EazyRoc

Quote: Horford for Bynum. If there weren't big question marks about Bynum's knee, I would do it without thinking twice. However, I don't think I would do it now.

Quote: Quote: Quote: Quote: His game is more balanced than you imply. He takes a lot of jumpshots, that's not all he does. Even then, he shoots jumpshots better than J. Smith by a long shot. Smith is not more of a post option than Aldridge. Aldridge takes most of his shots around the basket, almost half of his shots. Aldridge has a more balanced offensive game, and is a better offensive player despite the 2 FT, and 1.5 assist advantage Smith may have on him. Besides, who says you have to be a back to the basket player to be a center ? You don't have to be a back to the basket player to be a post option either. No one says that you do, but if someone wanted to get a center to let Al "shine" at the power forward position, I'd imagine they were implying a bruising center... otherwise Al is going to be guarded by centers still. Aldridge doesn't take most of his shots around the basket. He takes 65% jump shots. That, by my estimation, is most of his shots. Smith takes slightly below 50% of his shots as jumpers. The fact that he has a "better offensive game" doesn't mean he is more effective. I can understand if you like him but you haven't given a reason as to why he fits better other than to say that he is a post option (which he's not), and has potential (like Smith), and can score and rebound (as well or worse than Smith)... so why would we trade for him other than the fact that you like him better stylistically? Because he's 6'11" with a 7'5" wingspan ? Also, offensively, he is more effective. He shoots a higher FG%, FT %, pulls down more off. rebounds, and his TO/Asst ratio is about equal to J. Smith's. Even if he takes 65% jump shots, he still shoots them at a much higher position than J. Smith. I honestly think that number is closer to 55% or 60%. Well, it is 65%. You can check the stats. I guess we have different definitions of "effective". I think Smith's ability to score inside more often and at a higher rate (and get to the line) makes him more effective, not to mention the assists. You don't, thats fair. I also know that Smith is a more effective defender, although you may like Aldridge's potential there. I guess we will just leave it at a disagreement. I like Smith more because he is more effective now and is a better defender. You like Aldridge more because he is taller, has a longer wingspan, and takes/hits a lot more jumpers. I think Aldridge will be a better post player than J. Smith, and he's already more effective offensively even if Smith gets to the line a few times more, Aldridge shoots a better %. J. Smith's assist mean nothing when he has just as many turnovers to go with it. Their assist/turnover ratio is about the same. He's already a better jumpshooter than Josh Smith. He pulls down more offensive rebounds, and has half the NBA experience Smith has. Aldridge, in my eyes, is clearly the better and more effective offensive player. However, I don't like Aldridge more than Smith. Aldridge is a guy I would seriously consider trading (and probably would) Josh Smith for, but Josh Smith is the better player right (not by a lot though) now and could potentially be much better.

Quote: Quote: His game is more balanced than you imply. He takes a lot of jumpshots, that's not all he does. Even then, he shoots jumpshots better than J. Smith by a long shot. Smith is not more of a post option than Aldridge. Aldridge takes most of his shots around the basket, almost half of his shots. Aldridge has a more balanced offensive game, and is a better offensive player despite the 2 FT, and 1.5 assist advantage Smith may have on him. Besides, who says you have to be a back to the basket player to be a center ? You don't have to be a back to the basket player to be a post option either. No one says that you do, but if someone wanted to get a center to let Al "shine" at the power forward position, I'd imagine they were implying a bruising center... otherwise Al is going to be guarded by centers still. Aldridge doesn't take most of his shots around the basket. He takes 65% jump shots. That, by my estimation, is most of his shots. Smith takes slightly below 50% of his shots as jumpers. The fact that he has a "better offensive game" doesn't mean he is more effective. I can understand if you like him but you haven't given a reason as to why he fits better other than to say that he is a post option (which he's not), and has potential (like Smith), and can score and rebound (as well or worse than Smith)... so why would we trade for him other than the fact that you like him better stylistically? Because he's 6'11" with a 7'5" wingspan ? Also, offensively, he is more effective. He shoots a higher FG%, FT %, pulls down more off. rebounds, and his TO/Asst ratio is about equal to J. Smith's. Even if he takes 65% jump shots, he still shoots them at a much higher position than J. Smith. I honestly think that number is closer to 55% or 60%.

