Jay's take on the Terry Offer

[Diesel]

Cmon man. The whole team hinges on the way the PG plays. JKidd never has a problem making those around him better. However, when you look at JT.... He doesn't make those around him better. Actually, I think he makes them worse.

Also, since you guys are so stat driven...

Big Dog...

2002 FG% = 46.7%, T.O = 2.6

2003 FG% = 43.2%, T.O. = 3.6

Shareef

2001 FG% = 47.2%, T.O = 2.9

2002 FG% = 46.1%, T.O = 3.2

Why is it that every scorer that plays with JT has his career high in FG% and T.Os?

The problem is that JT doesn't get the ball to the players in the right spot. If you want to say we have Chemistry problems... Alright. We have CHemistry problems. JT.

[Diesel]

This isn't car racing... This is basketball. You know the sport where the most valuable position on the floor is the PG. Where the PG is considered a floor general and if you don't have one that can make plays, your team is probably going to be in the dump.

NO JT run team has won 40 games.

In reply to:

---

You need a decent team to attract good players. Paying players their worth can't be your main goal. Or else you'll end up with a lineup full of cheap bums

---

Who is going to be attracted by JT? I mean, the whole league calls JT an undersized SG.... What player in search of a Championship wants a flawed PG. People are begging to play with JKidd. Who is begging to play with JT??

Now, let's add more meaning to your statement. IF you want to attract FAs, you need an organization that puts WINNING first. NOT One that's trying to keep the status quo. What do you think trading Big Dog for Cap Space says to the FA who is trying to win??

What did trading away a 20 ppg SF say to Reef? You have your answer.

[Diesel]

Let's see...

This year, Jason Kidd's team played Tony Parker's team in the finals. Both of those guys are Bonafide Point Guards. Along the way, Parker's team beat Marbury, Hudson's, and Fisher's teams. Along the way, Kidd's team beat Davis', Billups, and somebody else.

You say the league is changing?

Tell you what... When a Bonafide PG or a Dominant C cannot compete effectively for the championship... Give me a call.

[Diesel]

Exactly.

[swolehawk2]

What the [censored]...how are you gonna blame JT for Dog and Reefs problems....Reef had TO because he played half the year in the highpost...if you had watched some games you would have seen Reef standing at the free throw line and trying to dribble drive to get a shot off...that is coaching.. not JT's problem....and as far as Dog....I saw him try to crossover twice in one game and fall flat on his face both times...the MF can't dribble...period...he is a human TO...I used to get a little sick on the stomach when Dog began to dribble....almost was always a turnover.

[Diesel]

The more important question is why are these guys trying to dribble in the first place?

Grob has spent a career building up that he is a Spot up Shooter with a strong midrange game. I asked over and over again, why is Jason Terry defering the ball to Grob OUT of Position.

You've watched the games. Let's remember together. JT comes across halfcourt. JT throws the ball to Grob on the perimeter... Or JT throws the ball to Reef on the wing near the perimeter. Do you know the problem? This is not their spots. This is simply a repeat of what JT did as PG when we had Toni here.... When we had JJ here... and We we had JR Rider here. JT would defer the ball and go and setup for his outside shot.

Tell me swole, where is the running the offense? Where is the play calling... Please don't refer to those 2 fingers JT puts up every other time down the court. I have video tape and I watch what happens as he puts those two fingers up... and every time.... NOTHING. I think he's just immulating Isiah Thomas. Try it. Tape a Hawks game... Watch what happens when he puts up those two fingers.

It's pitiful. 4 years and JT only knows 1 maybe 2 plays. The pick and roll that he learned with Lo and maybe some other form of a two man game. And he might run that play 3 times in agame.

JT is just playing one on one ball out there. He doesn't make those around him better. He's better suited to play OG if we had a PG like Derrick Anderson or Brent Barry... But he can not run an offense. We've been through three coaches now... They all have come to that conclusion.. Otherwise why are we still trying to draft guys to come in to RUN the offense?

It's pitiful.

[Diesel]

Check out Marbury in Minn.

[Diesel]

Wow...

With all this transition Ball and no need for a Pure guard... It's funny to me that JT and Francis are sitting on the sidelines watching the playoffs and Jason kidd and Tony Parker are playing in the finals.

I don't believe in walk it up ball. I like the Magic Showtime era with the Lakers and I like Physical basketball shown by the Pistons. I think those are two of the best teams that Played... However, even then... Fast breaking, defensive teams... THE PG was still the floor general. The PG made everybody around him better.

