Where is Hardaway?

[AHF]

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

uuuuhhhh....NO, not even close.  There were established players ahead of him in Millsap, Scott and Moose. 

The competition is between Holiday, Patterson and THJr.

The reason I bring it up is twofold.  One - I think it is the same.  Payne's competition was Scott and Moose with Sap as the starter.  THJr's competition is Holiday and Patterson with Korver as the starter.  The rationale is the same in both cases - there is too much talent ahead of you right now to give you minutes.

Two - in the case of Payne, I think that was true but a positive wrap on a deeper conclusion that "we don't think you have what it takes to cut it for the Hawks so we are dumping you for a future pick."  The fact that we are using the same rationale (too much competition ahead of him) makes me a little worried that it is likewise being used as a positive wrap for a guy they just don't think is truly capable.

At the end of the day, there is a big difference between concluding "Teague is in front of you Dennis so while we really believe in you and are committed to developing you we also have to recognize the minutes aren't going to be significant and steady until you get better" and "There is too much talent in front of  you Payne and we don't see enough upside in you to commit to give you minutes over our other deep rotation players so let's get rid of you now before we have another Jenkins on our hands."  

THJr. is in an unknown area right now because not enough time has passed but his usage looks a lot more like Payne than it looks like Dennis or Bazemore or Holiday, etc.

[RamblinCharger]

If only the f***ing Nets lost 1 of their last few games. We would've had the 9th or 10th pick, and we could've gotten Justice Winslow.

[macdaddy]

29 minutes ago, AHF said:

The reason I bring it up is twofold.  One - I think it is the same.  Payne's competition was Scott and Moose with Sap as the starter.  THJr's competition is Holiday and Patterson with Korver as the starter.  The rationale is the same in both cases - there is too much talent ahead of you right now to give you minutes.

Two - in the case of Payne, I think that was true but a positive wrap on a deeper conclusion that "we don't think you have what it takes to cut it for the Hawks so we are dumping you for a future pick."  The fact that we are using the same rationale (too much competition ahead of him) makes me a little worried that it is likewise being used as a positive wrap for a guy they just don't think is truly capable.

At the end of the day, there is a big difference between concluding "Teague is in front of you Dennis so while we really believe in you and are committed to developing you we also have to recognize the minutes aren't going to be significant and steady until you get better" and "There is too much talent in front of  you Payne and we don't see enough upside in you to commit to give you minutes over our other deep rotation players so let's get rid of you now before we have another Jenkins on our hands."  

THJr. is in an unknown area right now because not enough time has passed but his usage looks a lot more like Payne than it looks like Dennis or Bazemore or Holiday, etc.

None of us know obviously and i can understand your logic.   I still think the fact that Hardaway played two years of pro ball (well semi-pro (see what i did there)), makes it a little different than Payne.   You know Bud is very aware of the questions concerning zero playing time.   I'm sure he doesn't want one of his first big moves of his new job to be an utter failure.   So I'm guessing he thinks this is the best plan for success.   Get him totally comfortable in the system, get him used to seeing how it's run before throwing him out there.   Plus he's probably undoing a lot of bad habits that 2 years in knicks zoo did to him.  

 

[Hawkmoor]

I bet he can COUNT though. You signed all those wings, and continue to ignore your real problem on the boards .  Hardaway SITTING highlights the fact that it was a busted, wasted trade.  Bud can get away with it though because no one is holding him accountable.

[Guest]

53 minutes ago, Hawkmoor said:

I bet he can COUNT though. You signed all those wings, and continue to ignore your real problem on the boards .  Hardaway SITTING highlights the fact that it was a busted, wasted trade.  Bud can get away with it though because no one is holding him accountable.

Kyles ankle injury and subsequent elbow surgery.

DMC leaving for Toronto.

Thabo returning from his beatdown.

 

[LastDon]

My biggest issue is how this idiot keeps screwing 1st round talent for 2nd round garbage..if he would invest the same time and energy in highly touted talent the hawks would be soaring much higher..Holiday is shooting low 30s from the field and averaging minimal ppg..same with Patterson..7 points in 25 minutes of action last night..Tim for his career averages 11ppg in a lil over 23 minutes a game..f*** Bud Man!!!

Edited November 20, 2015 by LastDon

[AHF]

1 hour ago, LastDon said:

My biggest issue is how this idiot keeps screwing 1st round talent for 2nd round garbage..if he would invest the same time and energy in highly touted talent the hawks would be soaring much higher..Holiday is shooting low 30s from the field and averaging minimal ppg..same with Patterson..7 points in 25 minutes of action last night..Tim for his career averages 11ppg in a lil over 23 minutes a game..f*** Bud Man!!!

