Hawks MANAGMENT Grabd your ***** and pull the offer

[Crank]

I agree they should set a deadline for everyone saying how its okay if Joe wants to think about having a chance to play with the other top free agents well then how come hes not campaigning for one of them to join him in ATL. ? Outside of lebron and wade who dont really want to play with Joe as much as they want to play with each other Josh or Al based packaged is probably enough to get any of those other free agents via a S & T. This type of situation imo says alot about why I was hesitant to bring Joe back . If he doesnt feel the team is good enough then dont just focus on the money use your leverage to fight for a better team .

The other guys just arent about the money the are about winning and they want to go to the situations that they can best win titles in no matter what . Joe wants his money and seems to be perfectly fine latching on to there coattails why would we want to max out someone who doesnt care enough about the franchise to fight for it ?

Joes money is on the table right now he should be be fighting for us trying to convince one of the other ones to join him in ATL and the ownership should be willing to make it happen if he could convince one of them.

[Swiftkick]

I agree they should set a deadline for everyone saying how its okay if Joe wants to think about having a chance to play with the other top free agents well then how come hes not campaigning for one of them to join him in ATL. ? Outside of lebron and wade who dont really want to play with Joe as much as they want to play with each other Josh or Al based packaged is probably enough to get any of those other free agents via a S & T. This type of situation imo says alot about why I was hesitant to bring Joe back . If he doesnt feel the team is good enough then dont just focus on the money use your leverage to fight for a better team .

The other guys just arent about the money the are about winning and they want to go to the situations that they can best win titles in no matter what . Joe wants his money and seems to be perfectly fine latching on to there coattails why would we want to max out someone who doesnt care enough about the franchise to fight for it ?

Joes money is on the table right now he should be be fighting for us trying to convince one of the other ones to join him in ATL and the ownership should be willing to make it happen if he could convince one of them.

excellent post

[Diesel]

+1. Tell him he has 24 hours to decide, then the offer comes off the table.

OK, let's say we do that, then we pull the offer... Then what?? Back to mediocrity??

You're worried about Money. You should be thinking about team. The money can be worked out. The team is not so easy. Joe is our biggest value piece and you want to tell him to take a walk??

Secondly, it's not that Joe doesn't want to be here. How many players in the league would kill to play beside Amare Stoudamire and Lebron James in the biggest city in the world for a coach that you know very well?? For Joe, it's worth 27 Million to get that shot at a championship. If that's what he decides to do bless him.. However, we still only have 7 million dollars to spend.

[Diesel]

How would it be stupid..we are offering him the MOST money ..He is familiar with the city and the team..He has made the playoffs/ we have pieces in place and lets not forget he was a choker in the playoffs last year for us that did squaaaaaaaaaaaaa docuhe for us yet we came to bat with a MAX contract offer for this player

If he wants to mull what he wants to do let him do it without a max contract offer on the table..Let him wait and see how everything plays out then when some of the free agents stay HOME

he comes running back to our max offer..Yea we come off like a real pu***y there..

Smarten up Hawks management..PULL THAT OFFER NOW

Choker in the playoffs? Please, did you see Joe step up in the first three games of the playoffs. It's not his fault that Woody was severely outcoached.

[JJFAN4LF]

OK, let's say we do that, then we pull the offer... Then what?? Back to mediocrity??

You're worried about Money. You should be thinking about team. The money can be worked out. The team is not so easy. Joe is our biggest value piece and you want to tell him to take a walk??

Secondly, it's not that Joe doesn't want to be here. How many players in the league would kill to play beside Amare Stoudamire and Lebron James in the biggest city in the world for a coach that you know very well?? For Joe, it's worth 27 Million to get that shot at a championship. If that's what he decides to do bless him.. However, we still only have 7 million dollars to spend.

+1. Totally agree with everything Diesel said here.

[oldorder]

I understand they cant sign yet ..I want a commitment.. I really dont want Joe back at all in the first place

The simple fact is he cannot commit to something that he doesnt have a full understanding of yet. He doesnt know what will happen in free agency to it is better to play his cards close to the chest and wait.

