Premium Member mrhonline Posted August 11, 2009 Premium Member Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Unless you have some stats to prove that I'd have to disagree. I've seen enough of both to know that crawford is better. I've also seen enough stats that PROVE this. Now, Flip may be a better bargain, that is a legit argument, but to say he's better and even to say he can play back up PG is complete BS. I'm willing to buy the argument that Crawford is more inconsistent, but I think it's far easier to see that Crawford has more talent. A lot will fall on Woody's ability to manage Crawford's PT when he's struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benhillboy Posted August 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Maybe I'm crazy. I'm looking at the fact that Flip is used to playing well in the post-season and Glass-Craw is lucky to play a full losing reg. season. My bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f_town Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 (edited) Maybe I'm crazy. I'm looking at the fact that Flip is used to playing well in the post-season and Glass-Craw is lucky to play a full losing reg. season. My bad. When exactly was Flip a major part of our playoff series?...i dont recall him doing much at all for the most part what the stats dont show is, Flip usually had to jack up a few bad shots and/or TO's to get his game going every night...he seldom came out on fire from the start So if Flip is here with reduced minutes, i wouldnt expect him to do a whole lot for us Go Hawks! Edited August 11, 2009 by f_town Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benhillboy Posted August 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 (edited) When exactly was Flip a major part of our playoff series?...i dont recall him doing much at all for the most part what the stats dont show is, Flip usually had to jack up a few bad shots and/or TO's to get his game going every night...he seldom came out on fire from the start So if Flip is here with reduced minutes, i wouldnt expect him to do a whole lot for us Go Hawks! I meant that Flip has gone to the playoffs for most of his career as a considerable contributor, which is infinitly more than you can say for Crawford, who has never been being a predominant starter. Numbers aside, Flip has a much better body build than Crawford, which is invaluable over an 82-game haul, something Ole 'Maal aint too good at. He has never impressed me with a show of strength: his finishes are mostly great balance and control. When he goes down with a non-contact or simply weak-body injury and misses considerable time (and we still win), you heard it here first. Edited August 11, 2009 by benhillboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member mrhonline Posted August 11, 2009 Premium Member Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Flip has never had a playoff eFG% above 40% in his career, benhillboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 As many of us have said, Flip is nice, but he just doesn't fit anymore with the money he will command. Teague would never see the floor with Flip here. We have moved on from Flip and replaced him with a better player. I see that as two huge plusses in my book (Teague PT and a better player). He's not coming back nor should he. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccarver Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Just as a fan, without looking at %, money, pt, and roster spots available, I would love to have Flip back. I really enjoyed watching him help the Hawks last year. He is a grown man, and as long as pride doesn't get in his way, and get his feelings hurt, he could still help the Hawks with reduced minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted August 11, 2009 Admin Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Just as a fan, without looking at %, money, pt, and roster spots available, I would love to have Flip back. I really enjoyed watching him help the Hawks last year. He is a grown man, and as long as pride doesn't get in his way, and get his feelings hurt, he could still help the Hawks with reduced minutes. After the solid year he had, why would he come back for 10 minutes a game and less money (and essentially taking Teague's pt). It is in his best interest to sign with another team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swatguy Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 After the solid year he had, why would he come back for 10 minutes a game and less money (and essentially taking Teague's pt). It is in his best interest to sign with another team. Only if it is better money on a contender. More minutes in Minny is not better. More minutes and the same money in Charlotte is not better. It is a Long season and injuries happen. Need to commit to Flip with 3yr. 6 mil. and a player option after year 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted August 11, 2009 Admin Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Only if it is better money on a contender. More minutes in Minny is not better. More minutes and the same money in Charlotte is not better. It is a Long season and injuries happen. Need to commit to Flip with 3yr. 6 mil. and a player option after year 1. I think Flip wants to play not sit on the bench. We still have no backup big men. We are set at guard. We have to use our money for depth up front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traceman Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 I think Flip wants to play not sit on the bench. We still have no backup big men. We are set at guard. We have to use our money for depth up front. I disagree that we are set at guard. I think the jury is still out on whether or not Teague is ready to be counted on on a nightly basis. If he's not, we need someone in addition to Crawford who can play PG on the roster. Sometimes it takes time for a young player like Teague to realize his potential. We shouldn't put ourselves in a potentially vulnerable position by just penciling him for 20 min/night until he PROVES that he is ready for that responsibility. Acie was a higher draft pick, he was more mature, he had a rookie season under his belt and he STILL could not be counted on on a nightly basis last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted August 11, 2009 Admin Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 I disagree that we are set at guard. I think the jury is still out on whether or not Teague is ready to be counted on on a nightly basis. If he's not, we need someone in addition to Crawford who can play PG on the roster. Sometimes it takes time for a young player like Teague to realize his potential. We shouldn't put ourselves in a potentially vulnerable position by just penciling him for 20 min/night until he PROVES that he is ready for that responsibility. Acie was a higher draft pick, he was more mature, he had a rookie season under his belt and he STILL could not be counted on on a nightly basis last year. With limited