Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 11 minutes ago, Lurker said: They still lose the series even if Dwight Howard plays every wakin' moment of the 4th in every game. He is that freaking stinky. http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2017-nba-eastern-conference-first-round-hawks-vs-wizards.html#ATLadvanced::none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Howard actually had the best defensive rating of all the players with the exception of Malcolm Delaney 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just now, Peoriabird said: http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2017-nba-eastern-conference-first-round-hawks-vs-wizards.html#ATLadvanced::none And they still lose it if Dwight played 72 4th quarter minutes of the series. What's the point? He's that meaningless of a player today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just now, Peoriabird said: Howard actually had the best defensive rating of all the players with the exception of Malcolm Delaney Basketball reference stats are terrible compared to stats.nba.com. And you can't use stats with Dwight's defense anyway. Put him in a PNR and any ole' average guard is dropping 20-30+ on the team. Unless you have Avery f'ing Bradley or Danny Green. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 1 minute ago, Lurker said: And they still lose it if Dwight played 72 4th quarter minutes of the series. What's the point? He's that meaningless of a player today. So you are choosing to ignore that Howard had the best defensive rating on the team 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just now, Peoriabird said: So you are choosing to ignore that Howard had the best defensive rating on the team And I have said the stats need to be thrown in the trash when it comes to Dwight, it's a cool 20-30+ for any ole' above average guard against him when you put him in a PNR. If it's Dwight vs Muscala, of course I go Dwight, but my actual choice would be NEITHER and to put Millsap at center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 "Dwight Howard played much better defense than Mike Muscala in the playoffs". stats nba Dwight Howard defensive rating: 108.7 stats nba Mike Muscala defensive rating: 108.2 HMMMMMMM? #Agendas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Popular Post Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Popular Post Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just now, Lurker said: And I have said the stats need to be thrown in the trash when it comes to Dwight, it's a cool 20-30+ for any ole' above average guard against him when you put him in a PNR. If it's Dwight vs Muscala, of course I go Dwight, but my actual choice would be NEITHER and to put Millsap at center. So let me get this straight...You used stats to support your argument but the minute stats contradict your argument , they don't apply and have to be thrown out? Are you Kelly Ann Conway? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 1 minute ago, Lurker said: "Dwight Howard played much better defense than Mike Muscala in the playoffs". stats nba Dwight Howard defensive rating: 108.7 stats nba Mike Muscala defensive rating: 108.2 HMMMMMMM? #Agendas. Where are those stats from? I provided you with a link..Where is your link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said: Where are those stats from? I provided you with a link..Where is your link? stats.nba.com Does important stuff like ACTUALLY factor in the pick and roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 You have to look it up, but its there. What basketball reference gets wrong is it takes into factor your own man straight up and overrates efficiency, when as a big, your own man isn't your only worry and you can be efficient and still not good. It says Dwight was an average offensive player and average defender in the regular season. It goes to average and bad in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 4 minutes ago, Lurker said: You have to look it up, but its there. What basketball reference gets wrong is it takes into factor your own man straight up and overrates efficiency, when as a big, your own man isn't your only worry and you can be efficient and still not good. It says Dwight was an average offensive player and average defender in the regular season. It goes to average and bad in the playoffs. This is pretty straight forward Player USG% ORtg DRtg 6 Dwight Howard 15.1 105 102 9 Mike Muscala 11.8 98 109 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 1 minute ago, Peoriabird said: This is pretty straight forward Player USG% ORtg DRtg 6 Dwight Howard 15.1 105 102 9 Mike Muscala 11.8 98 109 And this is also pretty much straight forward: Dwight Howard: OFFRTG: 105.6 DEFRTG: 108.7 Mike Muscala: OFFRTG: 104.3 DEFRTG: 108.2 http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612737/players-advanced/ Like I said, basketball reference is absolute trash compared to stats.nba.com in how they calculate this. It overrates efficiency and just calculates straight up 1v1 defense. stats.nba.com is WAYYYYYY more accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 And again, this doesn't even matter. When asked, I'd say I'd rather have Dwight, but the real answer is NEITHER from me. Put a gun to my head and say you put Dwight, Muscala, or Millsap at C, and my answer is Millsap. But this debunks the idea that more Dwight would have changed the series. More Dwight would have not moved the needle at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 59 minutes ago, Lurker said: And this is also pretty much straight forward: Dwight Howard: OFFRTG: 105.6 DEFRTG: 108.7 Mike Muscala: OFFRTG: 104.3 DEFRTG: 108.2 http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612737/players-advanced/ Like I said, basketball reference is absolute trash compared to stats.nba.com in how they calculate this. It overrates efficiency and just calculates straight up 1v1 defense. stats.nba.com is WAYYYYYY more accurate. Your link is no good. According to your link, Baze was our best offensive player and Calderon was our best defender. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, Peoriabird said: Your link describes the season stats not the Playoff stats. I can never follow you. Can you read? Look at season type. It says: playoffs and is only six games. And it says that your guy stunk it up on defense. Edited May 29, 2017 by Lurker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 Just now, Lurker said: Can you read? Look at season type. It says: playoffs and is only six games. And it says that your guy stunk it up on defense. These stats make no sense..How can Muscala's offensive ratings be better than Dennis' rating? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 3 minutes ago, Peoriabird said: These stats make no sense..How can Muscala's offensive ratings be better than Dennis' rating? I....I got nothing there...but I would still not trust basketball reference for reasons I've stated. It overrates efficiency and I think only counts one on one straight up defense. stats.nba.com might go the opposite way....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Peoriabird Posted May 29, 2017 Premium Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 4 minutes ago, Lurker said: I....I got nothing there...but I would still not trust basketball reference for reasons I've stated. It overrates efficiency and I think only counts one on one straight up defense. stats.nba.com might go the opposite way....? According to this site, Muscala and Ilyasova were a better offensive player than Millsap and Dennis. And you trust this site? Bazemore was our best offensive player that played significant minutes according to this site too 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 29, 2017 Report Share Posted May 29, 2017 11 minutes ago, Peoriabird said: According to this site, Muscala and Ilyasova were a better offensive player than Millsap and Dennis. And you trust this site? Bazemore was our best offensive player that played significant minutes according to this site too I just trust it more than basketball reference because of what has been quoted on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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