What is it that these "Guards" are doing? They are on the highlight reels but which one has led his team to a championship game? Close?

I think it's smarter to move a guy like JT to SG and find a real PG... Ala Philly and Iverson. than it is to waste time trying to make JT into a PG....

[swolehawk2]

It is really obvious that you don't have any clue what you are talking about. You should be embarrassed by that last post. If JT calls a play while bringing the ball up...then throws it to Dog or Reef...it is obvious that whatever play he called starts with the person he gave up the rock to...believe it or not ...not all basketball plays are initiated with the PG. The problem is if he threw it to Dog he probably said the [censored] with the play I'm gonna shoot it...or dribble it off my foot. JT knows only 2 or 3 plays....that is just moronic...seems like you are just reaching here...and it is getting pitiful...

Think about this...oh wise one....if we could get somebody else who could create their own shot other that Reef...and no, pump faking 6 times and shooting a jump shot is not creating your own shot (Big Mistake...errr..Dog) then we wouldn't have to rely on JT to score so much...maybe he could focus on being a full time point guard....

I think you need to go back to the trade Theo...we can't count on him trades.

[Guest]

Francis are sitting on the sidelines watching the playoffs and Jason kidd and Tony Parker are playing in the finals.

"

Give us Duncan instead of Shareef and alot of teams will

be watching us.The nut riding Parker isn;t a very good

example.Without Duncan Parker would be an average

player at best.

Also,Kidd is a flat out better player than JT.It's kinda

stupid to use players in better situations and flat out

better players to try and say JT sucks at something.

Not that I think JT is a good PG...But it's kinda stupid

to compare him to Kidd is who is better in every paise

of the game and a PG he feeds off the double teams

of Duncan.Did you watch that playoff game two years

ago when Duncan was out because of his father?Parker

was flatout horrible in that game.

[KB21]

That's exactly right.

Dallas runs a lot of plays that has Nash bringing the ball up the left or right side and giving the ball off to Dirk on the left or right elbow with Finley in the post. Nash cuts off this and positions himself to receive a kick out pass, or he drives past Dirk to get the ball back.

[Diesel]

Hots,

before you go off jumping into conversations, it's best that you read what they are about.

This was not neccessarily about JT and Kidd. KB and somebody else is trying to suggest that the designation of PG and SG are not needed and that the League is doing better with "Guards" with no designation and that the other ideas are past...

However, I pointed out that this past finals featured 2 Pure PGs. Whatever their situation, they are there and Bibby, Francis, Marbury, JT, Davis, Hudson, and whoever else you want to try to designate as a "guard" was at home eating Popcorn.

Secondly, if you gave JT Duncan... He wouldn't take him anywhere. JT's bad defense, bad offense running, and Duncan's bad free throw shooting would have gotten them put out in the first round if they could make the playoffs.

[DJ_Money]

In reply to:

---

Secondly, if you gave JT Duncan... He wouldn't take him anywhere. JT's bad defense, bad offense running, and Duncan's bad free throw shooting would have gotten them put out in the first round if they could make the playoffs.

---

Great, so now JT is inferior to Tony Parker?

By this, I'm comprehending that Tony Parker had a bigger part to do with the Spurs winning the title than Duncan did. You and I both know that is [censored].

Jason Terry: 17.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 1.56 spg, 7.4 apg, 3.07 TO, 2.41 A/TO

Tony Parker: 15.5 ppg, 2.60 rpg, .87 spg, 5.3 apg, 2.41 TO, 2.19 A/TO

Parker is a model of inconsistency. People only remember the series when he ran circles around the aging GP. He's almost as overrated as Bibby is.

What's your argument here, D? You've got nothing to back up your case. You're trying to argue your opinion.

[jjjohns3]

How can you call the man dumb???? Have you ever met him face to face????? Do you know him personally???? Are you best-friends??????Who told you they had to "dumb down" the playbooks??? I would like to see you out on the court, learning playbooks & systems. Basketball is alot different when your not sitting on the couch drinkin a six-pack,gettin' fat. Doin' your little wanna be on the sideline,dreamin' I'm a coach,I wish I was a GM so I could get ridda him game. I'm saying that you cant judge the man like that because you don't know him like that. Basketball is more complicated than you think it is,no hard feelings though.And I've kinda learned to ignore Diesel now, he's ignorant, and you can't do anything about it. He calls JT a loser, but Miller is one of few PGs with FAR more career losses than JT. Miller didn't even win in college. Arenas is overpayed,BDiddy is OVERPAYED, Bibby is DEFINITELY OVERPAYED. JT is probably more deserving than Bibby for that big payday. Bibby showed up against the Lakers & became a star,if he went cold that series B.Jackson would be their starter now.