..but I also dont want to look like a fool of a franchise when say Lebron signs somewhere else and Joe wants to go there for 30 million less ..how would that look on our franchise that a player took 30 mil less just to go play with another player that has never WON a ring either

It does not make our franchise look any different if JJ take 30 million less to play with LeBron. Because a lot of other superstars are leaving their franchise for the chance to play with him. Hell, Wade has a ring and even he is thinking of joining Lebron in Chicago. That doesnt make me think that the Heat are a weak and incompetent organization, So why would others look down on us as weak if JJ goes and plays for someone else?

Simple..

Joe we have offered you 120 million..we would like a answer within a day ..If not it was good having you here we are going to look in another direction

either by trading for Paul or Melo..we should not be handy capped by a player that doesnt want to be here

Let Joe mull his options without a max contract on table

If we dont have a contract on the table then there is nothing for JJ to think about. He simply takes that as a franchise that is uninterested in him and go somewhere else. We put the Max out on the table to show interest. I simply dont understand why we have to have a commitment from JJ in the time of one day. Is our franchise that needy and insecure that we cant let our players talk to other teams? Do we not have confidence in our body of work over the past 3 years? And who says the JJ doesnt want to be here? Because he is thinking of going to other teams suddenly he is not interested in Atlanta anymore? A person doesnt have to angry at a franchises fan base or front office to leave, he just has to think his opportunities are better elsewhere.

[Diesel]

why do you think Hawks went right off the bat with the MAX OFFER? why not they just let Joe Johnson be courted by everyone in the NBA ...The Hawks put the offer on the table they are serious about keeping him just like Grizz did with Rudy Gay and you see how QUICK he accepted that .

Hawks now look like a soft organization that allows there own free agent to mull things over especially when we could GIVE HIM THE MOST MONEY ..if he was truly happy here or if he wanted to be back he would have signed.Im actually glad he hasnt signed now what we need to do is pull the offer back and then wait to see how free agency plays out

\

Kick, it's still Joe's choice. If we weren't sincere about Joe, we would not have made the offer. The bottom line, the only way we get good value out of this is by signing Joe. Either we sign and keep or we sign and trade but there's no win in us letting Joe walk because we want to grab our balls and look big. We will look like fools.

[Swiftkick]

OK, let's say we do that, then we pull the offer... Then what?? Back to mediocrity??

You're worried about Money. You should be thinking about team. The money can be worked out. The team is not so easy. Joe is our biggest value piece and you want to tell him to take a walk??

Secondly, it's not that Joe doesn't want to be here. How many players in the league would kill to play beside Amare Stoudamire and Lebron James in the biggest city in the world for a coach that you know very well?? For Joe, it's worth 27 Million to get that shot at a championship. If that's what he decides to do bless him.. However, we still only have 7 million dollars to spend.

Id rather go back to mediocrity then be strapped with a bad contract of Joe Johnson who is not a max player..just like Knicks were with Allan Houston

Joe is not our biggest value piece..He is a FA ..He can do whatever he wants..If he wants to work out a sign and trade so be it Im fine with that but I dont want him crawling back to this franchise when his ultimate plan was to go somewhere else..

Im also fine with letting Joe walk for nothing..pull the offer and let him see what else is out there ..There is a chance he can come back to use for less then max as well if lets say Lebron

goes back to Cle and Wade stays in Miami

so that would save us money as well

[Swiftkick]

\

Kick, it's still Joe's choice. If we weren't sincere about Joe, we would not have made the offer. The bottom line, the only way we get good value out of this is by signing Joe. Either we sign and keep or we sign and trade but there's no win in us letting Joe walk because we want to grab our balls and look big. We will look like fools.

what team is going to do a sign and trade for Joe Johnson at 120 million ?

have you heard anything..once we did that contract offer we are strapped with him or that offer..that is what im saying we offered him the max and he is still mulling what to do

when he should have said yes I would love to come back and I appreciate that big contract offer..Instead we get him mulling his options and weighing it out

so now HE IS IN CONTROL ..when we should have been in control or let another team set the stage..say a team would have offered him another contract we come in with a MAX

then work out sign and trade

[Diesel]

Id rather go back to mediocrity then be strapped with a bad contract of Joe Johnson who is not a max player..just like Knicks were with Allan Houston

Joe is not our biggest value piece..He is a FA ..He can do whatever he wants..If he wants to work out a sign and trade so be it Im fine with that but I dont want him crawling back to this franchise when his ultimate plan was to go somewhere else..

