I don't buy BK's 3 forward theory

[Lascar78]

Quote:

---

At some point, we have to stop duplicating positions and we have to start drafting for NEED so that we can build that team..

---

that's true. But most don't believe we have reached that point. We still don't have a true star, and this is only the 2nd draft of our new try. If we come out of it with the Joshes and Marvin as the 2-3-4 core of our future, it's not exactly a disaster. We still need a PG and a C, but no matter what we will come out of this draft with many needs

I would love to draft Deron for need, but if Williams is the stud they say he is, we have to take him

[Diesel]

So when will they believe...

When we are talking about trading away Smoove to make room for Rudy Gay??

Will that make Believers out of them??

Look at us...

We have LUE at PG... We have DROBS at Center.

How long are you willing to wait to become competitive?

When I buy my ticket...

I don't want to see Smoove on the BENCH and Lue in the game KNOWING we could have Deron and Smoove playing!

How much sense does that make...

How does BK approach that Press conference.....

Reporter: BK, Why Did you pick Marvin Williams...

BK: Well, we felt he had the most upside of anyone in the draft.

Reporter: BK, isn't it true that you already have 5 guys who play Sf... Diaw, Al, Chillz, Smoove, Donta.. AND Woody is trying to change their position and make Diaw a PG, Chillz a SG, and Al A PF even though these guys are neither nor...

Woody: You got that right..

BK: Well, you know, we can't let talent like this pass us by.

Reporter: BUt that's exactly what you said last year after you drafted Chillz and Smoove in the first round and Donta in the second.

BK: Yes and it's still true.

Reporter: So How do you propose to play these guys?

BK: Well, We will have a three headed Forward rotation.. Where two will play and one will sit the bench.

Reporter: Don't you think that it will limit the progress of Smoove ?

BK: Well.. Uhm..

Reporter: How do you plan to address the need at PG, C?

BK: We still have Drobs and Lue.

Reporter: So basically, the same team as last year but Smoove will now play Less? How do you expect to sell this plan to Season ticket holders who expect the Hawks to progress.

BK: Well, I will tell them that we got the best available talent.

Reporter: So if Rudy Gay is the best available talent next year... We take him?

BK: I just see these guys as basketball players... I don't look at positions when i make picks...

Part of building a team is finding the best players at the best positions...

[Lascar78]

I can't speak for anyone else, but personally if we came out of this draft with Smoove-Chill-Marvin-Al for our 2-3-4, I wouldn't accept anything but a PG or a C out of next year's draft. Nobody here is talking about Gay but you

[Wretch]

I like what I'm hearing and seeing in workouts, but I still don't think anyone has proven themselves to be the BPA. Deron has helped himself and Bogut may have cemented himself into Milwaukee's lineup...but we don't know how these guys are going to pan out years from now.

I think the PGs in this draft have as much of a chance to impact a franchise as Williams, so I don't think for a second that he is absolutely the BPA; Kwame was considered BPA over a few guys in 2001...that maybe he shouldn't have. The scouts and GMs are right about one thing and one thing only - the top of the crop. After that, it's up to the player to confound everyone and smack them in the face whilst they defy logic and become the player that SHOULD HAVE been taken ahead of everyone else.

Because of that, I'm all for taking the BPA and so is Billy Knight. Honestly, I think he is the only GM that understands how sh#t works out. So if Marvin is the guy...well, I'm just going to trust BK that he's the guy.

As for what BK says or what he implies...

Bwaaa hahahahahahahahaah!

Man, I have NEVER seen such a tight-rope walker.

[hotboyj]

Get what you can while you can.

Next year there will be no star pg's. If we draft a pg, and it doesn't work out we can always draft Rudy Gay next year.

If Marvin doesn't workout please tell me what kind of pg we can draft next year.

A bird in the hand is worth twice as much than the bird in the bush.

Marvin is still the bird in the bush, since there is nothing there but potential, while Paul and Deron are proven pg's at the hs and college level.

Please BK, draft with your head not your gut. If we miss the next rich man's al harrington, so what, but if we miss the next rich man's jason kidd, or rich man's isaiah thomas, that is something to be pissed about.

[Packfill]

Excellent post. I think people are getting carried away by labeling Marvin as a potential superstar. He clearly is not a can't miss prospect in the LeBron James, Carmelo Anthony sense. The guy is a good athlete (not as good as Smoove) with some good skills, but he could just as easily become Billy Owens (for those that don't remember, he was an extremely talented, multi-skilled player for Syracuse that never lived up to his billing) instead of James Worthy.

Quite frankly, if he were drafted, there is no guarantee he becomes as good a player as Smoove or Harrington - both of whom will improve upon last season (Harrington because of the experience of starting for a year and Smoove because of experience).

