Trade Deadline Rumors

[NBASupes]

7 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Mannix thinks Ainge is dealing with his good buddy Kecin MacHale in Minny or Billy King.

Exactly, most NBA fans want nothing more for the Hawks to be irrelevant. Like no top 3 picks or no playoff runs.

 

I am loving this from Wilcox, after that Hardaway Jr trade, they lost a lot of my respect but they are earning it with their actions. 

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Yep, we're FINALLY going to see just how overrated he is as a GM.  Now that he's having to deal on his own merit he's sitting there with his pick(s) in his hand.  Nobody's taking those crap 'assets' and give them anything of consequence.  They'll probably end up with Howard and/or Gay since those teams are equally desperate to deal.

Morey is another rape type, if he cannot rape you, he will just hold on to his assets. My issue is why is Milwaukee refusing to come off of Giannis or Parker. They are redundant and don't fit their personnel grouping what so ever and can't play together.  Jeff is the perfect fit for that roster and Henson should be starting anyway. To me there is smart holding and dumb holding. Milwaukee is dumb holding. 

 

Sorry but no team is going to trade you their very talented PG for anyone other than those two. No one. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Morey is another rape type, if he cannot rape you, he will just hold on to his assets. My issue is why is Milwaukee refusing to come off of Giannis or Parker. They are redundant and don't fit their personnel grouping what so ever and can't play together.  Jeff is the perfect fit for that roster and Henson should be starting anyway. To me there is smart holding and dumb holding. Milwaukee is dumb holding. 

Sorry but no team is going to trade you their very talented PG for anyone other than those two. No one. 

Scared money don't make no money.  They're sitting in their cubicles thinking, "But what if Giannis/Parker becomes .... blah, blah, blah".  They don't want to be known as the guy that traded that guy.  What they don't realize is they're probably not going to be around long enough to see it come to fruition anyway since they refuse to make the tough move that makes the team better.

[NBASupes]

7 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Scared money don't make no money.  They're sitting in their cubicles thinking, "But what if Giannis/Parker becomes .... blah, blah, blah".  They don't want to be known as the guy that traded that guy.  What they don't realize is they're probably not going to be around long enough to see it come to fruition anyway since they refuse to make the tough move that makes the team better.

That shouldn't be their problem,  their problem is they aren't even close right now while being much closer than Detroit last year. If you don't have a PG in this league who is starting caliber, your toast. We got two of them. One is a top 10 PG and the other has more potential than the top ten PG. They have none. They made a trade to get rid of a starting level PG who had them in the top 5 in the east for a backup with limited potential who put up stats for a scrub team. Idiots. If you don't got a PG in this league, your toast unless you got LeBron. 

Edited February 12, 2016 by NBASupes

[NBASupes]

@kg01, if these two were so good, I could see it but I watch their games. Other than v. The Wizards, they never seem to fit next to each other. I keep hearing Bucks fans like, we just need a starting PG but no one is trading them for anything less than Parker or Giannis.  No one. Ask for Jrue injury prone Holiday and New Orleans will say we want Middleton.  No one is giving away their PG's.  No one. You gotta pay up bitches.

 

These two are potential more than actual results. Both of them

 Middleton is much further along then either and its no lock they will vastly improve. Their career charts are similar to Josh Smith for Giannis and Jabari isn't even on Glenn Robinson curve yet. Now the talent is there but that don't mean these guys should have this franchise trade value Milwaukee seems to think. 

Edited February 12, 2016 by NBASupes

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

@kg01, if these two were so good, I could see it but I watch their games. Other than v. The Wizards, they never seem to fit next to each other. I keep hearing Bucks fans like, we just need a starting PG but no one is trading them for anything less than Parker or Giannis.  No one. Ask for Jrue injury prone Holiday and New Orleans will say we want Middleton.  No one is giving away their PG's.  No one. You gotta pay up bitches.

Yep, they don't fit.  Seems they're suffering from classic over-valuing  of prospects.  No one's saying Teague is a better player or prospect than either Parker or Giannis.  What I'm saying is MIL needs a 1 more than they need both those 3/4's and it's not even close.

