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ZaZa and Sheldon ARE TERRIBLE

Dukegotgame

By Dukegotgame
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Dukegotgame Newbie

Dukegotgame

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lol yeah i am a huge duke fan and honestly i dont care. i have always called him sheldon for some reason, even though i know it is wrong. but i am pretty sure everyone knows who i am talking about, its not really a big deal.

if it's not a big deal, then why don't you just spell it with an E lol.

its become a habit by now. i type it that way without realizing it.
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macdaddy Grand Master

macdaddy

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Shelden isn't terrible. He doesn't have the athleticism of Horford but Shelden is one of the more fundamentally sound players on the team. If he played for the Spurs you'd be saying we need to get this guy because he's the tough defensive minded big we need.

Obviously I like Shelden, but at the same time the draft of Shelden over Roy is the much bigger mistake that choosing Marvin over Paul.

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AHF Grand Master

AHF

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If he played for the Spurs you'd be saying we need to get this guy because he's the tough defensive minded big we need.

His inability to be a deterrent in the paint has been his chief failing, IMO. He does pretty well bodying up against his man but can be driven on with impunity by smaller players. The facial Richard Jefferson delivered on him on Saturday was brutal.

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Atlantaholic Grand Master

Atlantaholic

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Shelden isn't terrible. He doesn't have the athleticism of Horford but Shelden is one of the more fundamentally sound players on the team. If he played for the Spurs you'd be saying we need to get this guy because he's the tough defensive minded big we need.

Obviously I like Shelden

I would really love to have some of the stuff you must be smoking to say this... Shelden's pet move is having rebounds go through his hands and bounce on his shoulder, arms and/or head. He has 0, absolutely NO offensive moves whatsoever, and even when by some miracle he gets an offensive board, he can't follow up and finish because, trying his hardest, he can barely dunk.

Not to mention he was the freaking 5th pick. I mean even if he had been the 55th pick in the draft, his play would still have to be considered pathetic

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macdaddy Grand Master

macdaddy

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Getting dunked on by RJ isn't a legitimate reason to say he's terrible. Watch the clip again. Exactly who is Marvin guarding as RJ blows by him walking straight down the lane.

Since Youtube clips are the true measure of how good someone is her is Shelden's contradicting the notion that he can barely dunk:

hereyougo

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AHF Grand Master

AHF

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Since Youtube clips are the true measure of how good someone is

Youtube clips can be incredibly misleading since their sample size is miniscule. The problem is that players much smaller than Jefferson are not intimidated in the slightest from driving on Shelden. The clip that would most represent my frustration with Shelden's lack of interior presence would be one where a modestly athletic point guard comes down the lane and Shelden does little to deter a shot in the paint.

On the Youtube side, there are an abundance of clips you could pick but the fans of this team watch every game and it is the non-highlight layups that are the biggest problem with his interior defense.

Regarding the clip you ran, I wish we saw dunks like that regularly from Shelden but we don't. His effective FG% on inside shots (including dunks and tips) is only 40%.

http://www.82games.com/0708/07ATL12A.HTM

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AHF Grand Master

AHF

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Exactly who is Marvin guarding as RJ blows by him walking straight down the lane.

Marvin is guarding Marcus Williams. He doesn't do anything wrong on that play by failing to come over and triple team Jefferson with Childress and AJ.

Childress and AJ double Jefferson which creates the breakdown on D. Chill goes from doubling Jefferson to releasing him down the lane when AJ goes to cover the unguarded Kidd.

Shelden goes to try to stop him and gets killed but you are right that this hardly puts him in bad company. Again, it is not the highlight that is the problem so much as the routine plays where he fails to intimidate guys in the paint. As a two-time DPOY at Duke, I hoped for more.

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macdaddy Grand Master

macdaddy

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I was being sarcastic about youtube.

There is a difference between calling someone terrible or useless and having weaknesses as a player. No one is going to scare an nba player with a wide open lane to the hoop.

Shelden is playing well defensively this year. Measuring his offensive stats is not really fair as he doesn't touch the ball unless he gets an offensive rebound. Which is difficult because Woody likes to keep the big men at the top of they key.

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AHF Grand Master

AHF

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There is a difference between calling someone terrible or useless and having weaknesses as a player.

I wouldn't go so far as to call Shelden terrible or useless. He clearly isn't useless.