Im also fine with letting Joe walk for nothing..pull the offer and let him see what else is out there ..There is a chance he can come back to use for less then max as well if lets say Lebron

goes back to Cle and Wade stays in Miami

so that would save us money as well

You obviously are a young Hawks fan. Those of us who has spent some time as Hawks fans sat through the same thing twice. When we lost Nique... it was about Money. We went back to mediocrity until we could build a team with Smith, Mookie, and Deke. When we lost our big three, we floundered in mediocrity for years. We spent 10 years without a playoff visit until recently. I learned this from "going back to mediocrity": MEDIOCRITY SUCKS. I would rather just be a loser than to watch our players grow old, lose value, and the city lose interest in this team. Mediocrity is our to come out of. Mediocrity means late lottery guesses that don't always turn out good like Roshown McLeod and Alan Henderson. Nope, give me Joe and his big contract so then at least, I have something to trade and something that will draw free agents.

We Joe we have a shot at Chris Paul, Melo, and Shaq. Without Joe, nobody wants to be in Atlanta.

MEDIOCRITY SUCKS!

[Diesel]

what team is going to do a sign and trade for Joe Johnson at 120 million ?

have you heard anything..once we did that contract offer we are strapped with him or that offer..that is what im saying we offered him the max and he is still mulling what to do

when he should have said yes I would love to come back and I appreciate that big contract offer..Instead we get him mulling his options and weighing it out

so now HE IS IN CONTROL ..when we should have been in control or let another team set the stage..say a team would have offered him another contract we come in with a MAX

then work out sign and trade

The same teams that wants him now. Other teams that want to win are not as cheap as we seem to be. Let me give you a short list of who would want Joe: Denver, Dallas, Cleveland, NY, Chicago, NJ, LAC, LAL... There's more but it's an open market.

[Vol4ever]

These knee jerk reactions kill me. It has been two days since free agency started......two days! I'm sure Sund anfd the ASG isn't as impatient as you guys. Why the rush??? They can't actually sign until Tuesday anyway.

I can't blame him for possibly wanting to play with Amare and Lebron. Just chiill and be patient. None of the big nameshas made a decision yet. There is more at stake from their point of view. This is the biggestdecision of his life. "Pulling the offer" after two days would be stupid in more ways than one.

X2 good grief! I work in negotiations every day and he has the offer there and no reason to hurry on his part. He is just waiting for Lebron to make a move and then he will go ahead and sign a Hawks contract.

[Diesel]

Jesus ..............you offer this guy a max contract and he still hasnt made a decision..This guy doesnt want to be here .Its bad enough we made that offer for a player that is no where worth

that kind of money he is mulling that decision..God can our front office be any more dumb..PULL THE OFFER...and say see ya Joe we as fans respect that you guys tried to keep Joe we wont hold it against you ..Clear some room lets make a run for Melo or Paul

Now for the truth.

The truth is that you don't want Joe to make a decision. You don't want Joe to be a Hawk. What's the rush for Joe to make a decision? Is there some big name free agent that he's stopping us from signing? The answer is no. If you're just praying that Joe is not resigned then say that.. however, don't try to call this negotiations as if we have started the signing period.

[Swiftkick]

You obviously are a young Hawks fan. Those of us who has spent some time as Hawks fans sat through the same thing twice. When we lost Nique... it was about Money. We went back to mediocrity until we could build a team with Smith, Mookie, and Deke. When we lost our big three, we floundered in mediocrity for years. We spent 10 years without a playoff visit until recently. I learned this from "going back to mediocrity": MEDIOCRITY SUCKS. I would rather just be a loser than to watch our players grow old, lose value, and the city lose interest in this team. Mediocrity is our to come out of. Mediocrity means late lottery guesses that don't always turn out good like Roshown McLeod and Alan Henderson. Nope, give me Joe and his big contract so then at least, I have something to trade and something that will draw free agents.

We Joe we have a shot at Chris Paul, Melo, and Shaq. Without Joe, nobody wants to be in Atlanta.

