Is there any doubt left on BK and Woody?

[tmac13]

There used to be one argument after another here on the Billy Knight and Woody issue..People flocked to defend BK's unexplainable draft choices and Woody's Larry Brown-like coaching ability..They defended BK's vision after he drafted Marvin over 2 all-star point guards. Some tried to compare Marvin to James Worthy..They said Marvin was the best player available and you couldn't pass on talent to draft for need. They said we needed Marvin even though we used our 3 previous 1st round choices on small forwards. Now 3 years in we all see who Marvin is. He is a slightly above average sf. No better no worse. People defended BK's Sheldon Williams choice because Roy would have been a duplication of JJ.. I guess the talent over need question was for some reason thrown out the door in that draft..People defended the JJ debacle, which in turn led to the ownership fight, because JJ was going to come here and play the point for us and be our superstar. Three years later we now see JJ is neither a point guard or a superstar. He is a nice scoring 2 guard and best suited as a 2nd or 3rd option on a good team. They defended BK for signing Speedy to a large contract for which the Hawks have nothing to show. Bk is a little like George Bush, turns out they have both been wrong on pretty much everything. How much longer can such a buffoon be allowed to run an NBA team?

[coachx]

[tmac13]

Unfortunately the horses ass is not dead, he is still our GM.

[coachx]

You would think if the horse is beaten long enough it would eventually die.

The monkey just looked cool....I have not noticed it before.

[Guest Walter]

Quote:

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Unfortunately the horses ass is not dead, he is still our GM.

---

A-[censored]-men!

People want to be Hawk fans without acknowledging that we are in a god-awful mess or that the same people that got us into this god awful mess are still somehow, wonder of all wonders, calling the shots.

Put simply, THE HAWKS WILL NEVER CONTEND WITH EITHER BK OR WOODY AS PART OF THE FRANCHISE! It will never happen. It may never happen with this current ownership group as well, but it definitely will NOT happen with either BK or Woody. No GM has a worse career won/loss record than BK and no GM has selected coaches with a worse won/loss record than BK. He simply can NOT get the job done. Historically he has high draft picks, but the majority of the time he royally f*cks them up (especially for us) and that is sadly the best case for him as GM. Otherwise, he's a [censored] to fans, hard as hell for other GMs to deal with, and simply too egotistical, close minded, incompetent, and ignorant to make the necessary, creative, bold moves to build a T-E-A-M with positions, skill sets, intangibles, along with athleticism (which I believe he also severely misjudged - obviously to some of us at the time - in the case of MW and SW as neither have such athleticism or translate it to the NBA basketball court).

We know that withOUT BK and Woody we can get close to if not in contention. It's happened in the past for some duration. We also know that we cannot get rid of ownership so easily. Thus, if we are to EVER have a chance at contention we must get rid of BK and Woody and hope that the ownership situation improves.

W

[exodus]

I am sure KB and sturt are fully supportive of BK no matter how many losses pile up. When the hawks were 2 games over .500 sturt popped his head in here claiming to be No-sturt-damus and praising BK's grand vision. According to him and his wife the hawks roster was mission accomplished. Needless to say i didn't respond to kindly.

sturts BK nuthugging

[Dejay]

You pretty much echoed my sentiments since the Chris Paul debacle. I have nothing else to add....

[Gray Mule]

The grand plan. The stubborn refusal to change.

Whatever the cause / reason for where we are now in the

standings proves, it just ain't working.

What to do? Ignore the problem and hope it goes away?

Hasn't worked so far, has it.

Do the owners think that everything is just fine the way

they are now? Surely not.

The all star break is here. We here rumors, completely

unfounded, of trades that "might" be in the works. There

is a clamor from fans for heads to roll.

Will anything happen? The Thrashers make moves. They

belong to the same owners, so we know it's possible for

things to happen. We have to wonder, what's holding

back any moves by the Hawks.

------------------------------------------------

[Guest Walter]

I'm so sorry I missed that post being so sick and all.

Was sturt wearing flight gear and where are he and KB when we really need them to boost our spirits with such consistently errant "positivity"?

W

[exodus]

Quote:

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I'm so sorry I missed that post being so sick and all.

Was sturt wearing flight gear and where are he and KB when we really need them to boost our spirits with such consistently errant "positivity"?

W

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I have a feeling sturt won't be posting the rest of the season unless the Hawks go on a major run. He knows what he's got coming.

KB has been clowned so many times he isn't even worth messing with any more.

[bumpyphish1]

My thoughts (from another post)....

