I think I'm finally starting to see BK's plan..

[AtLaS]

I definately don't agree with everything BK's done, but one thing he has done is accumulate a ton of young talented players. I mean look at our roster from top to bottom, they are all young and valuble players with potential. Obviously JJ, Marvin and Smoove will most likely never be traded. But our other players, Chill/Salim/Speedy/Zaza/Shelden/Lorenzen/Solomon, we just have a ton of depth right now. We could afford to lose like 3 of them in a trade and still have a ton of depth.

Look how Miami did it, they had all that young talent which obviously wouldn't have ever won it all, but they waited until making the playoffs (which is kind of how our team is looking this year), then they kept their best player and traded 3 players and a first for a great player (you know who it is) which put them over the edge. They could afford to lose those players because they were already a deep team.

Making the playoffs makes your young talent look so much better. I think if we make the playoffs or come close this year, we can afford to lose a bunch of youngun's for a great player. Like Chill, Salim and Zaza could bring in a great player. Great players are traded for less than equal value EVERY year (and most teams couldnt put together a better package), and I guarantee we have one of the best chances to land one. We will be one of the first teams contacted, as we were with AI this year.

If we make a trade like that we'd still have Speedy/JJ/Marvin/Smoove/top 15 player/Shelden/Wright, thats a contending team once Smoove and Marvin hit their potential. I think BK's just waiting for the right deal to come along..

[Packfill]

The Hawks are probably still a year or moreaway from making an "all in" type of trade like that.

Realistically, I think 2007-2008 is the year the Hawks need to be serious playoff contenders. Next season can be used to further develop the young guys.

[txsting]

I just made essentially the same post in another thread. I think you guys have it, spot on. We're building toward a big bang type of trade that's going to make or break us. It's an exciting time. The only thing I have different is this - I think we'll have to make the painful decision to part with either Marvin or Smoove. It'll hurt, but if it brings back the right piece (the BIG ONE), we can begin to contend.

[txsting]

To follow-on with my thought, I think the best time to trade a young player like Marvin or Smoove is not now, but once they've shown just enough to the rest of the league. Just enough so everyone knows they are legit, but still may have even more upside potential beyond that. If we have a good year, that time might be end of 06-07, or maybe not. Depends on how we do, and how Marvin and Smoove do.

The problem with Al's trade value is that he's a year or two beyond that point. He's already shown the league everything he's got, IMO, and so we can't get paid because there isn't much upside left for other teams to gamble on.

[KB21]

I think Marvin is the least likely of the two to be traded, because between the two, Marvin is the one that has true superstar ability. Josh will be a star, but he won't be one of the elite players in the league. Marvin has that type of ability.

[CBAreject]

That's why we need to play them at the 3/4 together as much as possible. We have to see if they can actually man those positions. If they can't do it defensively, they should still put up some nice stats, so we'll be able to trade one of them. I really want to see Smoove put up 16/8 and Marvin put up 15/7.

If the team can snag the 8th spot in the East, we'll be in a great position to make some moves with 10+ in cap space and at least 4 starting-caliber players on rookie contracts.

[KB21]

Despite what Bernie Mullin said on the radio, I would be willing to bet that Marvin and Josh will be on the court at the same time more than 50% of the time. Mike and Billy both have talked about using the line up of Joe, Josh, Marvin, Josh, and Shelden a good bit this year when they want to go semi-small ball.

[Guest Walter]

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I definately don't agree with everything BK's done, but one thing he has done is accumulate a ton of young talented players.

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A blind monkey could accumulate a "ton of young talent" with a 21, 6, 2, 17, 5 draft picks used, several more traded including next year's, traded stars and superstars like Rasheed and SAR, $30 mil in cap space and 4 years to do it in.

Problem? Not anyone can build a team in that time. BK can hardly build a shell of a team.

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But our other players, Chill/Salim/Speedy/Zaza/Shelden/Lorenzen/Solomon, we just have a ton of depth right now. We could afford to lose like 3 of them in a trade and still have a ton of depth.

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SW has very little trade value, certainly less than Roy or Foye so he blew it on that one if you want to consider value. Chill has some value as does ZaZa, but not that much and if JS and MW remain Sfs we're in DEEP trouble without a dominant center that can justify them both starting.

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Look how Miami did it, they had all that young talent which obviously wouldn't have ever won it all, but they waited until making the playoffs (which is kind of how our team is looking this year), then they kept their best player and traded 3 players and a first for a great player (you know who it is) which put them over the edge. They could afford to lose those players because they were already a deep team.