Quote: If he could develop a consistent 3 point shot, I would be satisfied with him as our starting SF. I hope Woodson really encourages Marvin to be aggressive next year. I don't think Marvin should have too much trouble extending his range.

Quote: I believe Sund has stated tha AL is a 5 that can play some 4. That means Smoove is our PF of the future. Smoove is the perfect PF compliment for AL. Smith is not a perfect compliment for Al, in my opinion. Al Horford would play better next to a back to the basket player or atleast a player with ability to score around the basket. Someone with height so that our team won't consistently get taken advantage of. I think Josh Smith would play better with player if he didn't have to play the 4. Despite what many people might think, I believe Josh Smith could play the 3 in a year or so. He could play the position now defensively, although he isn't the best perimeter defender. You swap AK-47 out for J. Smith and Utah'll probably make it to the Finals next year.

Quote: Quote: Quote: Quote: LaMarcus Aldridge is still a young player and has made drastic improvements in every category except FG% and BPG. He's an offensive big that can score that is a decent rebounder. I think his defense and rebounding will improve, and so will his offense. I can easily see him averaging 18-20 ppg with 7-9 rpg. He's a long player (see 7'5" wingspan), athletic, and young. This is all true. The question is, why would we trade Josh for him? He is a better shooter, yes, but he isn't a better offensive player (same ppg, same efficiency, fewer TOs fewer assists). He isn't a terrible rebounder but he is naturallly a worse rebounder than Josh, especially on D, and Smith could be a better offensive rebounder of we didn't design our halfcourt set to have Chil act as a post player. Aldridge has defensive potential, but his potential doesn't match up to what Smith offers right now. He's athletic, Smith is more athletic. He's young but he's half a year older than Smith. My point is this. Aldridge is a nice player. He is the perfect power forward on that team because he can score without getting in Roy or Oden's way. He isn't better than Smith though, and if the whole point of trading Smith for a center is to get a traditional low post banger, why would we trade Smith for a guy who is a worse inside player, worse rebounder, and worse defender? Aldridge scores more efficiently in the paint. The purpose in trading Josh Smith is to bring in a good, young big. He averaged 17 and 7 in his second year in the league, man. He's going to get bigger, and his defense will improve. Josh Smith might be better than Aldridge, but Aldridge brings size, scoring, and solid rebounding with potential to get better. It's not an equal trade, but I would do it. Aldridge will be a good player in this league and we can finaly fill our C position with a young, athletic player. We'd have a solid combo with LaMarcus Aldridge and Al Horford, and our offense would be much better with the addition of a post option. This will eliminate the "problem" we have at the 4 spot. Horford is more of a center than Aldridge. Smith is more of a center than Aldridge. 65% of Aldridge's shots are jump shots, if you think he's a post option you obviously haven't watched him. Also, he's not actually a more efficient scorer than Smith. His FG% is 2% higher but he gets significantly fewer free throws which is a way to increase the amount of points you have per possessions. Again, Smith is more of a post option than Aldridge. Aldridge isn't younger than Smith and doesn't have more potential. I would understand if he was a true center who played with his back to the basket but he is primarily a jump shooter out of the high post. Why trade your power forward for a "center" who isn't as good at any center duties? His game is more balanced than you imply. He takes a lot of jumpshots, that's not all he does. Even then, he shoots jumpshots better than J. Smith by a long shot. Smith is not more of a post option than Aldridge. Aldridge takes most of his shots around the basket, almost half of his shots. Aldridge has a more balanced offensive game, and is a better offensive player despite the 2 FT, and 1.5 assist advantage Smith may have on him. Besides, who says you have to be a back to the basket player to be a center ? You don't have to be a back to the basket player to be a post option either.

Quote: Anyone who doesn't think Josh Smith is a top 2 defender on the Hawks is showing their agenda against the guy. The guy was a DPOTY candidate for the entire league. He's the only defender in the league I've seen that can consistently take away a fast break opportunity seeing that most NBA Players are unstoppable going to the rim in the open court. The way he alters shots, plays passing lanes, etc. You've gotta be kidding me saying he's not top 2 on the Hawks That's great and all, but what about his post defense ? or his perimeter defense ? You can't fault people for choosing our best post defender or our best perimeter defender. J. Smith isn't either one, so therefore some people might not pick him.