The Hawks desperately need a center and a point guard. They are in position to address one of those needss. Both Deron and Paul have demonstrated the ability to be potential superstar point guards.

[Lascar78]

It's not true that Marvin is nothing but potential. Yes he was forced to sit on the bench, but he did produce 11 and 6.6 in just 22 MPG. That's not nothing. Just because we haven't seen him too much doesn't mean he isn't ready to play. This isn't a Kwame who really isn't ready to play and is pure potential. He's already got skills, he's already got a body.

Much in the same way, you don't know what PG's will come to excel and come out in the next year or two. Or which ones we can attract via free agency if the rest of our team is set.

I agree with get what you can while you can. But again, it all comes down to how BK evaluates Marvin's talent and potential. If Marvin is a true superstar in the making while deron is just a solid point guard, then you get the superstar while you can. A single superstar will keep you in contention every year. Now if Deron and Marvin both will be very good but not superstars, of course I want Deron who is the better fit.

You say get what you can while you can, but what superstar are we going to get next year? If Marvin truly is one we have to get him.

I agree with wretch on this one basically. To me it's easy. If there is a big talent/potential gap between Marvin and Deron then we need Marvin. If there is not a big gap, or even if Deron is the best player, take the better fit in Dreon. I don't feel qualified to make the call because I haven't seen both players in person. BK has. I trust him to make the right call.

[AHF]

Potential star PGs likely in next year's draft:

Sergio Rodriguez.

Daniel Gibson.

Rajan Rondo.

Marcus Williams.

Mardy Collins.

Unlike a star at the center position, you shouldn't pretend like good PGs only come once in a blue moon. Look around the league and you'll see a lot of good PGs.

[emeans]

Quote:

---

At some point, we have to stop duplicating positions and we have to start drafting for NEED so that we can build that team.

---

Diesel this is a very true statement and I totally agree. However, this team is not at that point yet. With the exception of Al this team has no locked downed starters and positions. Chillz and Smoove are still rookies and are still going to have to prove themselve in year 2. They both may not be the answer at the 2 and 3 for this team. Once the dust settles from this years draft with the No. 2 pick, we will then need specifically target certain positions. At No. 2 you have to get the best talent.

Also, not only do we need to stop duplicating positions, we need to stop trading the best talent we have every year too. You have to start somewhere. You will never get over the hump.

[Diesel]

Am a fan of Kentucky Basketball.. And AHF you and I both Know that Rondo needs an offensive game. I was so embarrased this year when Rondo was isolated with the ball and dared to score...

Try reading the weaknesses of Rodriguez... It seems to me that all this guy is is flashy... NOt a good PG..

Daniel Gibson? Next.

I think it will be hard to come across a class of PGs this strong!

[Yeti]

" Does anyone really think that Ivey will become a top PG in the NBA? "

No. But I don't think Jack or Nutcracker will either. Deron is the only one I have confidence in.

If Bogut is gone, I want BK to draft Williams. (either one) But I don't think he is going to listen to any of us so ...

yeti

[Diesel]

Emeans.. You will still be able to say that next year.

Let's look at Next year. Rudy Gay is on the board...

We can get him...

Give me your reason why we should pass up the best talent in the draft??

Surely it won't be so that we can trade down and pick up Rondo??

Right now..

I don't see a difference in the talent of MWill and of DWill... While we have this chance to get a talented PG... Why not get TALENT And fill the position at the same time instead of just duplicating another position??

[AHF]

Rondo is going to be a star. He already set the UK single season record for steals and his passing game is very mature. You are right, Deisel, that he desparately needs a jump shot but he scored at his best during the NCAA tournament when he put UK on his back for periods with his drives. He has everything he needs to succeed other than a jump shot (he has the jumping part down as anyone who has seen him finish an alley-oop can attest). I think he will be a superior prospect to TJ Ford, for example.

Rodriguez is now projected by nbadraft.net as the #2 overall pick in the draft. I don't know enough about him to comment but everyone seems to agree that he is a stud.

I won't bother with evaluating the others except to say that I wage that Gibson's evaluation right now is probably ahead of where Deron Williams and Raymond Felton were rated after their freshman years.

Not all these guys will be stars but I bet several of them will - including Rondo.

[emeans]

Again this team needs everything....all positions RIGHT NOW. Next year may be different because we may have solidly filled Gay's position. Like I said earlier Chillz and Smooth may not pan out like we think they will. Right now they both have some MAJOR weaknesses with their game at their positions. Time will only tell.

While I will be the 1st one to say that there are no absolutes when it comes to the draft. I will say this..... Marvin Williams is PROJECTED to be a better player than Deron Williams on the next level.

Again let me preface this by saying that could be totally wrong. Deron could turn out to be better than Marvin, but based on PROJECTIONS, Marvin has the most upside of anyone in this draft and is PROJECTED to be a superstar. Deron is PROJECTED to be a very good player in the NBA. That is why you have to take Marvin.

