I take back the bad things I said about our Defensive Coordinator.

[Diesel]

I didn't have the nimbers...

We're not so bad on defense according to most metrics (except the eye test). 

Our starting 5 is better than our overall by a lot. 

Our pace is 9th in the league; so our defensive rating isn't based on that. 

The idea that our bench is terrible has some merit. 

But I think the main thing that we have to do is improve our offense. 

Defensively, I haven't see Trae work as much on defense as he has this year. 

Defensively, except for the the Knicks, Nuggets and LAC.. nobody has come out and just beat the fire out of us. 

The make up will have to be on the offensive end.   We have to make up big differences with our offense.  I hope our boys enjoyed their trips to Cabo.  Its time to come back and put in work!!

[JayBirdHawk]

We have these quarters where we can't stop anybody and we compound the issue by not being able to score.

 

 

[shakes]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

We have these quarters where we can't stop anybody and we compound the issue by not being able to score.

 

 

other than that, how did you like the play Mrs. Lincoln?

[Sothron]

I think our main issues are not enough three pointers on offense and conversely giving up too many three pointers. Our defense is better this year. Trae is playing the best defense of his career. Our starting five has four good defensive players and then Trae whose at this point average/slightly below average on defense since mid Dec.

 

[JayBirdHawk]

2 minutes ago, Sothron said:

I think our main issues are not enough three pointers on offense and conversely giving up too many three pointers. Our defense is better this year. Trae is playing the best defense of his career. Our starting five has four good defensive players and then Trae whose at this point average/slightly below average on defense since mid Dec.

 

Yep, lot's of long 2s. Sigh.

 

 

[shakes]

2 minutes ago, Sothron said:

I think our main issues are not enough three pointers on offense and conversely giving up too many three pointers. Our defense is better this year. Trae is playing the best defense of his career. Our starting five has four good defensive players and then Trae whose at this point average/slightly below average on defense since mid Dec.

 

cmon, there's no way that Tae is even close to an "average/below average" defender.     And who cares if he' playing the "best defense of his career" when he's also playing the worst offense and game management of his career at the same time?

And yes this is Trae's worst season in his career.  Much worse than his rookie year because he gets the excuse of being a rook.  No excuse for a superstar getting worse from his 4th to 5th year.

[Sothron]

Just now, shakes said:

cmon, there's no way that Tae is even close to an "average/below average" defender.     And who cares if he' playing the "best defense of his career" when he's also playing the worst offense and game management of his career at the same time?

And yes this is Trae's worst season in his career.  Much worse than his rookie year because he gets the excuse of being a rook.  No excuse for a superstar getting worse from his 4th to 5th year.

go look in the thread about Trae's defense. It might shock you. He is at least an average/slightly below average defender this year. 

His shooting was in the pits the first 26 games. The last 26 games he's bounced back. There's a tweet Trae shared about that showing his numbers and advance metrics. It is clear he had a slow start to the season but since then he's bounced back up. I think Trae usually has a slow start and then gets better as the season goes along.

I agree this has been the worst offensive season for him but his numbers are still good. His defense is so much better than he's ever shown before that you can't just write that off.

[Sothron]

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Yep, lot's of long 2s. Sigh.

 

 

This is the problem with Nate thinking it is still 2003. We simply don't shoot enough three pointers in today's game. Settling for long two's is not going to work. It is like we have Josh Smith as our HC...

[Wretch]

Quote

We have these quarters where we can't stop anybody and we compound the issue by not being able to score.

@JayBirdHawk...I have to quote you the janky way because I refuse to use the "RealGM theme" lol

Anyway, +1000 to this. I have been trying to tell people this all season.  I said the same thing in that defense thread a couple of weeks ago.  People just don't get it.  First of all, I just shake my head when people scream about defense.  I mean, yeah...defense is necessary, but there comes a point where you have to concede the skill and talent of pro ballers.  Nobody is "locking down" anybody in the NBA.

Now about these bad stretches of basketball.  The game is all about RUNS and is at least 50% psychological.  Momentum isn't some "magical" force.  Guys get "hot" because they see the ball go through the hoop.  Teams get confident because they go on a little run.  Double digit leads and "daggers" break confidence take the air out of the building and drain energy - OFFENSE energy and DEFENSIVE energy.  Why are teams better at home?  Why do guys that drain +30' contested shots, and can hit 10-three pointers in a row in practice, miss two wide open free throws?