[Guest]

I hadn't heard of Mannix before he went to the Woj "I swear we're not mouthpieces for agents with this" Website. Then as I do hear about him, turns out he was a ball boy (bball kind not the @Spud2Nique kind) for the Celts growing up. Well, I say growing up but he was doing it while still in college at Boston College. He's also a Ric Bucher-like guy in that he's also a sideline reporter for the Celtics! Oh brother. What a dope.

[Guest]

The Bucks realize that trading Brandon Knight was a mistake, so they are now gun shy.

It's all well and good to have a collection of assets but if they don't fit and play well together, they'll be moving in quicksand for years.

This article sums up their problem:

Quote

It was just this past summer that the Milwaukee Bucks were on a clear upward trajectory. The signing of Greg Monroe was supposed to push a young, 41-win team toward the upper echelon of the Eastern Conference. Yet here we are in February and Milwaukee sits ahead of two biggest sad-sacks in the East, Philadelphia and Brooklyn.

As the trade deadline approaches, the Bucks' clear and vibrant future has become a bit muddled. Instead of falling into the buyer’s category this winter, Milwaukee is most definitely a seller, perhaps looking to ship off a few parts, throw in the towel on this season and add to their collection of promising young pieces. It’s traditional maneuver for a team in the Bucks position, but it also brings to light an increasingly common problem that impacts rebuilding teams in the NBA -- the lack of a unifying vision.

Right now, Milwaukee’s lone identity seems to be only that they are young. The defense that propelled the team to the playoffs last season is now rankedonly above the hapless Lakers. It’s easy to pin this on the addition of Monroe, but other factors -- from the league having time to figure it out and the departures of steady, positionally smart players like Jared Dudley and Zaza Pachulia -- have been key components of that as well. Another factor has been the return of prized prospect Jabari Parker, who after playing in just 25 games last season currently looks like one of the NBA’s most hollow players, ranking 398th out of 440 players in ESPN.com’s Real Plus/Minus ratings.

Such a defensive collapse would be understandable if it came at the expense of serious benefits to the team’s offense. But Milwaukee has made only marginal gains on that end of the floor, despite the return of Parker and addition of Monroe. The team sits 23rd in our RealGM rankings and has been derided all season long for their lack of shooting. But that surface evaluation, while correct and hugely important, doesn’t touch on the key cause of the Bucks now murky path -- the fact that their approach, personnel and commitment to development seem to clash in every way possible.

The biggest sign of that is the team’s pace. Milwaukee currently sits 24th in RealGM’s pace rating, ahead of only a team that runs the Triangle (New York), two teams that feature lineups with traditional, non-shooting bigs (Utah and Memphis) an Erik Spoelstra coached team (Miami) and a LeBron run one (Cleveland). When your team features three young, athletic players in Antetokounmpo, Parker and starting point guard Michael Carter-Williams, who excel in transition and struggle in the halfcourt due to their shooting limitations, being ranked that low in pace is almost criminal.

Now there may be some clear, logic reasons (and big one, literally, being Monroe) why Jason Kidd has slowed down the tempo his young team, one of which may be a belief that come playoff time, a grind-it-approach has always been considered essential to winning a championship. Yet that belief seems outdated given the success of a Golden State team that finished last year’s regular season ranked first in pace. And if more evidence was needed, three teams -- Dallas, Houston and L.A. -- played faster in the postseason than Golden State did in the regular season, per ESPN.com data.

In addition to that, there’s a shaky balance when it comes to who controls Milwaukee’s possessions -- and what that means for everyone else. Carter-Williams is the team’s starting point guard, but has only run 74 more pick-and-rolls (at least ones that ended in a shot, pass or turnover) than rising star Khris Middleton over the course of this season, per Synergy data. Antetokounmpo, a 7-footer with point guard skills, has run 60 of his own and, in the long term, might be Milwaukee’s best playmaker out of that action and currently averages the most points per possession according to Synergy than anyone else on the team.