Tim was one of the worst defenders in the nba last season and shot poorly to boot.  If he needs to shoot a lot to maintain his 11pp23 average and isn't showing he will shoot well then it is the right decision to sit him.  Shooting often should not be mistaken for good offense.  

Thj should have the potential to be an impact scorer - hitting from 3 and getting to the line - based on our assessment of him that led to the trade.  His numbers last year don't fill me with unbreakable confidence.

[Alex]

On November 19, 2015 at 11:04:46 AM, JayBirdHawk said:

uuuuhhhh....NO, not even close.  There were established players ahead of him in Millsap, Scott and Moose. 

The competition is between Holiday, Patterson and THJr.

On what planet are Scott and Muscala established players?

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Alex said:

On what planet are Scott and Muscala established players?

They were established as higher players in our rotation than Payne.  Apparently he couldn't compete or beat out either in practice  to move  ahead of them in the  rotation or he would have seen the court.  

We've seen how  the competition for minutes have played out with Patterson, Holiday and THJr.

 

[Guest]

Up your butt and around the corner...

 

 

Sorry I've been kickin it with my nephew ...lol

[Lurker]

The only thing that I would have done differently in the draft is maybe try harder to trade up for one of Winslow, Johnson, Booker, or Turner (and this is repeating myself). It didn’t seem like a great first round past 15. This trade as far as I’m concerned is a bust but unless Sam Dekker turns out to be really something, then the only options for Atlanta that were good were try harder to trade up for a better talent or just trade down and out of the first round.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Lurker said:

The only thing that I would have done differently in the draft is maybe try harder to trade up for one of Winslow, Johnson, Booker, or Turner (and this is repeating myself). It didn’t seem like a great first round past 15. This trade as far as I’m concerned is a bust but unless Sam Dekker turns out to be really something, then the only options for Atlanta that were good were try harder to trade up for a better talent or just trade down and out of the first round.

And let me repeat...Bud, Koonin, Wes all said they tried  moving up.  The asking price was too high.  The player they wanted at 15 was also gone and again Dekker is most likely done for the season...back surgery.

One source said Dekker was bothered by the back injury his senior year at Wisconsin.  Maybe it was a red flag during the draft.

[Peoriabird]

Somebody is protecting Bud and his terrible decisions..Why? I don't know.  Can someone explain it ti me?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

Somebody is protecting Bud and his terrible decisions..Why? I don't know.  Can someone explain it ti me?

Agreed, I don't know why he hasn't traded for LeighBron  yet? Smh

[Peoriabird]

18 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Agreed, I don't know why he hasn't traded for LeighBron  yet? Smh

Sacred Cow right now

[AHF]

11 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

Sacred Cow right now

For me, I disagree with some of the choices but I view it big picture.  Nobody bats 100%.  He has nailed some of his choices and the bottomline results are fantastic.  Doesn't mean he is exemp from criticism but it does mean that I don't throw out the baby with the bath water when he screws something up.

[bumpyphish1]

Surprised there isn't a separate thread/topic on this...Timmy's cherry got broken last night.

Are we going to see him as part of the rotation going forward?

[Gray Mule]

Learning.   Hawks play a different kind of game than Timmy knew anything about.  Don't throw in the towel.

Not yet, any way.  Hawks have been so busy, playing more games than any other NBA team, there has been

little or no time for practice.   This will change as other teams will be playing while the Hawks rest.

He can't be a complete flop.  Not yet.  Sure, we want him to be a super star RIGHT NOW!!

Not happening.  Time is on our side.  I'm not giving up for a long time yet.

 

GO ATL HAWKS !!

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, bumpyphish1 said:

Surprised there isn't a separate thread/topic on this...Timmy's cherry got broken last night.

Are we going to see him as part of the rotation going forward?

Oh, I took notice and I'm sure many others did as well.  He had a few lost moments on D but, other than that, he looked pretty good.  Far better than I thought he would considering we've been told all this time that he wasn't ready or whatever.

I hope he's allowed more time.  That shot he hit was pure and showed no rust.  Give him some time, Budz!

[AHF]

5 hours ago, kg01 said:

Oh, I took notice and I'm sure many others did as well.  He had a few lost moments on D but, other than that, he looked pretty good.  Far better than I thought he would considering we've been told all this time that he wasn't ready or whatever.

I hope he's allowed more time.  That shot he hit was pure and showed no rust.  Give him some time, Budz!

He needs to start contributing.  Hopefully he can become a regular and key part of the team.  We've badly needed him with the lost time to injury and the lack of perimeter shooting from some of our other guards.