Quote: Quote: LaMarcus Aldridge is still a young player and has made drastic improvements in every category except FG% and BPG. He's an offensive big that can score that is a decent rebounder. I think his defense and rebounding will improve, and so will his offense. I can easily see him averaging 18-20 ppg with 7-9 rpg. He's a long player (see 7'5" wingspan), athletic, and young. This is all true. The question is, why would we trade Josh for him? He is a better shooter, yes, but he isn't a better offensive player (same ppg, same efficiency, fewer TOs fewer assists). He isn't a terrible rebounder but he is naturallly a worse rebounder than Josh, especially on D, and Smith could be a better offensive rebounder of we didn't design our halfcourt set to have Chil act as a post player. Aldridge has defensive potential, but his potential doesn't match up to what Smith offers right now. He's athletic, Smith is more athletic. He's young but he's half a year older than Smith. My point is this. Aldridge is a nice player. He is the perfect power forward on that team because he can score without getting in Roy or Oden's way. He isn't better than Smith though, and if the whole point of trading Smith for a center is to get a traditional low post banger, why would we trade Smith for a guy who is a worse inside player, worse rebounder, and worse defender? Aldridge scores more efficiently in the paint. The purpose in trading Josh Smith is to bring in a good, young big. He averaged 17 and 7 in his second year in the league, man. He's going to get bigger, and his defense will improve. Josh Smith might be better than Aldridge, but Aldridge brings size, scoring, and solid rebounding with potential to get better. It's not an equal trade, but I would do it. Aldridge will be a good player in this league and we can finaly fill our C position with a young, athletic player. We'd have a solid combo with LaMarcus Aldridge and Al Horford, and our offense would be much better with the addition of a post option. This will eliminate the "problem" we have at the 4 spot.

Quote: Quote: Quote: Quote: Sooner or later we have to face the fact that we have 2 power forwards in Smoove and Al. We desperately need a real center who can play tough D and move AL to the #4. I love Smoove and all, but we have 2 PF's and we only need one. Why not trade Smoove for a real center? Until we do, we will always have this problem. If we could get LaMarcus Aldridge or Okafor (maybe) I might be on board, but until everybody in the league has a dominant C, I don't think it's mandatory. I think a Center that's average to above average will do. I liked how Boston used Perkins. He didn't have to play all the time and some times, they went to smaller lineups. I mean Powe is a monster. I think we can be the same way... However, we do need a part time C who can give us good minutes. That guy might be Solo if he can bulk up. I would love to get LaMarcus Aldridge for Josh Smith. Okafor wouldn't be bad either, but he doesn't have the offensive game that Aldridge has. I definitely wouldn't be against trading Smith for a young big, but they'd have to be pretty good. You do realize that for all the bitching about Smith's shooting efficiency and rebounding, he scores at a comparable rate to Aldridge (2% lower but 2 more FTs than Aldridge), rebounds at a higher rate (lower offensively but MUCH higher defensively - 1.6 more Drebds), and on top of that is a far superior defender and shot-creator, right? I think Hawks' fans obssession with Aldridge sort of shows the "grass is greener" phenomenon regarding Smith. Beyond that, if the goal of getting a 5 is to move Horford to 4, we should probably get one who isn't softer than the Huggies Bear. Horford would still get guarded by centers because Aldridge doesn't like to bang, and Horford would still have to guard centers because, well, Aldridge doesn't like to bang. Centers I would definitely be willing to let go of Josh for are: Dwight Yao Duncan Oden Centers I would consider fair value but wouldn't necessarilly want a trade for are: Bynum Jefferson Bosh (although he won't have to play C much longer) Amare Centers I'd need some BIG incentive to pull the trigger for: Biedrins (limited on offense, weak on D) Okafor (little show of improvement, injury prone) Kaman (makes Smith seem like a cerebral player, not particularly efficient for a low post C, never had a particularly special season until Brand went out) Aldridge (Robert Parrish without the defense, rebounding, or toughness) LaMarcus Aldridge is still a young player and has made drastic improvements in every category except FG% and BPG. He's an offensive big that can score that is a decent rebounder. I think his defense and rebounding will improve, and so will his offense. I can easily see him averaging 18-20 ppg with 7-9 rpg. He's a long player (see 7'5" wingspan), athletic, and young. Okafor might be a reach, but I'd still consider it. I wouldn't trade for Kaman or Beidrins straight up.

