Diesel's Top 5 Most overrated Teams.

[chillzatl]

don't meander around with a bunch of half cocked bs that they are overrated. You should have said "hey these guys got better but the lakers didn't really improve". Instead of wrapping that in an idiotic blanket statement that "the lakers are overrated". Because that's just a stupid statement to make. They might not be "the best" but they aren't overrated. They are STILL a top 2-3 team in the league. Whether diesel likes them or not. And until one of those upstart teams (clippers HAHA) proves otherwise, that's how it will continue to be.

[Diesel]

Actually, I agree with a lot of what you are saying....

But. This past yr, the Lakers were not better than Sac-Town... Lady Luck just smiled on them. It has nothing to do with Team. It has everything to do with Opportunity. Surely, you can not sit here and say that if Peja were healthy during that point of the playoffs that the Lakers would have still won? It took 7 games and overtime for the Lakers to win that series with Peja being hurt.

Also, I will give you this. Alderman made a huge coaching error. He kept Christie out there and left Jackson on the bench during game 7. That maybe was the major difference. However, all things being the same, I haven't seen that swagger out of the Lakers. The reason why they can't be mentioned with the Bulls is because the Bulls beat teams and Left no doubts. I have doubts.

I doubt if the Lakers of this yr could beat Sac-Town. I doubt if the Lakers of 3 yrs ago could beat Portland of 3 yrs ago with everyone playing and healthy. And Certainly, I doubt if either Laker championship team could beat the Utah Jazz in a 7 game set. You mention the 1996 Laker team. I agree. They were very talented. And their nemesis was the Utah Jazz. Not that the Jazz were a better team than the Lakers, The Jazz knew how to exploit Shaq. Since the Lakers have won their Championship, they have steered Clear of Utah. Lots of it was sheer luck. But Matchup Wise, I still have doubts as to weather Shaq will step out to gaurd the Pick and Roll. I still have doubts as to weather Fisher can effectively gaurd Stockton. I still have doubts to weather a Big Man like Ostertag can still use his weight to fustrate Shaq. We will never know. But to call this team one of the best teams in history is to overrate them because they are not that good.

[Diesel]

In reply to:

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Don't make yourself look like a fool by saying the 3 time champs are overrated. I don't like them either. But i'm not going to make myself look like some blind idiot by saying they are overrated.

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Here again. this is what you said. It sounds like you are trying to validate your point that the Lakers are not overrated by saying that THEY WON 3 CHAMPIONSHIPS.

Am I right?

My point is... that guys like you use that 3 championship thing to OVERRATE the Lakers. Those 3 championship don't mean that we should automatically set up their hotel rooms for the Finals... GET IT. I then went in to further detail to point out that they were not the most talented team in the West Last yr. They won the West by Sheer LUCK and the team that they beat are coming back BETTER than they were Last yr. GET IT. Point being.. All these bandwagon riders who say Book the hotel room for the Lakers in the finals... HAVE OVERRATED them.

[chillzatl]

The lakers left doubts against New Jersey? Against Philly? Against the Pacers? I don't remember seeing those doubts. I remember seeing 3 teams get THEIR ASSES BEATEN CONVINCINGLY. I don't know where you were, maybe you weren't watching, as we know you sometimes don't.

Didn't the bulls get pushed to the limit in thier last playoffs against the Pacers? Didn't they then set to mauling the Jazz?? You draw parallels that contradict your own statements. Any team that wins three consecutive titles and does so with only two really good series that entire time, deserves to be considered one of the best. To deny that is dumb, even by your standards.

[chillzatl]

what else did I say there? I went on to say that MAYBE THEY AREN'T THE #1 TEAM, But they are still a top 2-3 team in the entire league. They cannot be overrated. I never said they were going to win this year. I didn't think they'd win last year either. BUT THEY DID. Typical diesel to ignore the meat of the post and focus on what he feels he can misconstrue to fit his arguement.

Before you go making your idiotic arguement posts, why don't you take the time to get your wording right and save us all a lot of time. It would also save you the time and embarassment of having to go back and re-explain "what you really meant" over and over again. I personally have only seen ARR booking the Lakers to the finals again this year. I think the Kings will beat them. But then again, I thought they'd do it last year too. Regardless of what excuses you dredge up to explain their victory away, they still won and that's what really matters.

