Hawks are not interested in making a major deadline trade

[Sothron]

14 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Yeah, this was a bad moov for DEN.  Probably panicked when they saw Howard bullying Jokic and figured since he's a weak-ish C, maybe he's a PF.  I disagree.  He's a 4 like wHorford's a 4.  Sure he could play 4 but his primary effectiveness is as a skilled-5.   JMEO.

This is why I want us to trade with ORL or PHX.  Bad, possibly soon-to-be-fired GM's make mistakes/reaches.  ORL's GM seat is somewhere between volcanic lava and the surface of the sun in terms of heat.

Jokic can't play PF. They tried the first ten games to put Nurkic and Jokic on the floor together but they didn't work. Both took up the low post on offense and on defense, wow, it was bad. Nurkic is not Chandler in his prime to fly around as a weak side fast footed center to make up for a slow PF. Jokic is a pure center. So is Nurkic.

If Faried could block more shots he's one of the best PF to put next to Jokic. They would kill to have Millsap next to Jokic. But Plumlee? Naw bro. He's too slow at PF. If they did this just to get a different backup center then they overpaid badly.

Nurkic got a lot of blame for not working out with Jokic but that isn't either guy's fault. I mean both are slow  pure centers. Difference is Jokic has a skill set out of this world while Nurkic is like a M1A1 tank down there that just plows through people.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, ISOJOE said:

Did you realize that DEN added a Firstroundpick that will be in the 20 range? moose > giving up a Firstroundpick + Plumlee. Plumlee won't be cheap in the summer. 

Apparently not to Denver.  They were interested in getting a real NBA player,  Moose is cannon fodder.  He has little to no trade value by himself.

 

[AHF]

On 2/13/2017 at 11:19 AM, JayBirdHawk said:

Apparently not to Denver.  They were interested in getting a real NBA player,  Moose is cannon fodder.  He has little to no trade value by himself.

 

Seriously.  For trade value, any first round pick > Moose.

[hawkman]

23 minutes ago, AHF said:

Seriously.  For trade value, any first round pick > Moose.

Our 2nd round picks (Scott & Moose) looked like steals for awhile, but apparently the magic has run out. It's time to move them on for whatever we can get before the rest of the league realizes they aren't NBA caliber players.

[AHF]

1 minute ago, hawkman said:

Our 2nd round picks (Scott & Moose) looked like steals for awhile, but apparently the magic has run out. It's time to move them on for whatever we can get before the rest of the league realizes they aren't NBA caliber players.

They have both turned out to be solid picks for 2nd rounders considering most never contribute anything but they aren't home run picks by any means.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, AHF said:

They have both turned out to be solid picks for 2nd rounders considering most never contribute anything but they aren't home run picks by any means.

It's the same thing with this team.  Guys being asked to do more than they're capable of doing.  What Muscala was giving us at the beginning of the season was great.  Fantastic even (Snagglepuss voice).  But we had to know it was fool's gold and had a limited shelf-life.

[AHF]

2 hours ago, kg01 said:

It's the same thing with this team.  Guys being asked to do more than they're capable of doing.  What Muscala was giving us at the beginning of the season was great.  Fantastic even (Snagglepuss voice).  But we had to know it was fool's gold and had a limited shelf-life.

  "By shelf-life, you mean that I should bench our top bench rebounders when we are getting killed on the boards and keep playing Moose even when Moose is ice cold, right?"

[HawkItus]

3 hours ago, kg01 said:

It's the same thing with this team.  Guys being asked to do more than they're capable of doing.  What Muscala was giving us at the beginning of the season was great.  Fantastic even (Snagglepuss voice).  But we had to know it was fool's gold and had a limited shelf-life.

I call bull on this.  What sports team doesn't ask for more from its players?  Name one that doesn't.  Better yet show me the best teams and I will show you a bunch of guys that do way more than what most people perceive as there limitations.  

[Guest]

18 hours ago, HawkItus said:

I call bull on this.  What sports team doesn't ask for more from its players?  Name one that doesn't.  Better yet show me the best teams and I will show you a bunch of guys that do way more than what most people perceive as there limitations.  

I call bull on you.  There's a difference between asking for more and asking for more than a guy is capable of.

And, no, you won't find any successful teams asking for multiple guys to do more than their perceived limitations.

[HawkItus]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

I call bull on you.  There's a difference between asking for more and asking for more than a guy is capable of.

And, no, you won't find any successful teams asking for multiple guys to do more than their perceived limitations.

Again show me the teams that don't ask for more.......

[Guest]

1 hour ago, HawkItus said:

Again show me the teams that don't ask for more.......

Stop cutting the sentence off!  It's not simply asking for more, it's asking for more than they're capable of.

[HawkItus]

17 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Stop cutting the sentence off!  It's not simply asking for more, it's asking for more than they're capable of.

My point exactly.  Where is this arbitrary more than they're capable of?  Sap that came in from Utah is today showing he was way more capable than people thought.  Korver, Baze, Thabo, Hardaway Jr.    I mean where is this arbitrary line?  You don't know what people are capable of until you ask for more.   Bud has been a champion of that from day one and the players love him for it.   That is the Spurs way and the winning way.  You get more than the surface out of guys and they grow.  