Quote: Quote: Sooner or later we have to face the fact that we have 2 power forwards in Smoove and Al. We desperately need a real center who can play tough D and move AL to the #4. I love Smoove and all, but we have 2 PF's and we only need one. Why not trade Smoove for a real center? Until we do, we will always have this problem. If we could get LaMarcus Aldridge or Okafor (maybe) I might be on board, but until everybody in the league has a dominant C, I don't think it's mandatory. I think a Center that's average to above average will do. I liked how Boston used Perkins. He didn't have to play all the time and some times, they went to smaller lineups. I mean Powe is a monster. I think we can be the same way... However, we do need a part time C who can give us good minutes. That guy might be Solo if he can bulk up. I would love to get LaMarcus Aldridge for Josh Smith. Okafor wouldn't be bad either, but he doesn't have the offensive game that Aldridge has. I definitely wouldn't be against trading Smith for a young big, but they'd have to be pretty good.

Quote: Hawks.com has JJ listed at 6'7 while Marvin is 6'9. So you're telling me that Marvin wears 1 3/4" higher shoes than JJ? Height has very little do to with getting your shot blocked. Timing is SIGNIFICANTLY more important. There have been hundreds of little guys that were able to get their shots off without being blocked in the history of the NBA. Conversely you don't have to be tall to be a shot blocker. Josh Smith is only 6'9 but he has incredible timing and that makes him a great shot blocker. Marvin Williams is 6'7" without shoes. Joe Johnson is 6'6.75" without shoes. Pre-Draft Measurements

Quote: Quote: Quote: Al Horford and Joe Johnson No doubt. Those who argue for Josh Smith are letting the flashiness of his weakside help cloud their memory of his on ball defense. Sure, JS racks up the blocks and steals, but he also is an average on ball defender and often leaves his man with an open lane to the basket or an easy rebound when he goes for the block/steal. Let's not confuse sound defender with flashy defender. Don't let stats or empirical evidence get in the the way of your midwest-inspired common sense. By the way, Horford has the tools to be a good defender but at this point he gets lit up as much as anyone else. This board is funny, it makes me feel like a Smith-homer and Horford hater because if you came on here having not watched a Hawks game you'd think that Smith was a poor man's Solomon Jones and Horford was Tim Duncan. Horford doesn't get lit up like everyone else. The only person I can think of who had an uncharacteristically good night against Horford was Drew Gooden.

Al Horford and Joe Johnson Al Horford came in and was instantly our best post defender. He also has great lateral quickness allowing him to slide the guard after a pick n roll or something. He also boxes out and prevents offensive rebounds. Joe Johnson is our best perimeter defender on most nights. He has his nights when his D isn't great, but he's definitely our 2nd best defender.

Quote: Quote: It would almost be poetic to get rid of Marvin. Think about it. Marvin represents the biggest of BK's failure. Nah, I think that Shelden Williams was BK's biggest failures! I agree.

Hilarious.

Quote: Since Law and Horford's unofficial nickname is "Law and Order", rename the "Highlight Factory" to "The Hall of Justice". Start calling JJ "Judge Johnson", playing off of his initials. His play determines the fate of the Hawks anyway, so the name fits him. I guess that would make Marvin "the Sheriff" . . or better yet, call him "The Prosecutor". Bibby would be "Dime the Bounty Hunter". Oh god!

Summer League Starting Lineup PG: Acie Law SG: Mario West SF: Jeremy Richardson PF: Al Horford C: Solomon Jones

I think we should replace that empty spot on our bench with a coach that's going to work on everyone's jumpshot.

Derrick Rose, man. Beasley is going to able to score and will be a solid rebounder, but I just get the feeling he'll never be any good on defense. Derrick Rose is a potential do-it-all superstar PG. He can penetrate off the dribble and is a great finisher. He is a floor general with good vision and a pass first mentality. He's a solid defender now with potential to be great and he has a 6'8" wingspan. He'll definitely be one of the most athletic point guards in the league. He's got good strength, and will probably be able to post up smaller PGs. As long as he stays healthy, I can see him being every bit as good as Chris Paul or Deron Williams.