Having this many young players capable of attacking in the NBA’s staple action is an enviable thing in the vast majority of cases. But in Milwaukee, this is where the shooting woes, the shaky developmental balance and the unclear long-term vision all collide.

A career 40.6 percent shooter from 3, Middleton is clearly the Bucks' most feared outside threat. And if it wasn’t for veteran Jerryd Bayless, who has missed 18 games this season, Middleton would be the team’s only threat from beyond the arc. Which makes his use as both a pick-and-roll ballhandler -- and post up option -- both suboptimal and mystifying.

That’s because every time Middleton has the ball in these actions it means all his other young teammates who can’t shoot don’t have it. Teams virtually ignore Antetokounmpo and Carter-Williams when they are stationed behind the arc and Parker, who has struggled badly from that area of the floor, doesn’t even space the floor behind the 3-point line anymore. The Bucks have tried to remedy this problem by telling non-shooters to cut like they’re Dwyane Wade, but that generally has caused more spacing issues than it’s solved -- something reflected by the teams low output in these situations per Synergy.

Now if the Bucks were hellbent on developing Middleton in these actions and forcing Antetokounmpo, Carter-Williams and Parker to round out their games, that’s fine. It’s a long-term plan that sacrifices wins for reps, but it’s not fundamentally flawed logic by any stretch. It’s just a path that requires time and patience. It also means the team shouldn’t be slotting Parker 20-feet from the basket or discouraging Antetokounmpo and Carter-Williams to bomb away from 3. On top of those things, the signing of Monroe, a limited pick-and-roll partner brought in to shore up a specific weakness for a playoff team, would have been an unnecessary and counterproductive move if this was the team’s plan all along.

If the Bucks goal is to win now, giving the ball to Middleton in these actions, instead of letting him use his shooting to help cover the flaws of his teammates, isn’t a productive use of his game. Sure, Middleton is gaining valuable experience, but teams don’t win games when half their rotation is forced into roles that don’t suit their current skill sets. What Milwaukee needs more than anything right now, is to decide what matters most to them right now: wins or development.

Depending on what they decide will shape how they approach both this trade deadline and the summer ahead. If the team embraces their disappointing season, deals for players like Monroe and Bayless should be considered or even initiated by the Bucks themselves. If the team wants better results immediately, they need to take a hard look at which young member of their young core is expandable and can be sent out in exchange for players that complement the skills of the remaining cornerstones.  

Or the other option for Milwaukee is to continue with the status quo and hope to be saved simply by the internal improvement of individuals. After all, if Carter-Williams, Antetokounmpo or Parker come back a dead-eye from 3-point land next season, a lot of the team’s issues would be solved, at least on offense. But waiting on players to round out their games is fine in theory, but the reality of this impatient business is that it never seems to happen fast enough -- if it ever does. Because when it comes to the development of NBA players in their early 20s, it’s a total crapshoot, especially when a franchise isn’t providing an environment conducive to it.

Milwaukee is discovering that collecting talented youngsters doesn’t guarantee a swift, linear path up the league’s standings. And before the team gets stuck in a confusing limbo between rebuilding and contending, the Bucks need to have a clear vision for what lies ahead.

http://basketball.realgm.com/analysis/240770/Bucks-Need-To-Choose-Between-Wins-Development

[NBASupes]

34 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Yep, they don't fit.  Seems they're suffering from classic over-valuing  of prospects.  No one's saying Teague is a better player or prospect than either Parker or Giannis.  What I'm saying is MIL needs a 1 more than they need both those 3/4's and it's not even close.

 

34 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Yep, they don't fit.  Seems they're suffering from classic over-valuing  of prospects.  No one's saying Teague is a better player or prospect than either Parker or Giannis.  What I'm saying is MIL needs a 1 more than they need both those 3/4's and it's not even close.

Teague is a much better player than either of the two but is he more talented than either,  probably not. But living up to your potential is just as hard as anything else if the situation ain't ideal.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, hawksfanatic said:

I hadn't heard of Mannix before he went to the Woj "I swear we're not mouthpieces for agents with this" Website. Then as I do hear about him, turns out he was a ball boy (bball kind not the @Spud2Nique kind) for the Celts growing up. Well, I say growing up but he was doing it while still in college at Boston College. He's also a Ric Bucher-like guy in that he's also a sideline reporter for the Celtics! Oh brother. What a dope.