~Peace

[Guest]

Secondly, if you gave JT Duncan... He wouldn't take him anywhere. JT's bad defense, bad offense running, and Duncan's bad free throw shooting would have gotten them put out in the first round if they could make the playoffs."

He wouldnt be sat for Speedy Claxton.If Tony Parker is

so good....how come Speedy put his butt on the bench?

Your overrating Parker the same way you did Gilbert last

year.

JT would hit those outside jumpers that Tony Parker didn't

make.

How many good PG's does the east even have?lol

All the other teams were simply flawed.When was the

last time a pure PG won a title?

Shouldn't John Stockton have beaten the Bulls?Heck,

John was a pure PG and Ron Harper wasn't.Why didn't

Indiana beat Chicago with Mark Jackson as the PG?

Pure PG's are GONE.

Why didn't Andre lead the Clipps anywhere?He's supposed

to be a pure PG...Yet, he didn't make anybody better

when there was pressure on him to win in LA.

It's been a longtime since a top PG won it all.

Why did Parker look so bad againest the Sonics too years

ago the same game Duncan missed.Parker was stuck shooting jumper and SA was blownout badly.

Why did Jason Kidd win when he was in the Western

Conference?He won NOTHING.

[Guest]

I watch JT made bad passes instead of the common

sense plays.It's not to hard to realize that you don't

come down and hand the ball to Dog then go setup

for a shot.

EVERYBODY knows Dog isn't that type of SF.If the

common fan knows it.....shouldn't JT know it?

I call JT a dumb basketball player because he doesn't

appear to understand anything but how to get shots

up.

Why can't he run players properly?Why is the offense

so predictable?

[Guest]

Actually, Diesel has proven to be correct SEVERAL times.

He doesn't really realize that the true PG is almost gone...

And sometimes he overvalues the wrong guys...But he is correct in alot of things he says.

[mdawg]

If the deal is for a huge number, I don't think the Hawks should match. Terry is good, but he's not a franchise player. The Hawks need to rebuild, and to do that, you need cap room and lottery picks. I know next year will be bad, but it will be bad with Terry at that salary as well. I think it's time to bite the bullet and rebuild.

[Guest]

And rebuild????Rebuild with freakin what???We don't

have any young talent to rebuild with.

Maybe we'll wait and get 4 or 5 str8 years of lotto picks

then hope to put it all together...Doesn't sound like a

good plan to me.

[censored] roiting for 4 or 5 years trying to get lotto picks esp

when it doesn't look like much is out there in the next

few drafts.Is there even going to be lotto worthy picks

in the draft next year?

Rebuild my @ss.Want to rebuild???Make trades to get

extra picks.

[dj_me]

Yes, I see the league changing. And just because it's changing doesn't mean that a "bonafide PG or a dominant C" aren't still going to be the most choice products. Now, tell me this. How many "dominant C" are in the league right now? I can think of Shaq, um, ah... Duncan's a PF... so yeah, that makes Shaq.

But this is about JT. Out there in free agency land, do you see anyone that is of the quality of JT, they being a "bonafide PG"? No other names seem to be getting my attention. Sure, you could say JKidd, but he's taken. You could say GPayton, but he's taken. You could say AMiller, but he's taken. You could also say GArenas. No, wait, you wouldn't say Arenas because he isn't a "bonafide PG", he's a JT-type GUARD. Oh, and Arenas, HE'S TAKEN! Who then, oh wise one? Who could we possible get? Now remember, he has to be a "bonafide PG" and he needs to be of better quality than JT.

And please, don't try to make me laugh, because that's what I'm going to end up doing if you actually give me the names of any of the other PG available right now.

Furthermore, this offseason has been all about signing JT. We drafted a ball-handler in Diaw. We got ride of GRob to clear some cap space. Everyone and their mother knows that Atlanta wants to keep JT. Why would that be?

And don't make the excuse that we shouldn't have to compliment JT, because we do. He is what we are building around. That's the plan and this is how it works. You get a player that you want to build around, and then you build. Simple as that.