[Diesel]

I said, I have doubts about them fairly beating a healthy PTL and Sac-town squad in their respective yrs.

In reply to:

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Didn't the bulls get pushed to the limit in thier last playoffs against the Pacers?

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Yeah, but it wasn't like the Bulls needed to have Reggie Miller disqualified for Looking at the refs? Have you ever seen that call made again? The Lakers where handed the WCF because Stern needed a new media cash cow. PTL (that small market team) abused the Lakers until their best player was tossed for a LOOK???

Honestly chillz. Be Honest here.

Do you think that the Lakers could have beaten the Blazers if Wallace had not gotten tossed in that game??

Do you think that the Lakers could have beaten Sac-Town if Peja had played and was healthy??

The bottom line is that in 2 championship Yrs I had doubts of weather the Lakers were the best team in the league. Although I didn't like the Bulls, I never had doubts about them.

Finally.

Even in the Philly yr. If Iverson were given the same liberties that Jordan was given (and Most stars are given) and the refs didn't allow Shaq to drop the should on Deke so Much... I think that the series would have gone to at least 6 games.

[Diesel]

You're a poor Admin.

I mean, you preach that we should respect one another... But at the same time, you call me idiot and all these other things UNPROVOKED?

What kind of example are you setting?

YOU don't practice what you preach.

NOW. ON to your post.

In reply to:

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I went on to say that MAYBE THEY AREN'T THE #1 TEAM, But they are still a top 2-3 team in the entire league.

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And I don't disagree with you. They might be #2 or 3. However, the media and most fans believe that the Lakers are the best team in the league and deserve a spot at the table of History.

That being the case, I said that even the Lakers ARE OVERRATED.

Again, Overrated doesn't mean that they are bad in any way. It means that there's more hype there than substance. The true substance as I have stated is that the Whole league has gotten Better and the Lakers have remained the same.

[chillzatl]

If peja had been healthy, yes, the kings should have won. They should have won regardless. But they didn't. The fact is in a 7 game series anyone can win, regardless of how talented they are.

I don't think the blazers would have won that series. The last 12 minutes of that game was so poorly managed, wallace wouldn't have made a difference. The one guy who got them the lead, was either on the bench or was not given the ball. That's poor coaching.

I also disagree with the conspiracy theory that the Lakers are somehow given the games. Wallace earned what he got. He's a jackass who pushed a ref that is KNOWN for having a short fuse himself, too far. I also agree that AI got screwed by the refs with Tyron Lue. But it wasn't just to give the lakers the games. The NBA would have made more money if that series had gone seven games than they did with the Lakers winning.

The point is simply that even though the lakers might not be the best team. They are not overrated. They are STILL one fo the top 2-3 teams in the entire league.

[chillzatl]

Most of the people on this board are adults. They know how to behave themselves. They don't need me to set an example for them. I think your statements are idiotic and I'm not afraid to say so. simple enough.

Now, ON to your statement. If that's what you meant, why didn't you say that in your original post? You never mentioned anything about "due to all the hype, they are overrated". no, you lumped them in with a bunch of other non-winning teams and called them overrated. That's asking to have your post ripped. The way you have no restated it, I can totally agree. They are overhyped. I can totally agree that if you consider the hype, they are "SOMEWHAT" overrated. But they are still they champs and still the team to beat and in that respect they aren't overrated at all. Until someone beats them, they are the #1 team in the league.

[Diesel]

Well, when in Rome do as the Romans Right??? So don't say nothing when you reap what you sow. I didn't make any comments about Chickenstanley unpatriotic views being trimmed... or BHD's prejudice views being placed on trial. However, when you set an example that "we are all adults so anything goes" or basically, however, you feel say it..... Don't be surprise to see what follows. Adults or no.

Back to the post.

Overrated talks about the perceptions of others.

Secondly, I lumped them in with other teams that are looked upon as successful.

Detroit, San Antonio, and Minn are all winning teams. They are all percieved to be very good. MY point is that Perception is not reality. For the Lakers, yes they win more than the others... But the definition of overrated has nothing to do with their winning. It has to do with their perception. When they are being hyped as one of the best teams in HISTORY???? My thought is that they are not really the best team of THIS Coming yr. Perception and Reality are not agreeing. Overrated.

[chillzatl]

Since you obviously never bothered to read anything I said before about "moderating" posts. I'll say it once more for you.