He's gonna git you, sucka.

I recall Mannix from years back and he wasn't so pro-BOS back then.  It's a shame that these supposedly unbiased "journalists" can't hide their allegiances.  That MIL article is spot on.

[NBASupes]

13 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

The Bucks realize that trading Brandon Knight was a mistake, so they are now gun shy.

It's all well and good to have a collection of assets but if they don't fit and play well together, they'll be moving in quicksand for years.

This article sums up their problem:

http://basketball.realgm.com/analysis/240770/Bucks-Need-To-Choose-Between-Wins-Development

Great article. The numbers don't do them justice,  the fit is worse when watching the games. There is so much wrong with this team. It's not like the late 2000s Hawks. These guys lack any type of fit and they are not two way players. Kidd is trying to develop them into it but it's not easy.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I recall Mannix from years back and he wasn't so pro-BOS back then.  It's a shame that these supposedly unbiased "journalists" can't hide their allegiances.  That MIL article is spot on.

I always get stuck in trying to figure out "journalists" as it relates to sports...they are all easily replaceable and the pay doesn't appear to be stellar so it's possible they aren't the sharpest tools in the shed (Smashmouth ref). But then again, whenever someone says something you can't figure out or agree with or find strange if you only explain it as "they dum" that's not the most likely explainer of things. And calling everything else dumb reflects more on oneself than it does on the person one's calling dumb. So then I come back to thinking that some of these guys are saying things for shock value or to target their audience or grabbing them clicks....and that might be Mannix when he was not pro-BOS for a period. Just say outlandish things that annoy people so they tune in to yell at you. Look at Stephen A. Smiff and Skib Payless, it is hard for me to come to the conclusion that guys educated at Winston-State and Vanderbilt don't know what they are doing. They're effectively larger-scale radio shock-jocks with outlandish remarks to drive them clicks. The world would be a whole lot better if people could just ignore them.

\rant

[Admin]

Let's not act like we wouldn't want and expect the lethal one to be a Hawks homer if he ever got a writing job with the league or one of the major sports sites.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[hazer]

17 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

The Bucks realize that trading Brandon Knight was a mistake, so they are now gun shy.

It's all well and good to have a collection of assets but if they don't fit and play well together, they'll be moving in quicksand for years.

This article sums up their problem:

http://basketball.realgm.com/analysis/240770/Bucks-Need-To-Choose-Between-Wins-Development

That is some of the most astute, objective, intelligent, on-the-money hoops writing I've ever read.

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, Dolfan23 said:

Let's not act like we wouldn't want and expect the lethal one to be a Hawks homer if he ever got a writing job with the league or one of the major sports sites.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

But the ones we got like Lang aren't foolish Homers either. They have journalist integrity 

Edited February 12, 2016 by NBASupes

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

Let's not act like we wouldn't want and expect the lethal one to be a Hawks homer if he ever got a writing job with the league or one of the major sports sites.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah but they don't pay as well as the 'Squawk.

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

Let's not act like we wouldn't want and expect the lethal one to be a Hawks homer if he ever got a writing job with the league or one of the major sports sites.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Lethal would be fair and least you'd get some obscure fact or reference.

[NBASupes]

Lethal is a type of writer you see who writes for Grantland, he's an asset 

[Vol4ever]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

Yep, they don't fit.  Seems they're suffering from classic over-valuing  of prospects.  No one's saying Teague is a better player or prospect than either Parker or Giannis.  What I'm saying is MIL needs a 1 more than they need both those 3/4's and it's not even close.

Right!   The thing is Teague is already a allstar level player at PG and that is exactly what they need.  It doesnt matter what Parker or Giannis upside is.    If I were Hawks management if I could not get what I want for Teague he would not be traded, period.

[hylndr11]

Talk of Mavericks wanting horford - saw an interview on TV - Apparently they have assets, i mean uh zaza and parsons