I could sit here and go on and on, but the game is MENTAL.  Folks can call it whatever they want.  It's "the game within the game" and that's why we're basically mid at everything.  This is leadership, chemistry, maturity, scheme, and coaching...not talent.

[macdaddy]

6 minutes ago, Wretch said:

@JayBirdHawk...I have to quote you the janky way because I refuse to use the "RealGM theme" lol

Anyway, +1000 to this. I have been trying to tell people this all season.  I said the same thing in that defense thread a couple of weeks ago.  People just don't get it.  First of all, I just shake my head when people scream about defense.  I mean, yeah...defense is necessary, but there comes a point where you have to concede the skill and talent of pro ballers.  Nobody is "locking down" anybody in the NBA.

Now about these bad stretches of basketball.  The game is all about RUNS and is at least 50% psychological.  Momentum isn't some "magical" force.  Guys get "hot" because they see the ball go through the hoop.  Teams get confident because they go on a little run.  Double digit leads and "daggers" break confidence take the air out of the building and drain energy - OFFENSE energy and DEFENSIVE energy.  Why are teams better at home?  Why do guys that drain +30' contested shots, and can hit 10-three pointers in a row in practice, miss two wide open free throws?

I could sit here and go on and on, but the game is MENTAL.  Folks can call it whatever they want.  It's "the game within the game" and that's why we're basically mid at everything.  This is leadership, chemistry, maturity, scheme, and coaching...not talent.

We've got one dog offensive player and that's Trae.   DJ shows signs but isn't always there.  That's not enough in today's NBA no matter how good the D is.   This is why guys like Gallo, Lou, Bogi make such a huge difference to this team when they are on.  

Watching guys like CJ Mccollum and Buddy Hield scorch us is tough.  Sure they are bad defenders but you still need them.   Jamal Crawford was a terrible defender and played 20 years.   Jason Terry was a key to a championship.  

[shakes]

15 minutes ago, Wretch said:

@JayBirdHawk...I have to quote you the janky way because I refuse to use the "RealGM theme" lol

Anyway, +1000 to this. I have been trying to tell people this all season.  I said the same thing in that defense thread a couple of weeks ago.  People just don't get it.  First of all, I just shake my head when people scream about defense.  I mean, yeah...defense is necessary, but there comes a point where you have to concede the skill and talent of pro ballers.  Nobody is "locking down" anybody in the NBA.

Now about these bad stretches of basketball.  The game is all about RUNS and is at least 50% psychological.  Momentum isn't some "magical" force.  Guys get "hot" because they see the ball go through the hoop.  Teams get confident because they go on a little run.  Double digit leads and "daggers" break confidence take the air out of the building and drain energy - OFFENSE energy and DEFENSIVE energy.  Why are teams better at home?  Why do guys that drain +30' contested shots, and can hit 10-three pointers in a row in practice, miss two wide open free throws?

I could sit here and go on and on, but the game is MENTAL.  Folks can call it whatever they want.  It's "the game within the game" and that's why we're basically mid at everything.  This is leadership, chemistry, maturity, scheme, and coaching...not talent.

great, all the things the Hawks have none of....

[shakes]

15 minutes ago, Wretch said:

@JayBirdHawk...I have to quote you the janky way because I refuse to use the "RealGM theme" lol

Anyway, +1000 to this. I have been trying to tell people this all season.  I said the same thing in that defense thread a couple of weeks ago.  People just don't get it.  First of all, I just shake my head when people scream about defense.  I mean, yeah...defense is necessary, but there comes a point where you have to concede the skill and talent of pro ballers.  Nobody is "locking down" anybody in the NBA.

Now about these bad stretches of basketball.  The game is all about RUNS and is at least 50% psychological.  Momentum isn't some "magical" force.  Guys get "hot" because they see the ball go through the hoop.  Teams get confident because they go on a little run.  Double digit leads and "daggers" break confidence take the air out of the building and drain energy - OFFENSE energy and DEFENSIVE energy.  Why are teams better at home?  Why do guys that drain +30' contested shots, and can hit 10-three pointers in a row in practice, miss two wide open free throws?

I could sit here and go on and on, but the game is MENTAL.  Folks can call it whatever they want.  It's "the game within the game" and that's why we're basically mid at everything.  This is leadership, chemistry, maturity, scheme, and coaching...not talent.

great, all the things the Hawks have none of....

[Wretch]

Quote

We've got one dog offensive player and that's Trae.   DJ shows signs but isn't always there.  That's not enough in today's NBA no matter how good the D is.   This is why guys like Gallo, Lou, Bogi make such a huge difference to this team when they are on.  

