Nene

[reeballin4]

If we could get a deal for Nene in free agency do yall think he would come to Atl or stay in Denver? We are "win-now" mode IMO and he could be the center that could upgrade our team. That would allow Smoove to play the 3 and Marvin to come off the bench as a combo forward. Hinrich would then be 3rd guard and I really want us to sign either Shannon Brown or James Jones to fill our 8/9 man rotation.

[capstone21]

He would be a great fit here. The only way would be a sign and trade to get him here but if we could I would do it for Smith and whatever.

[ATLFORLIFE]

The question is, does he find Atlanta an attractive place to play for?

[coachx]

OK, its time for some Basic Free Agency 101. I know capstone knows this already but we have a ton of newbies who don't really have a clue about free agent rules. Capstone is right in that the only way we can get him is through a sign and trade but I'm afraid the people he is responding to don't have a clue as to WHY capstone is right.

Teams over the salary cap cannot sign other teams free agents unless they use the MLE (about $5.8 mill per year) or a league minimum contract. Atlanta is well over the salary cap for those who did know that.

So to answer the thread.................No he will not be a Hawk b/c NeNe will get much more then $5.8 mill per year from the Nuggetts or a team who is under the salary cap.

Edited June 28, 2011 by coachx

[Dragitoff]

OK Basic free agency 101. I know capstone knows this already but we have a ton of newbies who don't really have a clue about free agent rules.

Teams over the salary cap not sign other teams free agents unless they use the MLE (about $5.8 mill per year) or a league minimum contract. Atlanta is well over the salary cap for those who did know that.

So to answer the thread.................No he will not be a Hawk b/c NeNe will get much more then $5.8 mill per year from the Nuggetts or a team who is under the salary cap.

Furthermore, you'd have to look at the teams that also have a need for a starting caliber center that can only afford the MLE and there are quite a few teams who are "closer" to championship level than us......

Miami

Boston

San Antonio

Lakers (if they deal Bynum)

Those are 4 off the top of my head that are better than Atlanta (record-wise) and could offer him the same thing we could (MLE).

[MaceCase]

Denver fans feel pretty confident he'll resign there, apparently his wife is a native Denvan (Denvite?) and they just popped out a kid or some fluff of that matter. Either way, new CBA or not the Hawks don't have the cash assets to get into a bid for him.

[Admin]

I'd LOVE to get Nene here but it's not likely happen unless there is a Smoove for Nene based trade.

We did alright the last time we got a FA center from Denver ...

[AHF]

I'd LOVE to get Nene here but it's not likely happen unless there is a Smoove for Nene based trade.

We did alright the last time we got a FA center from Denver ...

No offense to Nene, but Dikembe >>> Nene. Deke got double the rebounds that Nene does. Literally:

Dikembe Mutombo ATL 1999-00 - 1157 rebounds

Nene Hilario DEN 2009-10 - 627 rebounds

Nene Hilario DEN 2010-11 - 571 rebounds

[capstone21]

I don't think he was comparing Nene to Deke just that the last time we got a Denver Center we did well and could lightning strike twice with another Denver center (although unlikely since he probalby won't be coming here)?

[AHF]

I don't think he was comparing Nene to Deke just that the last time we got a Denver Center we did well and could lightning strike twice with another Denver center (although unlikely since he probalby won't be coming here)?

My point is that lightning struck last time because Deke was a big-time impact player. Nene is a nice piece but he isn't a Deke. To ride on the lightning metaphor, it would be like the difference between getting a jolt of static electricity and sticking your tongue in an electrical outlet. Both may give you a shock, but what a difference!

[lethalweapon3]

Assuming Horf survived a sign-and-trade deal for Nene, between the "Twin Mid-Rises," who gets to play the 5?

~lw3

[Admin]

My point is that lightning struck last time because Deke was a big-time impact player. Nene is a nice piece but he isn't a Deke. To ride on the lightning metaphor, it would be like the difference between getting a jolt of static electricity and sticking your tongue in an electrical outlet. Both may give you a shock, but what a difference!

Cap is absolutely correct I was not comparing them ... It would take adding D12 to make as much of an impact as Deke made but Nene could help us get to the next level.

Assuming Horf survived a sign-and-trade deal for Nene, between the "Twin Mid-Rises," who gets to play the 5?

~lw3

Nene would be the 5 without question as he's better at defending the rim and without looking at the stats I believe he's a better rebounder as well and Horford is a much better mid range shooter.

[Watchman]

Cap is absolutely correct I was not comparing them ... It would take adding D12 to make as much of an impact as Deke made but Nene could help us get to the next level.

Nene would be the 5 without question as he's better at defending the rim and without looking at the stats I believe he's a better rebounder as well and Horford is a much better mid range shooter.

Nah, Nene is not that great a rebounder. He typically averages 7 - 8 rebounds per game, but if we were to get him I would play him at the 5.

Edited June 28, 2011 by Watchman

[deke55]

I was watching NBATV earlier tonight and they were running down the top free agents(restricted and unrestricted)...Crawford was #6 by the way. Antonio Davis mentioned the Hawks and the Celtics as teams that Nene would benefit the most. But like everyone has mentioned, there is no way we could sign him outright without a sign n trade scenario. I would love Nene, he would be the next best answer after Dwight Howard for us, however we have to remember that Nene as well as he has played the last couple seasons, has been injury prone before that. Not saying that I would not want him, but it's something that has been a part of his past. Having said that, I think a good trade for both teams would be Smoove and a resigned Crawford for a resigned Nene and a resigned JR Smith. Denver has Mozgof from the Knicks trade, I mean I'm not sure if Denver would start him, but he did start some games for the Knicks this past season and they could shore up their PF with Smoove while we ran JJ, Horford, and Nene in our frontcourt with Hinrich, JR Smith in the backcourt and Teague coming off the pine.