money we have to focus on up front depth more then spending it on Flip. He is not a good pg either, he is a scorer. If Teague is not ready a three guard rotation of Bibby, Crawford and Joe is pretty good . All three can and have played both guard positions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaceCase Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 I disagree that we are set at guard. I think the jury is still out on whether or not Teague is ready to be counted on on a nightly basis. If he's not, we need someone in addition to Crawford who can play PG on the roster. Sometimes it takes time for a young player like Teague to realize his potential. We shouldn't put ourselves in a potentially vulnerable position by just penciling him for 20 min/night until he PROVES that he is ready for that responsibility. Acie was a higher draft pick, he was more mature, he had a rookie season under his belt and he STILL could not be counted on on a nightly basis last year. Well I do believe that we are set at guard and if we add another it certainly wouldn't be someone of Flip's skill set. Keep in mind that in terms of the SG position we have Joe-Craw-Mo-Mario as depth there then at PG we have Bibby-Craw-and Teague. The only place that we really have space for Flip is at PG and I feel that position can be more than adequately filled by a player that can average more assists than TOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swatguy Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 I disagree that we are set at guard. I think the jury is still out on whether or not Teague is ready to be counted on on a nightly basis. If he's not, we need someone in addition to Crawford who can play PG on the roster. Sometimes it takes time for a young player like Teague to realize his potential. We shouldn't put ourselves in a potentially vulnerable position by just penciling him for 20 min/night until he PROVES that he is ready for that responsibility. Acie was a higher draft pick, he was more mature, he had a rookie season under his belt and he STILL could not be counted on on a nightly basis last year. You're right, Flip is more than ready to produce, Right Now. Getting Flip does not keep from getting a BU Big. I suspect the Hawks will roll with Randy, Silar, Othello and what ever other can be signed. I expect also for the roster to be 14 rather than 15, leaving the 15 slot open for a January/February Big pickup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swatguy Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Well I do believe that we are set at guard and if we add another it certainly wouldn't be someone of Flip's skill set. Keep in mind that in terms of the SG position we have Joe-Craw-Mo-Mario as depth there then at PG we have Bibby-Craw-and Teague. The only place that we really have space for Flip is at PG and I feel that position can be more than adequately filled by a player that can average more assists than TOs. Skill set?? Flip is better than Mo, light years better than 'Rio and i suspect much better than Teague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaceCase Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Skill set?? Flip is better than Mo, light years better than 'Rio and i suspect much better than Teague. What is he better at though and tell me if there are not one or two guys already ahead of him better than him at that. The word is skill set buddy not skills. I could have a team full of Ray Allens but what does that mean in terms of actually fielding a balanced winning team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted August 11, 2009 Admin Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 You're right, Flip is more than ready to produce, Right Now. Getting Flip does not keep from getting a BU Big. I suspect the Hawks will roll with Randy, Silar, Othello and what ever other can be signed. I expect also for the roster to be 14 rather than 15, leaving the 15 slot open for a January/February Big pickup. Why do we need another scoring guard who does not play good defense off the bench? Especially when we do not have any backup bigs and we have already have a high scoring non defensive guard already coming off the bench. Signing Flip and going with Silar and Othello just does not make sense. Flip for his own good needs to go to a place where he can get a lot of PT. Philly is the perfect destitnation for him. They have a hole at guard that needs to be filled. Here his minutes will go down a lot. Once we traded for Crawford...Flip became unnecessary. We don't need him and Crawford both coming in and jacking up shots. Actually if we sign another guard it would be better to have a distributor / defensive point guard like Brevin Knight. We need backup bigs. Good backup bigs (Silar and Othello don't cut it as they are not ready to contribute). We have Zaza and that is it. The focus needs to be on Joe Smith and not Flip. Flip did a great job for us last year. I wanted him back until we traded for Crawford. Now it is unneccesary as his role on the team has been filled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swatguy Posted August 11, 2009 Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 If Teague is not ready a three guard rotation of Bibby, Crawford and Joe is pretty good . All three can and have played both guard positions Let's see. Bibs, Jamal and Joe, 32 minutes each every game. I'd rather see 26, 32, 36. But Joe will have at least 10 minutes at the 3. that leaves 12 for a point. With Flip in the rotation it looks like: Bibs-24 Joe- 34 (10 at SF) Jamal-30 Flip-12 Teague-6 That looks good to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted August 11, 2009 Admin Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Skill set?? Flip is better than Mo, light years better than 'Rio and i suspect much better than Teague. He is easily a better scorer and probably a better player but Mo and Rio are MUCH better defenders. Mo can play backup sf for us too. Flip's role is to come in and score, mo was to come in and play d. Mo's role is still needed, Crawford will now provide the role provided by Flip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin capstone21 Posted August 11, 2009 Admin Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 Let's see. Bibs, Jamal and Joe, 32 minutes each every game. I'd rather see 26, 32, 36. But Joe will have at least 10 minutes at the 3. that leaves 12 for a point. With Flip in the rotation it looks like: Bibs-24 Joe- 34 (10 at SF) Jamal-30 Flip-12 Teague-6 That looks good to me. That is not going to work for Flip for one thing. After having such a solid year with solid minutes, why is he going to sign on to play 12 minutes a game with us when he can sign somewhere else for much bigger minutes and a much bigger role. Plus Bibby is going to play a lot more then 24 minutes. I am not saying Flip is not a good player. I loved what he did for us. He just does fit here anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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