Watching guys like CJ Mccollum and Buddy Hield scorch us is tough.  Sure they are bad defenders but you still need them.   Jamal Crawford was a terrible defender and played 20 years.   Jason Terry was a key to a championship.  

@macdaddy

/janky-quote lol

Yes and yes.  A lot of the pros say that the best defense is good offense.  Watch the team when we're down 15-20 vs. getting that deficit down to single digits.  Shots start falling and the defensive energy picks up.  It's a thing when teams look up at the scoreboard and check the clock.  They're looking at it the same as we are - worse because they're the ones on the court and they get all of the scrutiny afterwards.

There are going to be possessions where you defend as well as you can, and guys still drain 3's in your face or catch a timely and-1.  That's when you have to come back down on the other end and get a basket.  This is a problem area for us because of lack of ball movement, pounding the ball, and our love affair with the midrange game:

Quote

Atlanta Hawks’ lack of three-point shooting a major issue

“It’s not about the shot [selection],” Young said of what led to the Hawks’ loss via JER’s YouTube channel. “It’s about they hitting threes and we hitting twos. How many more threes did they hit? They hit 12 more threes. You know, the difference in 12 more is, what, 36? That’s a big jump. I mean, we lost by seven. So, if you put that into consideration we just got to get more looks.”

https://soaringdownsouth.com/2023/01/29/trae-young-atlanta-hawks-season-long-issue/

In this instance, the difference is literally how we're playing on offense before factoring in defense at all.  Even if we matched those 12 made 3's, shot for shot with 2's, that's still a double-digit pad for the opposition.

None of this is to say that defense isn't important.  It is and despite how much I go on about scoring, defense is my favorite part of the game.  Guys who play defense always tend to be my favorite Hawks.  It's just...the game is always going to come down to who can hit shots when it counts.

(Also, if that quote by Trae isn't a jab at Nate, I don't know what is.)

[JayBirdHawk]

45 minutes ago, Wretch said:

 

(Also, if that quote by Trae isn't a jab at Nate, I don't know what is.)

Why you tiny text it.  Say it loud and again and again....and that’s not a jab, it's a straight uppercut. 

[Watchman]

We have a defensive coordinator?

[Diesel]

On 2/21/2023 at 12:02 PM, Wretch said:

I could sit here and go on and on, but the game is MENTAL.  Folks can call it whatever they want.  It's "the game within the game" and that's why we're basically mid at everything.  This is leadership, chemistry, maturity, scheme, and coaching...not talent.

I agree with this.. which is why I subscribe to a high pace ala Westhead.   Throw away all cautions...  When the other team scores, your job is to beat them down the court and score easier on them... and comeback and set up defense. 

This is all mental warfare.   You put the team that scores in a position where they just watched you score an easy bucket and now they have to come back down and try to score again.  While they are trying, you are scoring with ease... off the strength of your ability to fill passing lanes and run.  Never argue with the refs, just run. 

That game plan will defeat most teams before the 2nd half.  By the end of the third qtr, you can put in your 2nd and 3rd team players.

When they had Alex English and Fat Lever, Denver used to do something similar.  The only problems were;

1.  They didn't have defenders. 

2.   NBA Teams were in better shape.

The Lakers (Pat Riley) stole Westhead's offense, slowed it up and called it the fastbreak.

 

 

[Wretch]

Quote

/janky-quote

I agree with this.. which is why I subscribe to a high pace ala Westhead.   Throw away all cautions...  When the other team scores, your job is to beat them down the court and score easier on them... and comeback and set up defense. 

This is all mental warfare.   You put the team that scores in a position where they just watched you score an easy bucket and now they have to come back down and try to score again.  While they are trying, you are scoring with ease... off the strength of your ability to fill passing lanes and run.  Never argue with the refs, just run. 

That game plan will defeat most teams before the 2nd half.  By the end of the third qtr, you can put in your 2nd and 3rd team players.

When they had Alex English and Fat Lever, Denver used to do something similar.  The only problems were;

1.  They didn't have defenders. 

2.   NBA Teams were in better shape.

The Lakers (Pat Riley) stole Westhead's offense, slowed it up and called it the fastbreak.

@Diesel

Dude, you said it all right there.  Not to mention, when you're pushing the ball you don't give the defense a lot of time to get set.

There's one interview Magic gave about their dominance that I'll never forget...  He said they would show up knowing they were about to kick someone's ass in their own house.  Teams were shook by that offense.