The question is...

[laved11]

The big question for the Hawks and Hawks fans is what can you fetch for Josh Smith and what exactly do you want back here in Atlanta?

Personally, I think the longer he is with Mike Woodson and getting dogged by national analyst Kenny Smith, Barkley, etc., Josh Smith is loosing value. To me, Hasheem Thabeet could be the target for the Hawks and the Clippers. I'd want them to trade Smith for either the Clippers pick to draft Thabeet or Chris Kaman, who still has three years left to be our starting center.

Thoughts....

[Diesel]

The big question for the Hawks and Hawks fans is what can you fetch for Josh Smith and what exactly do you want back here in Atlanta?

Personally, I think the longer he is with Mike Woodson and getting dogged by national analyst Kenny Smith, Barkley, etc., Josh Smith is loosing value. To me, Hasheem Thabeet could be the target for the Hawks and the Clippers. I'd want them to trade Smith for either the Clippers pick to draft Thabeet or Chris Kaman, who still has three years left to be our starting center.

Thoughts....

I think you make a good point about trying to target a value big out of the draft.

One thing that we're all going to have to wrap our head around is that if we were to get a big weather it's Hawes, Noah, Aldridge, or Thabeet or even Shaq... somebody between Smoove and Horf is going to have to sit.

While Smoove is definitely the most explosive player, he is also the least basketball knowledgable and the least patient player we have. THough the GoadFather seems mature, that doesn't help his game. He has to establish some kind of goto move. We have nobody who can score the basketball. Josh worked hard for his points, but I want to have a big who can do it.

[laved11]

I think you make a good point about trying to target a value big out of the draft.

One thing that we're all going to have to wrap our head around is that if we were to get a big weather it's Hawes, Noah, Aldridge, or Thabeet or even Shaq... somebody between Smoove and Horf is going to have to sit.

While Smoove is definitely the most explosive player, he is also the least basketball knowledgable and the least patient player we have. THough the GoadFather seems mature, that doesn't help his game. He has to establish some kind of goto move. We have nobody who can score the basketball. Josh worked hard for his points, but I want to have a big who can do it.

After aquiring a Kaman, Thabeet, Chandler, also Chris Wilcox is available... nonetheless, I think Horford needs to become the focal point in the post. I think he is a player you can throw it into to get 17 to 20 points a game and that will help free up Joe Johnson and possibly Bibby if he comes back. The center we aquire should be able to protect the paint, rebound and defend the best big inside.

[HawksFan87]

blah blah blah, smoove isn't going anywhere.. when you people realize that you will be able to sleep better lol.. now , Al will NEVER score 20 points a game, he didn't do it in college. HE sure as hell won't do it against players better than him in this league...

[AtLaS]

I think Horford needs to become the focal point in the post. I think he is a player you can throw it into to get 17 to 20 points a game

Which Horford have you been watching?

Smith isn't coached at all and is still a productive offensive player. I just can't get rid of a player with so much potential for an average center like Kaman. If Smith is traded for a clear upgrade, then yes, I'll deal him.

People always want to bash Smith for taking jumpers, but most of the time, that's the best option. It's either Smith take an open jumper or JJ/Flip go ISO and take a very tough shot (and also shoot low percentage), or post up with Zaza/Horford which never works.

[Plastic Man]

Which Horford have you been watching?

Smith isn't coached at all and is still a productive offensive player. I just can't get rid of a player with so much potential for an average center like Kaman. If Smith is traded for a clear upgrade, then yes, I'll deal him.

People always want to bash Smith for taking jumpers, but most of the time, that's the best option. It's either Smith take an open jumper or JJ/Flip go ISO and take a very tough shot (and also shoot low percentage), or post up with Zaza/Horford which never works.

i'm not ready to trade Smoove either...but i gotta stick up for Horford. he just doesn't get many touches being the last option in our "one-on-one" offense. when we run, he runs the floor great and plays well. granted he needs some work in the halfcourt but still, he is capable of scoring more than what we've seen.

[DrReality]

It's been said before, but it seems futile to make trades when we still have Woody. Depressing.

[hawkman]

i'm not ready to trade Smoove either...but i gotta stick up for Horford. he just doesn't get many touches being the last option in our "one-on-one" offense. when we run, he runs the floor great and plays well. granted he needs some work in the halfcourt but still, he is capable of scoring more than what we've seen.

We all know the answer, we're just avoiding it. Smoove is a very productive player for a guy who doesn't "get it" yet. He has the ability to be a 20 and 10 guy given the right guidance. Heck, if he continues to work on his jump shot, say 1000 shots per session, he'll be there next season. If we get a real deal center, the only answer is to move Horf and Smith down a spot which is a sore spot for those who have agendas around here.