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There are 5 other teams out there with our amount of young talent and rarely does a Shq opportunity come along. This is not planning but blind luck.

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If we make a trade like that we'd still have Speedy/JJ/Marvin/Smoove/top 15 player/Shelden/Wright, thats a contending team once Smoove and Marvin hit their potential. I think BK's just waiting for the right deal to come along..

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So in essence you traded Chill for a superstar. Great move. If only I could think of that idea...Hmm, I've got a deal for a potential one now. Al/Chill for Bynum. Really, you are not getting a top 15 player for Chill/ZaZa. Back to the drawing board.

W

[AtLaS]

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SW has very little trade value, certainly less than Roy or Foye so he blew it on that one if you want to consider value. Chill has some value as does ZaZa, but not that much and if JS and MW remain Sfs we're in DEEP trouble without a dominant center that can justify them both starting.

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I didn't agree about the Shelden or Marvin picks (I wanted Felton 1st then Paul), but its funny that you say BK blew it on Shelden before he's even played an NBA game. Go ahead and bring up ur summer league and his being undersized stats. Truth is, let him play first. BTW what rookie is going to get traded RIGHT NOW. Foye and Roy probably have more value RIGHT NOW but what does that really matter? Whoever plays the best on the NBA floor will determine their trade value, not what they are/were PROJECTED to do in the NBA.

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There are 5 other teams out there with our amount of young talent and rarely does a Shq opportunity come along. This is not planning but blind luck.

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I NEVER said we'd get a Shaq, but we could DEFINATELY get a very good player for that package that could possibly put us over the edge, IF we do good this season. We could have got AI for Chill/#5. Not saying that would have been the best scenario but we could have.

You have to admit star players are traded for less than value EVERY year, I'm not just talking about Shaq. And unless they are getting a great player in return, they want young productive players with potential and/or draft picks. All I'm saying is that we have one of the best packages available, and enough depth that we can afford to do it.

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So in essence you traded Chill for a superstar. Great move. If only I could think of that idea...Hmm, I've got a deal for a potential one now. Al/Chill for Bynum. Really, you are not getting a top 15 player for Chill/ZaZa. Back to the drawing board.

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11/8 for a 22 year old Center is not bad at all, most teams see that as good, especially one making about 4 million a year. Chill is stuck behind too many ppl to put up his true numbers, but ppl recognize he was atop the best FG% this year and still put up more than 10 ppg. Plus Salim avgd 10 ppg, and could be a GREAT role player for a number of teams.

Plus that's not even necessarily the package that would happen, I was just making an example, gah I hate the way that on this site you have to FULLY explain EVERYTHING you say or it gets twisted and turned into things you never even brought up..

[Final_quest]

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I definately don't agree with everything BK's done, but one thing he has done is accumulate a ton of young talented players.

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A blind monkey could accumulate a "ton of young talent" with a 21, 6, 2, 17, 5 draft picks used, several more traded including next year's, traded stars and superstars like Rasheed and SAR, $30 mil in cap space and 4 years to do it in.

Problem? Not anyone can build a team in that time. BK can hardly build a shell of a team.

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He has been in talent acquisition mode and not team building mode. If Marvin were the first pick in his draft, we would've taken Bogut. Or if we had the 3rd or 4th pick we would've taken Deron or Paul.

This is the first year he deviated from talent acquisition in the draft, and it could bite him in the ass. Still this past summer has been our first attempt at team building. On paper it looks mediocre to be honest, but what Atlas points out is very true. We can package a great group of young cheap players for a star, and still keep a couple key guys to make it work.

I think the fact that our backups are on par or better than our starters from 2 years ago indicates that we have made considerable progress.

[Guest Walter]

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This is the first year he deviated from talent acquisition in the draft, and it could bite him in the ass. Still this past summer has been our first attempt at team building. On paper it looks mediocre to be honest, but what Atlas points out is very true. We can package a great group of young cheap players for a star, and still keep a couple key guys to make it work.

I think the fact that our backups are on par or better than our starters from 2 years ago indicates that we have made considerable progress.

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When the talent was close he chose to not consider position (MW over CP3 or any of the other franchise Pgs). When the talent wasn't close in favor of Roy, Foye, and even Gay he chose to consider not talent or position but presumed interior defense. When he isn't filling a need he gets it wrong and when he is he gets it wrong. How is this reassuring?

Anymore of this type progress and we'll at best be looking at 1st rd playoff exits.

W