What happends if Smith only takes a 1 year deal...

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

We have no idea who ALL the teams with the money next year

Which is exactly why it would be such a huge risk to take a one year deal. If the teams with a lot of cap space don't need a 4 what is Smith going to do?

Plus next years free agent crop is supposed to be much stronger than this years.

What if he takes the one year QO and then gets hurt or has a poor season?

There is ZERO YES I MEAN ZERO chance that his agent would allow Smith to take the QO even in the unlikely event that Smith wanted to take it.

Right, I think the injury thing is the biggest concern. Unless he gets a ridiculous offer from us (like last summer), he'll take it. The Clippers will probably offers something worth signing for anyway.

By the way, you (Dawsons Creek) keep calling Smith our third best player. Obviously Joe is the first best player but who is the second best in your mind?

I would take Horford over Josh Smith any day of the week and twice on Sundays.

You might think that Al projects to be better down the road but I wouldn't base how we deal with Smith based on how good Al might be.

I take Al as he is now over Josh Smith.

Im taking a guy who can average a double double at the 5, but could be a better 4 (what?) who brings his game everynight and who has a better basketball iq. If I had to lose one its Smith.

Exodus that wasnt you that want Yi last year was it?

[exodus]

Quote:

---

Im taking a guy who can average a double double at the 5, but could be a better 4 (what?) who brings his game everynight and who has a better basketball iq. If I had to lose one its Smith.

I'll take the guy who scores 80% more against far better defenders, is 2nd in the league in blocks, can actually defend quality bigs and doesn't stand around with the ball on offense too scared to actually do anything.

[BusBoyIsBack]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Im taking a guy who can average a double double at the 5, but could be a better 4 (what?) who brings his game everynight and who has a better basketball iq. If I had to lose one its Smith.

I'll take the guy who scores 80% more against far better defenders, is 2nd in the league in blocks, can actually defend quality bigs and doesn't stand around with the ball on offense too scared to actually do anything.

Im taking both so we aren't left with Zaza Pachulia as our starter again

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Im taking a guy who can average a double double at the 5, but could be a better 4 (what?) who brings his game everynight and who has a better basketball iq. If I had to lose one its Smith.

I'll take the guy who scores 80% more against far better defenders, is 2nd in the league in blocks, can actually defend quality bigs and doesn't stand around with the ball on offense too scared to actually do anything.

Yeah you can have your bad on the ball defender, who turns the ball over trying to run point guard while hes shooting a lower percentage then AL because he cant figure out that he cant shoot over 31 percent from 3 after 4 years. Oh yeah he happends to cry alot too.

[hawkman]

We'll see about that next season. Every year Smith adds something new to his game. I get the feeling that he will be a much improved shooter come next season. Heck, he was much improved this season from the previous season. You have to keep in mind just how raw this kid was when he got here.

[exodus]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Im taking a guy who can average a double double at the 5, but could be a better 4 (what?) who brings his game everynight and who has a better basketball iq. If I had to lose one its Smith.

I'll take the guy who scores 80% more against far better defenders, is 2nd in the league in blocks, can actually defend quality bigs and doesn't stand around with the ball on offense too scared to actually do anything.

Yeah you can have your bad on the ball defender, who turns the ball over trying to run point guard while hes shooting a lower percentage then AL because he cant figure out that he cant shoot over 31 percent from 3 after 4 years. Oh yeah he happends to cry alot too.

Funny how the Hawks give up 7 fewer ppg when the bad on the ball defender is playing. It is also strange how KG shot 7% worse than his season average with Smith guarding him in the playoffs.

Another strange coincidence is that in the year before Al showed up only 2 power forwards in the NBA (who played at least 2 games against atlanta) scored 2 ppg or more over their season averages against the Hawks. This is doubly strange since the Hawks overall team defense was worse that season.

I wonder who was playing D at the 4 that season because it surely couldn't have been Smith since he is such a bad on the ball defender.

Al can't even beat guys like Big Z or Kendrick Perkins off the dribble. It isn't hard to shoot a high percentage when all your shots are either wide open shots or good looks underneath created by other players, like Smith.

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

We'll see about that next season. Every year Smith adds something new to his game. I get the feeling that he will be a much improved shooter come next season. Heck, he was much improved this season from the previous season. You have to keep in mind just how raw this kid was when he got here.

We will see what happends. But I hope we dont see the the same results of the post and midrange skills he put in with Olajuwon last summer (what a joke).

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Im taking a guy who can average a double double at the 5, but could be a better 4 (what?) who brings his game everynight and who has a better basketball iq. If I had to lose one its Smith.

I'll take the guy who scores 80% more against far better defenders, is 2nd in the league in blocks, can actually defend quality bigs and doesn't stand around with the ball on offense too scared to actually do anything.

Yeah you can have your bad on the ball defender, who turns the ball over trying to run point guard while hes shooting a lower percentage then AL because he cant figure out that he cant shoot over 31 percent from 3 after 4 years. Oh yeah he happends to cry alot too.