However, I am very dissappointed with the fact that the area where he was supposed to make the biggest impact (interior defense) has been an area of weakness when he is not able to put a body on his own man in the paint. When he is in the game, I see him as a minor upgrade from Zaza in terms of his help defense when guys penetrate. Neither guy deters anyone (whether they are Darrell Armstrong or Richard Jefferson) from driving down the lane.

Zaza is useless when his passing, shooting and dribbling are like they are right now but when he is playing better he is a useful backup big man, IMO. Shelden is a decent rebounder and will be a role player in the NBA for a long time.

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DJlaysitup Newbie

DJlaysitup

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...Zaza is useless when his passing, shooting and dribbling are like they are right now but when he is playing better he is a useful backup big man, IMO. Shelden is a decent rebounder and will be a role player in the NBA for a long time.

.

I agree that his passing and shooting are off and that hurts him right now. The thing I'm most dissappointed in though is his inability (or outright reluctance) to adapt his role and be a team player defensively.

I sorta gave him a pass on the defensive end before this year because I had a suspicion that Woody may have told him to try to stay out of foul trouble (due to our lack backup bigs). I was really hoping that, once we got more depth Zaza would "switch gears" and be a lot tougher and aggressive on D in the paint. That he would adapt his style for the good of the team. I haven't seen that at all. If anything it's my gut feeling that he is playing more for himself.

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Highpozt Newbie

Highpozt

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Is there an NBADLer waiting for a Call Up. Lance Allred is averaging 19 PPG and 10 RPG. He is 6'11" 250. Then there is Ian Mahinmi from France at 18 PPG and 7 RPG. The question is are they any better than Za Za and Lo Wright. Even if thier skill set is not better will they give that hustle and energy we need in the paint??

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coachx Newbie

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Which is difficult because Woody likes to keep the big men at the top of they key.

No, Woody likes to keep big men without any offensive post game at the top of the key so they are not in the way of the slashers. Then Shelden can crash the boards for offensive rebounds by being able to react to what side of the rim the ball may bounce off of. If Sheldon had any resemblancce of an offensive post game he would be in the post but since he does not he would just be in the way down there.

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coachx Newbie

coachx

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Is there an NBADLer waiting for a Call Up. Lance Allred is averaging 19 PPG and 10 RPG. He is 6'11" 250. Then there is Ian Mahinmi from France at 18 PPG and 7 RPG. The question is are they any better than Za Za and Lo Wright. Even if thier skill set is not better will they give that hustle and energy we need in the paint??

Here are few more. Anyone know nything about these guys other then their season stats ?

I would love to see what kind of #'s Solo would put up in the D-League.

Alexander- 7'1'', 260lbs

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...chris_alexander

Mahini- 6'11'', 230 lbs:

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...yer=ian_mahinmi

Benson- 6'10'', 225 lbs

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...ayer=rod_benson

Turner- 6'11'', 240 lbs

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...er=larry_turner

Sene (of the Sonics)- 6'11'', 230 lbs

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...r=mouhamed_sene

Allred: 6'11'',250 lbs

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...er=lance_allred

Hagen- 7', 270 lbs

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/inde...ayer=jeff_hagen

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coachx Newbie

coachx

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Alexander seeme intriguing b/c of his size here is more o hi orm his 2003 scouting report out of college. (He has gained 20 lbs since then).

http://www.nba.com/draft2003/profiles/AlexanderChris.html

More on Hagan:

http://www.nba.com/timberwolves/wolves/sum...jeff_hagen.html

Sounds like Hagan was maybe a 2nd round pick by the T-Wolves in 2005 or made the team as an undrafted FA. Did not do much n college other then lead the Big 10 in BPG. Pure role player.

Could he challenge inside shots better then ZaZa or Sheldon ?

At least he has length.

I just learned Turner is property of the Lakers but do not see where any team has the rights to Hagan or Alexander. With both of them being a legit 7' I would think they think would be signed by some NBA team.

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DrReality Rookie

DrReality

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Whether they have talent is one thing but whether Woody would give them minutes is a different one. Having them joion the club mid-season and be able to play is all but a fantasy. I'd love to see it, but . . . . . won't happen.

I posted about out Jackie Butler who is a FA. Apparently he was an attitude problem in Houston?

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