Quote: Quote: Horford will have SIGNIFICANTLY less competition to make the All Star Game at Center than Smoove will have a forward. There are 4 forward spots, 4 guard spots, 2 center spots and 2 at large spots. At forward, Garnett, LeBron, Pierce and Bosh are virtual locks for the All Star game. If Vince Carter is listed at forward, you can throw him in too. That doesn't even include R. Jefferson, Lewis, Turkoglu or Iguodala. At Center, D Howard is a lock as the starter but after that you have Okafor, Bogut, Dalembert, Ilgauskas, and MAYBE J. O'Neal (depending on whether he is listed at Center or forward) for Horford to compete with. I think Horford is going to match the 14/11 that Okafor put up last year at a minimum. If he does that and we are winning, I think that might be enough to get him in. Josh Smith also has a singificantly higher ceiling. Josh Smith plays like a top 5 player in this entire league when he plays with a high BBIQ. I don't think the difference in overall potential is not as significant as you describe it. Also, Josh Smith rarely plays with a high "BBIQ" and even when he does, he's certainly not a top 5 player in the league. I picked Al Horford, because I think all Horford will be a better PF than Josh Smith. I think he'll be better at PF than Smith will be at SF, as well. This all depends on whether or not Josh Smith plays under control and develops a jumpshot.

Quote: Quote: Diop isn't an all star, but out of the crop of free agent big men, he's definitely the best post defender. He is one of the better post defenders in the league, and a solid rebounder. He may not be much on offense, but we need a big post defender/rebounder. I remember that one of the San Antonio players publicly said that he was kind of happy with the Dallas/ NJ trade because Diop was one guy that gave them some trouble. Diop is not an offensive threat, but he does bring solid rebounding and post defense to the table. It was Tony Parker.

Quote: Quote: Quote: We will not lose fans. I love Smoove but no one is going to Phillips Arena to see Smoove. That's what the Falcons thought about Michael Vick and it would be the same situation with the Hawks and Smoove. I fully expect Smoove to be resigned next year though. Why do so many of you guys insist on comparing Vick to Smoove. Vick was an all world talent. He was the falcons, he was the best player on the team without a doubt. JJ is the superstar on this team. People will support the Hawks as long as we are winning. As our record got better attendance got better, but again this is Atlanta. I agree. I don't think Josh Smith has a great impact on attendance for the Hawks like Vick had with the Falcons. People didn't come out to watch the Hawks that much last year, and I think the increase in attendance will have more to do with a great playoff showing.

Quote: Anderon is gone now. Maglore is GARBAGE. Im not sure what the big Diop fascination is, he is a big time underachiever and has never really done anything. I think Okafor is unrealistic. Now Prysbilla is a great defensive player and Foster is a good rebounder. The problem is can they stay healthy. My choice out of all those guys is Prysbilla. I wonder what we have that could get him though? Diop isn't an all star, but out of the crop of free agent big men, he's definitely the best post defender. He is one of the better post defenders in the league, and a solid rebounder. He may not be much on offense, but we need a big post defender/rebounder.

Quote: Anthony needs a fresh start and I believe Marvin needs a fresh start on another team as well. Carmelo gives Joe Johnson a young 'veteran' scorer who can create on his own and demand double teams.. Is this possible? And would Carmelo be a good fit in Atlanta.. It may not be possible, but I would do it in a heartbeat.

Quote: Quote: First if all if I'm a Griz fan, I would be call for Chis Wallace's (Memphis GM) head! What a bad move spending all that potential FA money on Marc Gasol. A guy who hasnt proven anything in this league. But if this is creditable I'm happy 5yr-62mil is fine with me Gasol thing is true because I heard that the Andersen signing was to replace Gasol. Gasol is a nice player, he's not his brother but he is a solid Center and much tougher and give you guys a legit Center which many teams lack. Great signing maybe not for your cap though. Rumor has it your trying to get the #2 pick. Beasley, Gasol, Gay, Miller(Crit likely), and Conley is a nice squad. Similar to NJ Nets in the 90's before Drazen died. Get a good coach in there and your foutunes could be turned. You guys have nice guard depth and I like Darko off the bench. Edit: I skimmed over your sentence, I didn't read it. I notice your not a Griz fan like I assumed. New Rumor..Philly is still interested in Josh Smith. ESPN