Marvin will be headed to the bench..

[frankthetank966]

Marvin has shown us absolutely nothing these first three games as to why he doesnt deserve to be starting, but also how he got his extension. So far he is underachieving. He is not hustling, his defense is awful and he can't hit that 3pt shot he made so frequently last year. I really think we would do better having him come off the bench. He was a fantastic 6th man in college and he can be just as valuable to the Hawks.

I understand having Crawford come off the bench gives him the ability to create on his own and become and immediate offensive threat, but the bottom line is Jamal should be starting. (JJ should be playing the 3 spot) Having three solid shooters on the floor really spreads the wing.

Edited November 2, 2009 by frankthetank966

[EazyRoc]

This definitely was a very very disappointing effort by Marvin Williams. I'd say we wait until 10 games until we decide if he needs to go to the bench, though.

[frankthetank966]

This definitely was a very very disappointing effort by Marvin Williams. I'd say we wait until 10 games until we decide if he needs to go to the bench, though.

He has been horrible this year. He is missing layups cant hit a mid-range jumper I dont know whats going on but cant say im surprised.

[thefloydian]

This forum's not big enough for all the experts.

[jy23]

This forum's not big enough for all the experts.

?????????

[jy23]

Anyway....Marvin has absolutely been HORRIBLE so far this year. I don't think he should be starting but I also don't see a better option that would help the team overall. The season is early and he has plenty of time to turn it around but at some point we have to start talking about either tweeking the lineup to see what else is going to work for us.

[MaceCase]

A move would make sense until you witnessed that 4th quarter where Teague was hot and JJ and Jamal came in. Ball get's in Jamal's hands....dies. Ball gets in JJ's hands.....dies. Teague became an afterthought and it's been clear through their limited time together that JJ and Jamal cannot coexist together on the court. Their game's are just too redundant.

[Sasquatch]

Anyway....Marvin has absolutely been HORRIBLE so far this year. I don't think he should be starting but I also don't see a better option that would help the team overall. The season is early and he has plenty of time to turn it around but at some point we have to start talking about either tweeking the lineup to see what else is going to work for us.

I see your point, but at least Stackhouse would play with pride. Anything you don't get from him it's because he ain't got it. I would not have a problem with him "starting" ie Royal Ivey, just to set a tone. Then whoever finishes finishes. But I am sick of Dozer.

[sillent]

I believe Marvin(23) is just a little shell shocked about all the talent around him and where he can contribute without disturbing chemistry. This affects his rhythm but once he learns to get in where he fits in (plus some) I think he'll be quite alright.

[coachx]

He has been horrible this year.

= 3 games

[jy23]

I believe Marvin(23) is just a little shell shocked about all the talent around him and where he can contribute without disturbing chemistry. This affects his rhythm but once he learns to get in where he fits in (plus some) I think he'll be quite alright.

I'm sorry but I'm quite sick of us trying our best to think of things to excuse the way he's playing. He's been bad....damn near horrible.....we get mad and jump on everybody else when they play bad so he's not getting a pass with me anymore. Marvin SO FAR doesn't belong out there in the starting lineup, no excuses, we've been playing 4 against 5 so far this year.

[HawksFan87]

Everyone has excuses for Marvin when he sucks, but let that be Al,Joe or Smoove having a bad game.. and they should be traded. too funny..

[coachx]

I'm sorry but I'm quite sick of us trying our best to think of things to excuse the way he's playing. He's been bad....damn near horrible.....we get mad and jump on everybody else when they play bad so he's not getting a pass with me anymore. Marvin SO FAR doesn't belong out there in the starting lineup, no excuses, we've been playing 4 against 5 so far this year.

The saying "perception is reality" has some merit.

However, your perception is not reality............in reality.................if ya' catch my drift.

Here is reality:

In our 2 wins Marvin was far from " bad......damn near horrble."

12 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 2 stpg, 1 bpg, 1.5 TOpg, .83 FT%, .40 FG%, .33 3pt%, 31.5 mpg, 6 FT attempts per game

Now I agree he was "bad.......and damn near horrible"........in the 24 minutes of playing time that he got last night vs. the Lakers but he played much better in the first 2 games..

[niremetal]

Funny. I seem to remember him playing close to shut-down defense each of the past two games. Why doesn't anyone ever compare his "horrible" offensive numbers up against those of Caron Butler (who Marvin outscored by 2-1) and Ron Artest (who scored 7 of his 12 points while Marvin was sitting).

It's amazing. I swear that people around here just fall asleep whenever the Hawks are on defense, and only wake up if someone gets a block or a steal.

