's judgment for selecting that excerpt from the report and repeating it.)

 

(2)  Second, they are offensive on their face.  No one survives long in a league with a majority of black players by putting anti-black statements in their scouting reports.  The potential for this type of career destruction exists with every comment like that.  

[GameTime]

Why would Ferry want to call out his protégé Chris Grant?

Chris Grant got dirt on him doggie.

 

[Diesel]

Why would Ferry want to call out his protégé Chris Grant?

Chris Grant got dirt on him doggie.

 

 

 

That's what I see also.  I don't necessarily think that this report or this part of the report was something that was made public to the NBA.  If your former protege worked in the same field and had inside information on somebody you were looking at, wouldn't you call him directly and ask about him?  Or wouldn't you email him directly and ask about his thoughts?  Ferry Hired Grant long ago.

I get the feeling that Ferry and Grant have had this conversation well before the conference call and probably because of the conversation, it was easy for him to rattle it off to the owners.

[OldTimeHawk]

yeah thats why the Sterlings of the world have been allowed to manifest their ideology in the NBA for how many years ?? its still by virtue of the black out  name  protecting  the original author of the scouting report - why ??  Doesnt matter , as has been said Ferry will be the GM until a new owner decides his fate.  Im thinking we are going to see more of this type stuff popping up .

[Guest]

I'd like to hear more about how the NBA let Sterling manifest his ideology.  Are you saying this mystery scouting report was part of a racist-themed, league-wide manifesto?  Is Ferry the patsy being set up to take the fall in furtherance of the league's hidden agendas?  Please tell us more ...

 

 

In all seriousness OldTime, I just think you're wrong here.