Funny how the Hawks give up 7 fewer ppg when the bad on the ball defender is playing. It is also strange how KG shot 7% worse than his season average with Smith guarding him in the playoffs.

Another strange coincidence is that in the year before Al showed up only 2 power forwards in the NBA (who played at least 2 games against atlanta) scored 2 ppg or more over their season averages against the Hawks. This is doubly strange since the Hawks overall team defense was worse that season.

I wonder who was playing D at the 4 that season because it surely couldn't have been Smith since he is such a bad on the ball defender.

Al can't even beat guys like Big Z or Kendrick Perkins off the dribble. It isn't hard to shoot a high percentage when all your shots are either wide open shots or good looks underneath created by other players, like Smith.

Does the 7 ppg they dont allow make up for the points he throws away on turnovers? Yeah it isnt hard to shoot 50 percent in the NBA. Even when you start all but 4 games last year. Get real. Thats called playing smart and not to mention having skills.

Exodus was that you that wanted Yi last year?

[exodus]

Quote:

---

Does the 7 ppg they dont allow make up for the points he throws away on turnovers? Yeah it isnt hard to shoot 50 percent in the NBA. Even when you start all but 4 games last year. Get real. Thats called playing smart and having a good basketball IQ not to mention having skills.

First of all Horford's turnover ratio is the same as Smiths. However Smith actually creates for other players. Horford doesn't and that is why Horford has more turnovers than assists.

It isn't hard to shoot 50% in the NBA when you score only 10 ppg and are being left wide open all the time.

Too bad Horford's skills don't include beating big slow stiffs off the dribble.

Quote:

---

Exodus was that you that wanted Yi last year?

No. You must be confusing me with Diesel and Walter. I thought yi would be a horrible pick and i think he is going to be a bust.

[crimedog]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

We'll see about that next season. Every year Smith adds something new to his game. I get the feeling that he will be a much improved shooter come next season. Heck, he was much improved this season from the previous season. You have to keep in mind just how raw this kid was when he got here.

We will see what happends. But I hope we dont see the the same results of the post and midrange skills he put in with Olajuwon last summer (what a joke).

Look dude, I don't mean to get in between you guys and your enlightening and productive argument. For the record I like Josh and Al a lot. Its obvious you have an agenda though.

Al had a great rookie season but it certainly wasn't a legendary rookie season where I'd be willing to let go of a player who anchored the D and scored almost twice as many points inside the paint+had twice as many FTs because I was sure Al would develop beyond that.

Just so you know, by the way, if you take all of Al's possessions as a ratio, a higher percentage of them turned into TOs than Josh's. Not because Al has "a low bball IQ", as you seem to attribute TOs to, but because for most of the season we were running without a legit pg and our other players tried to pick up the slack too much.

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Does the 7 ppg they dont allow make up for the points he throws away on turnovers? Yeah it isnt hard to shoot 50 percent in the NBA. Even when you start all but 4 games last year. Get real. Thats called playing smart and having a good basketball IQ not to mention having skills.

First of all Horford's turnover ratio is the same as Smiths. However Smith actually creates for other players. Horford doesn't and that is why Horford has more turnovers than assists.

It isn't hard to shoot 50% in the NBA when you score only 10 ppg and are being left wide open all the time.

Too bad Horford's skills don't include beating big slow stiffs off the dribble.

Quote:

---

Exodus was that you that wanted Yi last year?

No. You must be confusing me with Diesel and Walter. I thought yi would be a horrible pick and i think he is going to be a bust.

LOL. We wont ever agree Exodus (its all in good fun though). All I can see is 4 turnover avg vs Boston in the playoffs and his avg of 3 during the year for Smith. But yet shooting 50 percent in the nba while starting at center averaging double figure points (while boarding double digits) is EASY, especially for being the 4th or 5th offensive option on the floor. Or maybe AL gets all his points off missed Josh Smith outside shots.

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

We'll see about that next season. Every year Smith adds something new to his game. I get the feeling that he will be a much improved shooter come next season. Heck, he was much improved this season from the previous season. You have to keep in mind just how raw this kid was when he got here.

We will see what happends. But I hope we dont see the the same results of the post and midrange skills he put in with Olajuwon last summer (what a joke).

Look dude, I don't mean to get in between you guys and your enlightening and productive argument. For the record I like Josh and Al a lot. Its obvious you have an agenda though.

Al had a great rookie season but it certainly wasn't a legendary rookie season where I'd be willing to let go of a player who anchored the D and scored almost twice as many points inside the paint+had twice as many FTs because I was sure Al would develop beyond that.

Just so you know, by the way, if you take all of Al's possessions as a ratio, a higher percentage of them turned into TOs than Josh's. Not because Al has "a low bball IQ", as you seem to attribute TOs to, but because for most of the season we were running without a legit pg and our other players tried to pick up the slack too much.

I attribute low bball IQ to shooting under 31 percent from 3 point range for 4 years(omg another shot just went up) and thinking that you are Magic Johnson on the break as not being the sharpest tool in the shed.