MEDIOCRITY SUCKS!

been a Hawks fan for about 20 years or so ..so I wouldnt call that young fan..days of Nique, Plastic Man, Mookie Blaylock ..etcc can go on and on

I want a championship team..I dont care for team that makes 2nd round of playoffs but no legit shot at championship

Id rather build young core players and DRAFT smartly and maybe get into lottery and get lucky

then have the same team like this with no shot at winning a title and be satisfied making the playoffs and losing

[Diesel]

been a Hawks fan for about 20 years or so ..so I wouldnt call that young fan..days of Nique, Plastic Man, Mookie Blaylock ..etcc can go on and on

I want a championship team..I dont care for team that makes 2nd round of playoffs but no legit shot at championship

Id rather build young core players and DRAFT smartly and maybe get into lottery and get lucky

then have the same team like this with no shot at winning a title and be satisfied making the playoffs and losing

If being a Hawks fan for 20 years haven't taught you anything, it should have taught you that building from the lottery will not get you a championship. Just look back over the teams who have won championships. The only one that has build from the lottery and won a championship was San Antonio and that was the biggest robbery (Celtics, Pitino) of all time. However, over the last 10 years, we have had the #3 pick overall twice. We have had the #2 pick, the #5 and the #6 and 16 pick in the draft. With all those picks, we have gotten no further than the 2nd round of the playoffs. Our biggest breaks have come on the backs of players that we have traded for:

Joe Johnson, Bibby, and Jamal Crawford. Just think if we didn't have these guys where we would be?? You can't begin to appreciate the process but this is the process, it takes value and a saavy trade hand to win a championship. Look at the Lakers and Gasol. Look at the Celtics and Allen and Garnett, Look at the Pistons and Wallace, Wallace, and Billups...

In 20 years, you should be able to see the light a little better than thinking that giving up value is good?

Edited July 3, 2010 by Diesel

[sturt]

Swift, you're an emotional wreck. I hope your decision-making in the rest of your life isn't quite so premised on whether you feel in control or not. You've had multiple fans now try to talk some sense into you, but it's not getting through because you're blinded by this sense that, somehow, this is about feelings of rejection. There is no rational reason to pull the offer unless and until a different option surfaces... not likely, at least, until after 7/8. This is business. Plain and simple.

[Swiftkick]

If being a Hawks fan for 20 years haven't taught you anything, it should have taught you that building from the lottery will not get you a championship. Just look back over the teams who have won championships.

so guess that didnt work out for the Spurs getting Duncan..

Its also not a good look for the Thunder right now with there 3 Durant, Green, Westbrook..there future aint bright :rolleyes:

This team we have now is not going anywhere past the 2nd round so why continue to go on..DESTROY AND REBUILD THE FRANCHISE the right way

if you care about being relevant so be it..I CARE ABOUT SEEING THE HAWKS WIN A RING...

If the Hawks made better decisions drafting wise we would be in a much better place that is for sure then what we are in now

[Swiftkick]

Swift, you're an emotional wreck. I hope your decision-making in the rest of your life isn't quite so premised on whether you feel in control or not. You've had multiple fans now try to talk some sense into you, but it's not getting through because you're blinded by this sense that, somehow, this is about feelings of rejection. There is no rational reason to pull the offer unless and until a different option surfaces... not likely, at least, until after 7/8. This is business. Plain and simple.

I run a business so if I offered someone or something what I FEEL is above and beyond the value of that person or that object ..and now is mulling the options

I would reevaluate my business plan and without question pull back the offer. I feel I made a bold decision by putting myself out there with a more then generous offer..That person did not want to be here so I have to move on and go in another direction

I have been taught in business the person signing the check should always be in control not the other way around

[sturt]

I run a business so if I offered someone or something what I FEEL is above and beyond the value of that person or that object ..and now is mulling the options

I would reevaluate my business plan and without question pull back the offer. I feel I made a bold decision by putting myself out there with a more then generous offer..That person did not want to be here so I have to move on and go in another direction

I have been taught in business the person signing the check should always be in control not the other way around

If you think Sund isn't thinking of and actively exploring his non-Joe contingencies, I think you seriously underestimate the man's intelligence. Like Joe, I have no doubt he's looking at several what-ifs. Put yourself in Sund's shoes and realize that, just because Joe hasn't made a verbal commitment, that's not good reason to eliminate what you obviously evaluated originally to be your #1 option.

[99PROBL3MS]

Swift, you are certainly entitled to your opinion man. No one is trying to take that from you. I am just astonished at how many people want to pull an offer to Joe Johnson after TWO days of free agency. That is..........just wow.