[AtLaS]

We all know the answer, we're just avoiding it. Smoove is a very productive player for a guy who doesn't "get it" yet. He has the ability to be a 20 and 10 guy given the right guidance. Heck, if he continues to work on his jump shot, say 1000 shots per session, he'll be there next season. If we get a real deal center, the only answer is to move Horf and Smith down a spot which is a sore spot for those who have agendas around here.

Smith is SO effective inside that I just can't trade him because of taking jumpers, which wouldn't happen with a real coach anyway. He is unstoppable taking it to the hole, and that is tough to find. You don't deal pieces like that unless they have proven themselves unable of cooperating when provided good coaching. We haven't had anything close to that.

[hawkman]

Smith is SO effective inside that I just can't trade him because of taking jumpers, which wouldn't happen with a real coach anyway. He is unstoppable taking it to the hole, and that is tough to find. You don't deal pieces like that unless they have proven themselves unable of cooperating when provided good coaching. We haven't had anything close to that.

Yeah, we need to keep talent. Smoove pretty much was the only player who stepped "up" during the Playoffs. It was so obvious that ESPN and TNT started to focus on him as the "star" of this team despite the fact that JJ is the resident All Star on this team. The only reason there is any controversy regarding Smoove is because those idiots on TNT threw out some nonsense about JJ and Smoove being able to play together. I can't believe anybody who knows anything about the Hawks would actually bite on something like that unless they had an agenda to begin with. There's no issue between JJ and Smoove and they've played together for several seasons just fine. Now Woody and Smoove may be a different story.

[crimedog]

Yeah, we need to keep talent. Smoove pretty much was the only player who stepped "up" during the Playoffs.

Yeah, this might be telling. As annoying as Smith can be, he was the most effective player overall in the playoffs and when you consider how much he handicapped his own effectiveness... well its something to consider.

For those that say it is clear we need to get rid of Smith, why? Just curious, but do you think swapping Smith for an average-ish C will make us better? Go back and look at those playoffs. The issue wasn't that Smith couldn't be Lebron, the issue is that we were asking him to be Lebron.

Look at Cleveland. Does the mythical POST SCORER that everyone talks about allow us to beat Cleveland? No. Not at all. Does Chris Kaman keep up with Lebron on the 3/5 pick and roll 18 feet away from the hoop? Nope.

No, when people talk about us needing a shot-blocking, rebounding, post scoring C to win they are right in a lot of ways. Unfortunately they are thinking of Hakeem, not Sam Dalembert/Ty Chandler/Kaman/Thabeet/Hibbert/other stiff.

Oh, and Horford scoring 17-20 a game? In high school, I'd imagine he could... Not NCAA. Certainly not NBA.

Edited May 12, 2009 by crimedog

[laved11]

Yeah, this might be telling. As annoying as Smith can be, he was the most effective player overall in the playoffs and when you consider how much he handicapped his own effectiveness... well its something to consider.

For those that say it is clear we need to get rid of Smith, why? Just curious, but do you think swapping Smith for an average-ish C will make us better? Go back and look at those playoffs. The issue wasn't that Smith couldn't be Lebron, the issue is that we were asking him to be Lebron.

Look at Cleveland. Does the mythical POST SCORER that everyone talks about allow us to beat Cleveland? No. Not at all. Does Chris Kaman keep up with Lebron on the 3/5 pick and roll 18 feet away from the hoop? Nope.

No, when people talk about us needing a shot-blocking, rebounding, post scoring C to win they are right in a lot of ways. Unfortunately they are thinking of Hakeem, not Sam Dalembert/Ty Chandler/Kaman/Thabeet/Hibbert/other stiff.

Oh, and Horford scoring 17-20 a game? In high school, I'd imagine he could... Not NCAA. Certainly not NBA.

I will tell you how a center like Kaman will help. When Smith is productive, it is at the expense of the team. For 11 games, we all watched Miami and Cleveland leave Josh Smith open because his shot is so bad it creates an instant fast break. To be honest, I'm sick of hearing about his potential... you don't pay potential $10 million a year, you pay production.

Kaman gives you a big who can guard the post and help Horford rebound. What Kaman lacks in athleticism, he more than makes up with his basktball I.Q. and can hit the 15-the jumper. Trading Josh takes the horrible shots away from a glorified role player and gives them to Horford who has the heart and desire to be the best.

Now, I think all of this is moot if Woodson comes back because his basketball I.Q. and half-court offense is ridiculously lathargic. But the longer you keep Smith, the more his value will fall so you must trade him now before he becomes a 27-year-old inconsistent waste of talent.

Holla!