[coachx]

Funny. I seem to remember him playing close to shut-down defense each of the past two games. Why doesn't anyone ever compare his "horrible" offensive numbers up against those of Caron Butler (who Marvin outscored by 2-1) and Ron Artest (who scored 7 of his 12 points while Marvin was sitting).

It's amazing. I swear that people around here just fall asleep whenever the Hawks are on defense, and only wake up if someone gets a block or a steal.

I, and others, have beaten the need for Marvin's defense, vs. SF (James, Carmelo, Artest, Butler, Pierce, Lewis, Turkelough, Marion, Durant, etc.) into the ground. Especially last year in the playoffs and during free agency when a vocal group did not want to resign Marvin.

But your right..............after a loss every one turns into Chicken Little.

This is not college football. A loss is not the end of our season.

[frankthetank966]

I see your point, but at least Stackhouse would play with pride. Anything you don't get from him it's because he ain't got it. I would not have a problem with him "starting" ie Royal Ivey, just to set a tone. Then whoever finishes finishes. But I am sick of Dozer.

I hate to say it but Stackhouse is not a reasonable replacement. He averaged about 10 pts in 20+ minutes and would take away a lot of shots from Bibby and JJ. Too be honest the only thing Marvin has going for him is that he generally does not force shots.

[Buzzard]

Everyone has excuses for Marvin when he sucks, but let that be Al,Joe or Smoove having a bad game.. and they should be traded. too funny..

So where is the trade Smoove thread for that great game he had last night? What you don't get or just refuse to see is there are about four or five dedicated and determined posters here whose primary concern is creating trading or benching Marvin post. It really is how they build there numbers here and its a big deal to them to build those numbers.

If Smoove, JJ, Bibby, or Horf had that kind of negative following they would be defended as well. Great examples were last seasons shooting slumps by JJ and Bibby. Took almost a month before the trade/bench Bibby or trade JJ threads came out in full force. With Marvin it only takes three games. Thats why I ignore the negative BS for all our players. As someone said here a long time ago, the word fan is a derivitive of the word fanantic; which in itself suggest irrational behavior and thought.

These same 4 or 5 posters all look like idiots at the end of the season every year when Marvins play always ends up improving. JJ had three bad seasons in Phoenix where his shooting % was .430 or lower....two average games and one bad one in Atlanta and Marvin has to go, don't you think that is a touch irrational?

Edited November 2, 2009 by Buzzard

[HawksFan87]

So where is the trade Smoove thread for that great game he had last night? What you don't get or just refuse to see is there are about four or five dedicated and determined posters here whose primary concern is creating trading or benching Marvin post. It really is how they build there numbers here and its a big deal to them to build those numbers.

If Smoove, JJ, Bibby, or Horf had that kind of negative following they would be defended as well. Great examples were last seasons shooting slumps by JJ and Bibby. Took almost a month before the trade/bench Bibby or trade JJ threads came out in full force. With Marvin it only takes three games. Thats why I ignore the negative BS for all our players. As someone said here a long time ago, the word fan is a derivitive of the word fanantic; which in itself suggest irrational behavior and thought.

These same 4 or 5 posters all look like idiots at the end of the season every year when Marvins play always ends up improving. JJ had three bad seasons in Phoenix where his shooting % was .430 or lower....two average games and one bad one in Atlanta and Marvin has to go, don't you think that is a touch irrational?

There are plenty of trade Smoove posts after games.. Face it Marvin has sucked so far and doesn't look like his game has improved at all..

[Buzzard]

There are plenty of trade Smoove posts after games.. Face it Marvin has sucked so far and doesn't look like his game has improved at all..

You say there is plenty of trade Smoove post after a bad game; I can't find one and he sure as hell did not have a good game last night. Three games is going to tell me about as much on Marvins improvement as the one game last night will tell me about Smooves. Which is my whole point; either you get it or you don't....

We don't need to bench Marvin after three bad games anymore than we need to bench Smoove after one. And Smoove may have two more bad games on this road trip; should we declare Smoove as sucking and needs to be benched or traded if that happens? I think not.

Its not like I would be against trading anyone on our team if we improve; I want to move up just like any other fan. But benching Horford, Smoove, Marvin, Bibby, or JJ is not an improvement, because they are better than anyone else we have that could come off the bench for them. Though I do think Crawford or Teague are not far off from being an improvement over Bibby; especially if he shows continued signs of wearing down as the season goes on.

Edited November 2, 2009 by Buzzard

[jhay610]

Why doesn't anyone ever compare his "horrible" offensive numbers up against those of Caron Butler (who Marvin outscored by 2-1)

Caron was injured and missed most of the game.