Hawks vs Memphis

[DominiqueWilkins]

I hoped for the win, but we made the effort to fall just short, and now things will only get harder. We needed to win one of the home games.

Good Luck Hawks.

[Plainview1981]

Because of this team I've already lost most of my interest

in basketball again this season. I find myself watching

court TV even when games are on TV.

[MoonKnight]

along with the Iman. I agree with your thoughts on Lue. We really seemed to play poorly whenever he was on the floor. I will repeat what I posted earlier about JChill. If his ball skills (passing, shooting, basketball IQ, etc.) don't improve, then he has very little value to us because he is so behind the other players athletically. The Iman and I both though we would be better off starting Ivey or Salim with JJ in the backcourt then Lue. This is the first time I have watched Marvin play live and I am very impressed with jumper. His fundamentals on his J remind me of Mark Price. He always squares up with the basket and makes a good shot. I thought JSmoove played very well last night and showed more of last year's form. Zaza looked exhausted when he was shooting those fts but he is still a big upgrade over our 5s from last year. Good crowd and the cheerleaders have improved over last year's squad.

[NickJYD]

Exodus, I agree. Harrington was terrible. This game was not Zaza's fault. This game falls on the fact that Harrington and Childress are terrible right now.

[NickJYD]

Yeti, gotta disagree with you about Joe. Joe is being asked to do so much that there will be nights where he struggles shooting the ball. However, he gets doubled every time he gets the ball. He had 12 dimes and 3 turnovers last night. He set up his teammates. There were a number of assists he could have had that others didnt finish. He is the best player on our team, the most complete player, and he DID help us last night. We'd have been blown out if he didnt play.

[Diesel]

That's Bull...

The Hawks wouldn't have been in position to win the game if Harrington doesn't draw the charge on Gasol and he doesn't hit a big shot.

[Yeti]

NickJYD, I agree that Joe played fine - but this was the first time I saw a player worth $70million and two first round picks. I expected more. I liked the assists but to be honest I didn't realize he had 12 until later - he just did it quietly. But the point is if you consider what we gave up for him - the expectations should be much higher.

But you are right - it was just one game.

[exodus]

Quote:

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The Hawks wouldn't have been in position to win the game if Harrington doesn't draw the charge on Gasol and he doesn't hit a big shot.

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Harrington had just as many turnovers as field goals. He didn't get to the line once. If he doesn't play the Hawks win easily.

[Lascar78]

definitely. I really liked what I saw from Al early on this year but his ankle is hampering his game. Yes he had 2 nice plays in the clutch, but he was horrible overall in that game. horrible. Al is what he is. A decent player getting lots of stats on a bad team. No one is drooling at the prospect of getting him from us.

[NickJYD]

Yeti, to put things in perspective about the draft picks, name one player the Hawks have drafted in the last 10 years that is a better player than Joe.

[mudderfudder77]

Hell, you guys haven't had a good draft pick since Lenny Wilkens.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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Yeti, to put things in perspective about the draft picks, name one player the Hawks have drafted in the last 10 years that is a better player than Joe.

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(( clapping ))

I'm glad someone gets it. The trade for Joe will turn out to be the best thing the Hawks have done since acquiring Dikembe.

JJ got his assists quietly because I know that at least 5 of those assists came off of jumpers. 2 by Salim, 2 by Marvin, and one by Smoove. If JJ is going to play the "playmaker" postion, he'll have to be surrounded by guys that can knock down the medium range jumper. JJ just had a bad shooting game. But he kept his head in the game enough to contribute in many different ways. ( see the 6 rebounds, 12 assists, and 3 steals )

The only flaw in Joe's game right now, is that he's not going to the hole hard enough to consistently draw fouls. Guys like Kobe and AI live at the FT line. Even a guy like Dominque used to routinely have an 8 - 22 shooting game, but would go 9 - 11 from the FT line, and end up with 30 points.

So if JJ is going to go to the hole, he can't be tossing up those baby hooks and half lay-ups ( ala Magic Johnson ). He needs to go to the hole HARD, and make somebody foul him. That's the only thing his game is lacking at this point. Once he learns that, he's going to be a 22 - 25 ppg player EASILY.

The last shot JJ missed in the Memphis game, was one of those floating lay-ups that he CAN make, but that one just rimmed out.

Memphis gets the rebound and calls time out. Then Mike Miller takes that quick shot that ZaZa rebounds. ZaZa chokes at the FT line, and the rest is history.

[Yeti]

Marvin

I guess your point is that Atlanta has been so bad drafting that first round picks are not worth much. That's a valid point in the Babcock years. But I am hoping that Billy will not be so incompetent - there were some good picks in Memphis and Indiana, but I don't know how much of that was Billy.

But it's not worth arguing about. JJ played well, it's just that with all the hype I was expecting the next Dominique or Vince Carter. On Saturday, he was just a good player.

[mudderfudder77]

This is JJ's 5th season, and he has never averaged over 3 free throw attempts a game (this year he is averaging just over 4 through 6 games). I don't think its wise to think that he is going to turn into slasher/finisher - thats not his game. He's an excellent defender/shooter, but he's not going to be able to put up points the way a AI or Kobe or Tracy or Lebron, Gilbert, Dwayne do - all of those guys in that 25 point range average anywhere between 7 to 10 free throw attempts a game.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I totally disagree.

JJ hasn't averaged man FT attempts because he hasn't been asked to take the ball to the hole. One of the frustrations he had in Phoenix, was that he wanted to do a little more, and Phoenix just wanted him to be the sharpshooter/defender.

I'm not saying that JJ should become a slasher/finisher exclusively. I'm just saying that when he DOES slash, he needs to go hard to the hole, and not weak.

Until this team acquires a reliable PG to run the show, JJ will have to be able to go hard to the hole and get to the line. He has the skills to do it. He just needs to be looking for contact whenever he gets inside that lane. He got inside the lane quite a few times in the Memphis game. He just wasn't able to finish or draw a foul most of the time.

That's the one thing I like about ZaZa. When he does decide to take his man off the dribble, he goes hard. He gets to the line 7 times a game. JJ needs to up his FT attempts to at least that point.

[mudderfudder77]

What he should do, and what he is capable of and what he has done are all different things.

You're right - he should go strong to the basket, but he doesn't.

He never has. He has the physical skills, but some guys as great as they are just don't have that instinct to draw contact and get their shot off.

I'm just telling you what history has shown. Someone like Dwayne Wade or AI avg over 10 FTA a game - JJ hasn't even come close to that, his all time high is 9 FTA's - Wade's is 23!

[exodus]

I like JJ a lot even though I didn't like the trade.

He has very good ball handling and passing skills but he isn't a pg. The Hawks will never have a good fast break with him at the point.

Right now that are averaging about 5 fast break points a game, well below their opponents. And since the rebound differential is marginal it has to be the pg. They had many more break opportunities last year even though their centers didn't rebound.

The Hawks need a true pg even more than a big man I believe. A pg that can push the ball and break down the D in the half court will bring out the best in Marvin, Smith and JJ.