I will never moderate someones post because they say something critical of a team, player or user of this board. I did not delete chickenstanleys post and it was an accident that it was deleted, period. It was made in the off topic forums and it was fine there. Nobody EVER moderated one of BHD's posts. His posts weren't the ones in question. It was several threads being devoted to calling him a racist that were deleted. It has nothign to do with his views or beliefs. It had everythign to do with MY BOARD being cluttered up with stupid arguements that simply do not belong here.

If someone wants to call you an idiot, that's fine. If they want to call me an idiot, that's fine as well. As long as it's in the context of a legitimate discussion I could care less, as I'm sure you do. But if someone starts making posts and devoting entire threads to calling another user a name or harassing a user, then i'm going to do something.

[Diesel]

In reply to:

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If someone wants to call you an idiot, that's fine. If they want to call me an idiot, that's fine as well. As long as it's in the context of a legitimate discussion I could care less, as I'm sure you do.

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Really.

Here's the fundamental problem I have... If you disagree with me that's fine. But why do you have to revert to name calling? Is that the most you can come up with? This is aside from your ability to moderate. This is about Chillz the person. I was really disappointed in Chilz that you decided that because we were on different sides of a discussion and that we think differently that you felt it neccessary tp call names. But now, you say that calling names is fine. To me that's funny as hell. I mean, freedom of speech ya ya ya... BUt do you really mean that? Nobody wants to come to a messageboard, spend time carefully selecting their words in hopes of having intelligent conversation... Only to be called Names without provokation? Or maybe you do? We shall see?

[chillzatl]

I'll step up to the plate and say i'm sorry for my comments. That said, I have no problems when it happens during the course of a discussion. Would I prefer it if we were all civil, always got along and didn't disagree and were all here just to cheer on the Hawks, yes. Well, no, ok maybe! That could get boring! But hey, that's life. Sometimes we disagree and sometimes things get said. I guess I could have rephrased what I said to make it so that your comment was idiotic and not directed at you personally. We've all made our fair share of insults on this board (and the old squawk and AA boards) though, sometimes they are subtle and sometimes not. This was one just one of those NOT times. Again, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings :P

[Dukegotgame]

Yeah they will have Peja but Bibby will play nowhere near as well as he did... honestly the lakers didnt seem like they gave a crap... lol they played around till 3-1... oh i guess we have to win 3 in a row now.... how easy did they make it look?

[Diesel]

You mean that the Lucky Horry Series winning Shot was the Lakers making it look easy?

You mean the Lakers depending on a few Christie "Unforced" airballs to get them into overtime was the Lakers making it look easy?

Comeon Duke... Get a grip. Had Peja been healthy, that Series would have gone Sactown 4-1.

[Traceman]

That is not necessarily true. Had Peja been healthy, who knows how well he would have played or more importantly, how him playing would have affected the play of his teammates. Would Bibby have been as sensational as he was if he had not been looking to score more? Would Turkoglu and Jackson have played as well as they did? Maybe, but maybe not.

In addition, Shaq was nowhere near his normal self either. His toe limited what he was able to do on both ends of the floor. If he had been 100%, Peja wouldn't have made up for the difference anyway. Shaq is just too dominant.

[Diesel]

The lakers didn't beat sac-town (didn't come close to beating Sactown) when Peja and Webber were both healthy during the regular season.

Speculation? More like informed guess.

[ATLien_]

I have to agree with Diesel here in that the Lakers are overated. I agree to this because in the scheme of great NBA teams I don't find the lakers to be anywhere as good as the great teams. I think the lakers are very forutunate to have the two of the top players in a mediocre league.

It is no secret that the NBA is not real talented right now, and this mostly has to do with the talent being young and unexperienced. Hell our so called dream team got put out by Argentina. They can feed me all the crap about the lakers having this long win streak, but when your playing babes it doesn't impress me all that much.

[Traceman]

All Time great team YET but they are still a VERY good team and clearly the best one in the NBA for the last 3 years. The reason I say yet is that because if they win the NBA Title AGAIN, they would have to start getting some consideration for being one of the all time great teams. Four NBA Titles in a row would be incredible. That is a dynasty, no matter what the era.

Dream Team? Who EVER called that team a dream team? We didn't have the best American player at ANY position on the floor. Shaq, Duncan, T Mac, Kobe and J Kidd should be the starters for any Dream Team that the USA could put together.