We must move Marvin and Bibby!

[Johnnybravo4]

The Hawks are at a crossroads. We have a lot of young talent who are on the verge of leaving their rookie contracts. We thus must decide whether this team can compete as is or do we move some of our contracts for veteran(or better) players. I don't think anyone would argue that we are a playoff contender as constructed. Our young players may develop and become stars but we are flawed in a couple of areas, namely post offense/defense and pg. If we concede that we can't compete as constructed, then we have to move players or be stuck in a situation where we would be paying over 50 million for our flawed starting 5.

Bibby 7 million (new contract)

Smoove 12 million (5yrs 60 million

Marvin 8 million (5 years 40 Million

Horford 4 million (rookie contract)

JJ 14 Million (2 years remaining)

Keep in mind that Chills would get probably and additional 6 mil per year and we also have to reconsider extending JJ. And this doesn't even take into account the rest of the bench. With this lineup we could be in the luxury tax before we add any significant bench pieces and future draft pics.

Our only hope to become better and keep salary from approaching Knicks proportions would be to move Marvin and Bibby.

Some will advocate moving Smoove because of his inconsistent play and higher profile. However, moving Josh Smith would have a negative affect on our fan base, and trading him would not improve our cap situation unless we traded him for expirers, which makes no sense for a team that is not trying to rebuild, but load up.

On the other hand a Marvin/Bibby combination has a lot of appeal and will maximize our trade potential. Marvin is attractive because he is a young improving player, and his draft status marks him as a potential franchise player. Another city could embrace him and justify it as a "change in scenery" could make him a better player.

Bibby is attractive because he is a solid player with a large expiring contract. Teams that are rebuilding (Knicks and Indy for example) could use his contract to clear up capspace to attract free agents or to move disgruntled players.

You all already know about my Indy idea Marvin/Bibby for O'neal so I won't bring that up this time. But I have another alternative.

In NY it is no secret that D'antoni wants a pg to replace Marbury and he needs a young piece to rally the Knicks fans so to speak. So a good trade could be

Bibby

Marvin to NYC

Curry

Malik Rose

Nate Robinson

1st round pick in 2009

Why NY does it. They get an expiring pg in Bibby, who actually can play pg and could thrive in D'antoni's shoot first system. They get Marvin Williams who they can plug in at SF or PF and could either serve as their go to guy or a #2 option to Zach Randolph. They move Curry who didn't mesh well with Randolph and they move the expiring contract of Allen, (7mill) who they probably wouldn't resign anyway. So to sum, they get rid of Curry, get 18 million in expirng contracts, and they get Marvin. Bibby also allows them to move Marbury without turning the team over to Nate.

Why we do it. With Curry and Allen we get Some size up front, with post offense with Curry and toughness and rebounding with Rose. Horford could move to PF. We also get some scoring punch off the bench with Robinson. And if we get them to throw in the #1 pick in 2009 it is a steal, since the Knicks will probably suck next year as well as they try to dump salaries. The Knicks are real vulnerable right now and we should take advantage.

New lineup

Law/Robinson

JJ/West

Smoove/Childress

Horford/Allen

Curry/Andersen/Zaza

I think Horford would makeup for Curry's defensive and rebounding shortcomings and Curry's post offense will free up more space for JJ. I think hiring Avery Johnson would make this work better. If he can get the Mavs to play D, I am sure he could get Curry to do so.

[hussamga]

Last year memphis, miami, and seattle went the rebuilding route letting veterans go cheap.

This year, look for New York, Phoenix, Denver and possibly couple other teams to let guys go..so there should be some valuable veterans available to use bibby.

[dig]

Eddy Curry is one of my least favorite players in the League... he's overpaid (and for four years), slow, doesn't play defense, can't rebound (despite being 6'11), and NEVER gets back in transition... it's like 5 on 4 for the first 10 secs. He is the most one-dimensional player in the league, in that his only skill is that he has a good low post game with soft hands (until he's double-teamed and all hell breaks loose). Oh yeah, he's also a moron who's in constant foul trouble, and still considered a bit of an injury risk. NO THANKS...

btw. Nate Robinson is a good bench scoring dynamite option (sort of what Speedy was before he came here), but I think he's one of the few guys D'Antoni will want to keep. And I think the Knicks still owe someone a first round pick in 09 or 10 (not 100% sure)...

[TruJerz]

Even though I dont see the need to move Bibby or Marvin, I wouldnt mind taking the risk to make that trade with the Knicks. Nate Robinson is a nice piece and will run and push the ball more than Bibby and he can also shoot it from the outside pretty well too. Curry is the real gamble because he is a inconsistent big man who is paid alot. but i think he can help even though he cant run much..he can be the trailer man on the fast break and he will make us better in the half court downlow where he is a force. I like the idea of having a starting lineup of Nate Robinson/Acie Law, Joe Johnson, JSmooth, Horford and Curry but i will admit that it is a bit risky though. And also I think a draft pick was involved in the trade so thats really why I would pull the trigger. But I still want to see what this team can do with Bibby 100% for an entire season. Oh and I would only trade for O'Neal if we got back a draft pick

[Zone034life]

Quote:

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The Hawks are at a crossroads. We have a lot of young talent who are on the verge of leaving their rookie contracts. We thus must decide whether this team can compete as is or do we move some of our contracts for veteran(or better) players. I don't think anyone would argue that we are a playoff contender as constructed. Our young players may develop and become stars but we are flawed in a couple of areas, namely post offense/defense and pg. If we concede that we can't compete as constructed, then we have to move players or be stuck in a situation where we would be paying over 50 million for our flawed starting 5.