On a side note, from the little highlights I saw yesterday Marvin looked very good. What impressed me the most was his dribbling through the cones. As he was changing directions on one of his turns he did a behind the back cross-over that was deadly and proceeded to throw it down with a thunder slam. It was impressive!!

He also was consistently hitting the 15 to 20 foot range jumpers with perfect form. I like this kid!!

[Dukegotgame]

i dont understand how some of you guys can rationlize drafting a pg to fill out this team and maybe win 25 games in a lost season anyway when you have the rare chance to draft a potential superstar.

You guys want to complain about how we cant defend the quick guards with a 3 forward lineup. but u fail to mention how a quick guard is going to guard one of those three guys

[Lascar78]

we're at the end of year 1 of rebuilding. It feels like year 6 because of the babcock debacle, but we're at the end of year 1. You can't be impatient now. You have to give at least 2 full years of rebuilding before expecting results in year 3. We're not a storied franchise who can hope to get a player or two and then attract top FA's. We have to do the bulk of our work through the draft before anyone considers us. IF we have the option of drafting a potential superstar, we have to take it. If he really is a superstar, PG's will beg to play with it.

That being said I don't know if Marvin is that guy or not, but I do know that you're being too impatient.

[Diesel]

Nobody here is stating that we pass up James Worthy to take Enis Whatley...

What I am saying is that with the chance to get a potential Superstar at SF/PF (we don't know what position he can play) or a Potential superstar at PG..

We should take the PG..

1. because it's very hard to find a good PG whereas finding a good Sf is a like finding cousins in WV.

2. because Deron fills our need.

3. because we know more about Deron's ability and capabilities than we do about Marvins.

I think the biggest working part of the hype machine on Marvin Williams IS the UNKNOWN...

Really. I think a lot of the guys here are up a tree about MWill because they've never really watched him and they don't know much about him... So they take this ignorance and convert it into potential points.... Surely Deron can't have potential points because we've seen him play and shut down some of the best scorers in college basketball.. Surely he can't have potential points because we know that he is the best floor general in the game...

However, what do you know about Marvin outside of his shot and the ability to dunk?

Lastly...

When My son gets HS age, I'm going to do one of either of these...

1. I will change his name to Ivano Dragnofsky...

2. I will start my own draft board and mention that he is the best prospect that I have seen at this level everytime I write a column.

3. I will put him in a HS that rarely plays against good competition and tell him to try to score 50 a night... Then enter him into the draft and not let him workout against anybody.

4. I will do all of these, then send him to college and make his coach play him off the bench..

Because People love a mystery. We'd rather have what's behind the curtain than a sure thing!

[DawsonsCreek]

So based on your theory its let me exploit you on one end of the floor, so you can exploit me at the other end of the floor? So are u telling me that you would want to have a player like Tyron Lue running the point who has nice offensive skills but is a liablity on defense. Or would u rather have the oppurtunity to have someone who can light it up as much as Tyron and be one of the best defenders in the league at the same time (Deron Williams). I dont understand your theory of you cause problems for me on one end of the court and I cause problems for you on the other end of the court.

[Lascar78]

Quote:

---

What I am saying is that with the chance to get a potential Superstar at SF/PF (we don't know what position he can play) or a Potential superstar at PG..

---

But the thing is you're basically the only one labelling Deron as a potential superstar. I think he's got a potential to be one of the better PGs in the league, but even then you rarely see a superstar PG. Even Kidd can't carry his team very far if he runs into a dominant big. I think Marvin clearly has more superstar potential, even though that doesn't mean he will end up being the better player

Quote:

---

1. I will change his name to Ivano Dragnofsky...

2. I will start my own draft board and mention that he is the best prospect that I have seen at this level everytime I write a column.

3. I will put him in a HS that rarely plays against good competition and tell him to try to score 50 a night... Then enter him into the draft and not let him workout against anybody.

4. I will do all of these, then send him to college and make his coach play him off the bench..

---

I have a somewhat european name and I did score 50 once in high school against weak competition (in France) and probably averaged 30. Why didn't I get drafted dammit? I guess I should have started my own draft board...

[AHF]

Quote:

---

When My son gets HS age, I'm going to do one of either of these...

1. I will change his name to Ivano Dragnofsky...

2. I will start my own draft board and mention that he is the best prospect that I have seen at this level everytime I write a column.

3. I will put him in a HS that rarely plays against good competition and tell him to try to score 50 a night... Then enter him into the draft and not let him workout against anybody.

4. I will do all of these, then send him to college and make his coach play him off the bench..

Because People love a mystery. We'd rather have what's behind the curtain than a sure thing!

---

lol

It will also help if your son is about 7'0'' tall I think.