[Guest]

44 minutes ago, HawkItus said:

My point exactly.  Where is this arbitrary more than they're capable of?  Sap that came in from Utah is today showing he was way more capable than people thought.  Korver, Baze, Thabo, Hardaway Jr.    I mean where is this arbitrary line?  You don't know what people are capable of until you ask for more.   Bud has been a champion of that from day one and the players love him for it.   That is the Spurs way and the winning way.  You get more than the surface out of guys and they grow.  

Stop with the "Spurs" stuff.  Until we get 2 HOF-level #1 picks to spearhead the program, I don't wanna hear that nonsense anymore.

If the Spurs started their "program" with Adam Keefe and Doug Edwards, how far would that crap have gotten?

And, yeah, let's keep asking Bazemore to go out there and play as if he's Paul George (i.e. more than he's capable of) and see how far we get with that.

[Sothron]

23 hours ago, HawkItus said:

I call bull on this.  What sports team doesn't ask for more from its players?  Name one that doesn't.  Better yet show me the best teams and I will show you a bunch of guys that do way more than what most people perceive as there limitations.  

You can't ask guys to continue to have career years or a really good block of games over the course of a season. Our bench was great to start the season then completely fell apart.

 The Bulls didn't ask Taco Joe to be anything other than Taco Joe for a reason.

[HawkItus]

56 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Stop with the "Spurs" stuff.  Until we get 2 HOF-level #1 picks to spearhead the program, I don't wanna hear that nonsense anymore.

If the Spurs started their "program" with Adam Keefe and Doug Edwards, how far would that crap have gotten?

And, yeah, let's keep asking Bazemore to go out there and play as if he's Paul George (i.e. more than he's capable of) and see how far we get with that.

Where do you get this asking Baze to be Paul George?  We don't have Doug Edwards  or Adam Keefe on this team.  But, the Spurs did more with Boris Diaw than we ever thought was capable.  See that a valid argument with exaggeration or imagination.  A real player Boris Diaw was used and used successfully by a coach asking him to be more than what folks thought he could be.  He never played inside here. 

 

 

[HawkItus]

5 minutes ago, Sothron said:

You can't ask guys to continue to have career years or a really good block of games over the course of a season. Our bench was great to start the season then completely fell apart.

 The Bulls didn't ask Taco Joe to be anything other than Taco Joe for a reason.

Yep our bench was great, but remember who was on the bench.

 

Thabo(starting now)

Hardaway(starting now)

Dalaney(rookie)

Moose(had a injury that slowed him down)

Prince/Bembry(rookie)

Mike Scott(surgery slowed him down)

Splitter(might not actaully exist)

 

You get my drift?  Guys aren't being asked to be superman.  They are just under preforming.  With all that said we are 5th in the east ya know.

[AHF]

5 minutes ago, HawkItus said:

Where do you get this asking Baze to be Paul George?  We don't have Doug Edwards  or Adam Keefe on this team.  But, the Spurs did more with Boris Diaw than we ever thought was capable.  See that a valid argument with exaggeration or imagination.  A real player Boris Diaw was used and used successfully by a coach asking him to be more than what folks thought he could be.  He never played inside here. 

 

 

Diaw is a good example.  He lacked the quickness to play on the wing and the shooting to be a perimeter gunner like we tried to get him to be here.  We asked him to do more than he was capable of.  The Spurs put him inside where he could play to his strengths and turned his passing and ballhandling loose where it was an asset - matched up against opposing forwards.  They didn't ask him to do more than his skills and tools dictated, they optimized those skills and tools.  

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, HawkItus said:

Where do you get this asking Baze to be Paul George?  We don't have Doug Edwards  or Adam Keefe on this team.  But, the Spurs did more with Boris Diaw than we ever thought was capable.  See that a valid argument with exaggeration or imagination.  A real player Boris Diaw was used and used successfully by a coach asking him to be more than what folks thought he could be.  He never played inside here. 

 

 

Diaw played with Hall of Famers in San Antonio!!

See how Kyle's doing well in CLE where he struggled mightily here.  It's not because they're sooo much better at using him.  It's because the talent around him is much better thus he's able to be more effective.

Here, where we asked him to do more than he's capable of, Kyle couldn't get open, could hardly defend and was largely ineffective on both ends.  In CLE, where he can just stay in his lane, he's started to excel again.

[HawkItus]

2 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Diaw played with Hall of Famers in San Antonio!!

See how Kyle's doing well in CLE where he struggled mightily here.  It's not because they're sooo much better at using him.  It's because the talent around him is much better thus he's able to be more effective.

Here, where we asked him to do more than he's capable of, Kyle couldn't get open, could hardly defend and was largely ineffective on both ends.  In CLE, where he can just stay in his lane, he's started to excel again.

Dude Kyle made the All-star game here.   Not accepting this one.

[HawkItus]

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

Diaw is a good example.  He lacked the quickness to play on the wing and the shooting to be a perimeter gunner like we tried to get him to be here.  We asked him to do more than he was capable of.  The Spurs put him inside where he could play to his strengths and turned his passing and ballhandling loose where it was an asset - matched up against opposing forwards.  They didn't ask him to do more than his skills and tools dictated, they optimized those skills and tools.  

Touche'.  That is a valid way of looking at it.  But, you could also say asking him to rebound and defend inside was a risky endeavor.  He proved capable, but nothing before in his career showed that this wasn't asking too much of him.