My agenda is I like AL better then Josh. If you guys like Josh better thats ok

[exodus]

Quote:

---

But yet shooting 50 percent in the nba while starting at center averaging double figure points (while boarding double digits) is EASY,

Averaging 10 ppg shooting 50% while being constantly unguarded from 15 feet is much easier than averaging 18 shooting 46% while going up against the best interior defenders on the opposing teams.

It wasn't Horford who dropped 56 pts shooting 57% against the DPOY in games 3 & 4.

Horford is very turnover prone considering how little he actually does with the ball. For his first few weeks of the season he had more turnovers than field goals.

The reason Al is the 4th or 5th option on offense is because his offensive ability isn't as good as 4 or 5 other players.

[DawsonsCreek]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

But yet shooting 50 percent in the nba while starting at center averaging double figure points (while boarding double digits) is EASY,

Averaging 10 ppg shooting 50% while being constantly unguarded from 15 feet is much easier than averaging 18 shooting 46% while going up against the best interior defenders on the opposing teams.

It wasn't Horford who dropped 56 pts shooting 57% against the DPOY in games 3 & 4.

Horford is very turnover prone considering how little he actually does with the ball. For his first few weeks of the season he had more turnovers than field goals.

The reason Al is the 4th or 5th option on offense is because his offensive ability isn't as good as 4 or 5 other players.

It also wasn't Al who turned the ball over 15 times in the last 3 games against Boston or went 4 for 13, 3 for 8, or 3 for 11 either. With those kinda numbers maybe we should have reconsidered the 4th and 5th offensive options.

[HawkNJersey]

Damn good posts, EX.

This AL vs Smooth debate kills me. Folks ignoring reality and believing a wish.

[exodus]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

But yet shooting 50 percent in the nba while starting at center averaging double figure points (while boarding double digits) is EASY,

Averaging 10 ppg shooting 50% while being constantly unguarded from 15 feet is much easier than averaging 18 shooting 46% while going up against the best interior defenders on the opposing teams.

It wasn't Horford who dropped 56 pts shooting 57% against the DPOY in games 3 & 4.

Horford is very turnover prone considering how little he actually does with the ball. For his first few weeks of the season he had more turnovers than field goals.

The reason Al is the 4th or 5th option on offense is because his offensive ability isn't as good as 4 or 5 other players.

It also wasn't Al who turned the ball over 15 times in the last 3 games against Boston or went 4 for 13, 3 for 8, or 3 for 11 either. With those kinda numbers maybe we should have reconsidered the 4th and 5th offensive options.

Horford can't even beat Big Z off the dribble. How can he be anything other than the 4th or 5th option?

Put KG on Horford and Perkins on Smith and what happens? Smith abuses Perkins off the dribble while Horford gets maybe 6-7 ppg if he's lucky.

[Traceman]

ridicululous to say that you would keep Al over Smoove. In fact, I would bet that a SIGNIFICANT number of GMs in the league would take Al over Smoove RIGHT NOW. GM's value potential and while Smoove was more productive LAST year, Al was a FAR better rookie than Smoove was. It's not even close. Right now, Smoove is better than Durant too but I'll bet you that OKC wouldn't even THINK about trading Durant to us for Smoove.

It is okay to disagree but calling it RIDICULOUS is way off base in my opinion.

[crimedog]

Quote:

---

My agenda is I like AL better then Josh. If you guys like Josh better thats ok

I don't "like" either one better but it is a statistical fact that as of now Smith's contributions to the team are more significant.

As far as the TOs on the break, check out the splits before and after Bibby was here and after Bibby was here. Difference is that we didn't have a pg.

[jhay610]

Love both players, but there is no way Al makes the impact that Smooth does right now. Al MAY be better in several years, but there is no way that Al is a better basketball player today than Smooth.

Most of Al's points are when he goes straight up off a dumpoff from someone who created for him, or a 15 foot wide open jump shot. Although Smooth can be frustrating to watch sometimes, most of his offense he creates for himself. Plus, he is the best fast-break and weak-side help eraser that the league has seen in a long time.

No amount of statistical analysis is needed in this argument (though the stats heavily favor Smoove), just a good basketball eye.

[crimedog]

Quote:

---

ridicululous to say that you would keep Al over Smoove. In fact, I would bet that a SIGNIFICANT number of GMs in the league would take Al over Smoove RIGHT NOW. GM's value potential and while Smoove was more productive LAST year, Al was a FAR better rookie than Smoove was. It's not even close. Right now, Smoove is better than Durant too but I'll bet you that OKC wouldn't even THINK about trading Durant to us for Smoove.

It is okay to disagree but calling it RIDICULOUS is way off base in my opinion.

I said it was ridiculous to imply that Smith is expendable because we have Al. As far as a "far better rookie", well there is certainly the age difference but I'd advise you to look at your stats; Smith scored at a higher rate and was already getting more FTs, he had fewer boards obviously but twice as many blocks, more assists and the same amount of TOs.

Saying "far better" is a bit hyperbolic when Smith actually had a better PER...

Again, to say Al will be better in the future is fair but to say he is better now is wrong.