C-Nene/Collins/Benson

pf-Horford/Zaza

sf-JJ/Marv

sg- JR Smith/Damien Wilkins

pg- Hinrich/Teague

I think that team is an upgrade to what we had this past season and would be even better in the playoffs...perhaps 3rd round of NBA finals...thoughts?

[Dragitoff]

I was watching NBATV earlier tonight and they were running down the top free agents(restricted and unrestricted)...Crawford was #6 by the way. Antonio Davis mentioned the Hawks and the Celtics as teams that Nene would benefit the most. But like everyone has mentioned, there is no way we could sign him outright without a sign n trade scenario. I would love Nene, he would be the next best answer after Dwight Howard for us, however we have to remember that Nene as well as he has played the last couple seasons, has been injury prone before that. Not saying that I would not want him, but it's something that has been a part of his past. Having said that, I think a good trade for both teams would be Smoove and a resigned Crawford for a resigned Nene and a resigned JR Smith. Denver has Mozgof from the Knicks trade, I mean I'm not sure if Denver would start him, but he did start some games for the Knicks this past season and they could shore up their PF with Smoove while we ran JJ, Horford, and Nene in our frontcourt with Hinrich, JR Smith in the backcourt and Teague coming off the pine.

C-Nene/Collins/Benson

pf-Horford/Zaza

sf-JJ/Marv

sg- JR Smith/Damien Wilkins

pg- Hinrich/Teague

I think that team is an upgrade to what we had this past season and would be even better in the playoffs...perhaps 3rd round of NBA finals...thoughts?

A couple of problems with your scenario. Double sign & trades are almost never done because of the complexity. Your proposed deal has 3 re-signed players involved. I'm no captologist, but I can imagine that would make it virtually impossible to complete. Even more importantly, you can't combine players that you're signing and trading with another player. Essentially you'd have to do 2 separate deals Nene (re-signed) for Smoove probably would work for both teams IF Denver feels Mozgov is their future center.

[coachx]

NeNe has actually never averaged over 7.8 rpg in his 9 year career.

6.9 rpg average for his career. ZaZa would rebound more then him given the minutes......gratned NeNe is the superior player.

I would not trade 25 year old Smoove for NeNe's years of 30-35 . NeNe wille be 30 when the season starts. His rebounding will dip from average to below average pretty soon.

Edited June 29, 2011 by coachx

[AHF]

NeNe has actually never averaged over 7.8 rpg in his 9 year career.

6.9 rpg average for his career. ZaZa would rebound more then him given the minutes......gratned NeNe is the superior player.

I would not trade 25 year old Smoove for NeNe's years of 30-35 . NeNe wille be 30 when the season starts. His rebounding will dip from average to below average pretty soon.

Exactly. Horford is a MUCH better rebounder than Nene.

Nene just looks like he should be able to rebound like a fiend. I have no idea what his problem is with his strong frame and reasonable athleticism but the guy is less than adequate on the boards.

Look at this list of rebounding for the last 5 seasons:

Basketball Reference

He ranks 46th in rpg behind luminaries like Josh Smith.

When you go to per minute rankings, it is much worse. He ranks 65th there behind Spencer Hawes, Kwame Brown, and others. He isn't so bad that he is worthless on the boards, it is just always hard for me to believe a guy like him can't average 8 rpg in 30+ minutes per game.

[Admin]

I had no idea he was that poor on the boards. I wonder if it's got something to do with the system in Denver? As a team they averaged almost 3 rpg more than the Hawks did last year with Nene being up there at the top with K-Mart and Carmelo (while he was there) all averaging about 6-7 each. They actually had 8 players who averaged more than 4.5 rpg while the Hawks only had 3, Josh and Al at the top and Marvin well below.

[AHF]

I had no idea he was that poor on the boards. I wonder if it's got something to do with the system in Denver?

I'm not certain but I doubt it.

In 2005-06, Camby averaged 11.9 rpg while playing with Reggie Evans, Kenyon Martin, Eduardo Najera, Carmelo Anthony and 2 others averaging > 4 rpg.

In 2006-07, Nene averaged 7.0 rpg to Marcus Camby's 11.0 rpg.

In 2007-08, Nene averaged 5.4 rpg while Marcus Camby was averaging 13.1 rpg for the Nuggets.

In 2008-09, with Camby gone Nene jumped up to a career high 7.8 rpg.

If Camby could put up 12 rpg in the same system, I don't know why Nene couldn't put up better numbers once Camby was gone. Camelo and Martin were on all those teams.

[Admin]

I'm not certain but I doubt it.

In 2005-06, Camby averaged 11.9 rpg while playing with Reggie Evans, Kenyon Martin, Eduardo Najera, Carmelo Anthony and 2 others averaging > 4 rpg.

In 2006-07, Nene averaged 7.0 rpg to Marcus Camby's 11.0 rpg.

In 2007-08, Nene averaged 5.4 rpg while Marcus Camby was averaging 13.1 rpg for the Nuggets.

In 2008-09, with Camby gone Nene jumped up to a career high 7.8 rpg.

If Camby could put up 12 rpg in the same system, I don't know why Nene couldn't put up better numbers once Camby was gone. Camelo and Martin were on all those teams.

I suspect that Nene is probably used differently than Camby was, although that's certainly not the only reason for the disparity as Camby is a far superior rebounder. The bottom line for me is that Nene would be adequate as a rebounder for us as long as we can plug someone into the SF spot who is a plus rebounder for the position.