I have become more pissed at BK lately because I am realizing how much more it is going to cost to re-sign Josh Smith in the offseason. Had we signed him before the season, it almost certainly wouldnt have taken a max contract and now it almost certainly will.

However, I still think Woody is problem #1 with this org. I also have respect for BK's scouting prowesses (despite what anyone says). Pau Gasol (when with Memphis), JJ, drafting Josh Smith were all moves most other GM's would not have made (or did not make) and they turned out gold. Although Shelden Williams literally may go down as the worst pick of the decade. No way to explain that one. Desperation to add size? Terrible.

I also tend to want to blame BK for our lack of making moves, but without really being an insider, there doesn't seem to be a way to guage how much of our stalemate is due to his hesitancy/inability and how much is due to the ownership FIASCO.

But like I said, Woody is enemy #1 in my opinion. I think that if we make the playoffs this season and we are able to round out our roster (again, it sucks not to know what is ASG's fault and what is BK's), then many of the BK complaints will fade - and understandably so, imo. The Shelden pick in unexplainable. I can tolerate everything else he has done - of course now, it is about what he hasn't (and needs to) done (do).

[DJlaysitup]

Well using my handy-dandy calculator I see that at the rate we are going currently we will end the season with around 35 wins and 47 losses. Say what you want about the weak EC, that ain't gonna get us anywhere. Then, once the season is over we have to hope that BK's "finished product" improves a ton in the off-season since our 1st round draft pick is going elsewhere.

Honestly, IMO, if we had decent ownership (meaning a really rich guy who thought of the Hawks as a sporting hobby), and a GM who didn't have loyalties/EGO involved with our current roster, I think we are about two, maybe three moves from being a really solid basketball team. Heck, I read the trade ideas here on HS all the time....maybe we could get a couple needs filled in one trade.

As it stands, BK's "plan" has pretty much come to fruition. We may improve in the second half of the season and better the 35-47 mark...but we are a long way from being contenders in the EC.

[Atlantaholic]

Wasn't his plan a 5 year plan?

I promise to God I have read him refer to it as such... Well, it's year 5 and we are just as bad as when he came in.

(We are on pace for the same amount of wins we had with JT, Reef, and Glen!!!)

If that isn't an EPIC FAIL I don't know what is.

[DJlaysitup]

Quote:

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Wasn't his plan a 5 year plan?

I promise to God I have read him refer to it as such... Well, it's year 5 and we are just as bad as when he came in.

(We are on pace for the same amount of wins we had with JT, Reef, and Glen!!!)

If that isn't an EPIC FAIL I don't know what is.

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Well I remember saying to my boss at lunch a few years back (who was also a basketball fan) that it's alot easier to tear something down than it is to build it back up. We both agreed that BK did his job ridding the Hawks of some bad contracts...but that we doubted he had the stuff to really put together a winner.

BK wasn't dumb though. If he had made flashy moves to try and make us a contender in a couple years and failed - he would have been canned by now. By going with a five year plan (which may be stretched out to a 6 or 7 year plan due to the excuses of injuries and such)...he will cash many more paychecks.

It's about money for GM's too.

[DJlaysitup]

P.S. - here's the genius of BK's plan. First (and Key) - you have to start at a REALLY low spot. First year of the rebuild - 13 wins - mission accomplished! Then you can't really help but move up from that laughingstock level. Walla - the Hawks get 26 wins the next year DOUBLING THEIR WIN TOTAL!! Jeez, is this guy a genius or what? Then there is a year with built in excuses - injuries - but the Hawks still improve to 30 wins! The owners love him.

Now here comes the hard part...moving into the playoffs and contention. Why? Because now he's got to beat out other teams' GMs and their plans...expectations start to become more realistic...and then the shingles start to come off the roof.

Add in a buddy who can't coach and you have what we have now.

[NJHAWK]

I cant answer this question until after the trade deadline. Also we just dont know what type of salary and trade restrictions these owners have BK under.

[Guest Walter]

Quote:

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Wasn't his plan a 5 year plan?

I promise to God I have read him refer to it as such... Well, it's year 5 and we are just as bad as when he came in.

(We are on pace for the same amount of wins we had with JT, Reef, and Glen!!!)

If that isn't an EPIC FAIL I don't know what is.

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a 2-3 year plan! That should make people feel even worse. If Memphis plans to do it in 2-3 years in the WC and BK can't even manage it in 5 in the EC...

W

[tmac13]

The Thrashers make moves and changes under the exact same ownership. It would be difficult to believe they handcuff the Hawks and let the Thrashers try to be competitive.