Bibby 7 million (new contract)

Smoove 12 million (5yrs 60 million

Marvin 8 million (5 years 40 Million

Horford 4 million (rookie contract)

JJ 14 Million (2 years remaining)

Keep in mind that Chills would get probably and additional 6 mil per year and we also have to reconsider extending JJ. And this doesn't even take into account the rest of the bench. With this lineup we could be in the luxury tax before we add any significant bench pieces and future draft pics.

Our only hope to become better and keep salary from approaching Knicks proportions would be to move Marvin and Bibby.

Some will advocate moving Smoove because of his inconsistent play and higher profile. However, moving Josh Smith would have a negative affect on our fan base, and trading him would not improve our cap situation unless we traded him for expirers, which makes no sense for a team that is not trying to rebuild, but load up.

On the other hand a Marvin/Bibby combination has a lot of appeal and will maximize our trade potential. Marvin is attractive because he is a young improving player, and his draft status marks him as a potential franchise player. Another city could embrace him and justify it as a "change in scenery" could make him a better player.

Bibby is attractive because he is a solid player with a large expiring contract. Teams that are rebuilding (Knicks and Indy for example) could use his contract to clear up capspace to attract free agents or to move disgruntled players.

You all already know about my Indy idea Marvin/Bibby for O'neal so I won't bring that up this time. But I have another alternative.

In NY it is no secret that D'antoni wants a pg to replace Marbury and he needs a young piece to rally the Knicks fans so to speak. So a good trade could be

Bibby

Marvin to NYC

Curry

Malik Rose

Nate Robinson

1st round pick in 2009

Why NY does it. They get an expiring pg in Bibby, who actually can play pg and could thrive in D'antoni's shoot first system. They get Marvin Williams who they can plug in at SF or PF and could either serve as their go to guy or a #2 option to Zach Randolph. They move Curry who didn't mesh well with Randolph and they move the expiring contract of Allen, (7mill) who they probably wouldn't resign anyway. So to sum, they get rid of Curry, get 18 million in expirng contracts, and they get Marvin. Bibby also allows them to move Marbury without turning the team over to Nate.

Why we do it. With Curry and Allen we get Some size up front, with post offense with Curry and toughness and rebounding with Rose. Horford could move to PF. We also get some scoring punch off the bench with Robinson. And if we get them to throw in the #1 pick in 2009 it is a steal, since the Knicks will probably suck next year as well as they try to dump salaries. The Knicks are real vulnerable right now and we should take advantage.

New lineup

Law/Robinson

JJ/West

Smoove/Childress

Horford/Allen

Curry/Andersen/Zaza

I think Horford would makeup for Curry's defensive and rebounding shortcomings and Curry's post offense will free up more space for JJ. I think hiring Avery Johnson would make this work better. If he can get the Mavs to play D, I am sure he could get Curry to do so.

Yeah I could see both of those guys being moved in the off season. I would do it for players such as J.O'neal, Micheal Redd and Baron Davis. Those are some of the players who may be available this offseason.

I can't agree with Eddie Curry though. The Hawks need defense and rebounding help down low and he doesn't bring either. The player I like on the knicks, David Lee, may not have a role on the Hawks and the knicks will keep him. I could see one of them being moved to Portland as well.

Marvin

for

C.Frye

James Jones

Two 09 second round picks(Joey Dorsey, Sonny Weems, Sasha Kaun,Richard Roby,etc.)

This trade could really help both teams. The Hawks get a guy in Frye who can shoot from the perimeter and be a decent rebounder. James Jones has the kind of three point stroke the Hawks need off the bench. Please don't underrate this years second round. There will be players to be had who could come in and provide depth off the bench. Joey Dorsey(the next Milsap and Maxiell) in particular. Frye and Jones also are in the final year of there contract so you can get a chance to see if they are worthy of giving extensions or just letting them come off the books. The Blazers get the SF they have been searching for. Marvin being closer to home may help him play with more passion and aggression like he did in Seattle that one game.

[FrankWhite]

You've gotta be kidding me with this trade.

[Diesel]

Quote:

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Eddy Curry is one of my least favorite players in the League... he's overpaid (and for four years), slow, doesn't play defense, can't rebound (despite being 6'11), and NEVER gets back in transition... it's like 5 on 4 for the first 10 secs. He is the most one-dimensional player in the league, in that his only skill is that he has a good low post game with soft hands (until he's double-teamed and all hell breaks loose). Oh yeah, he's also a moron who's in constant foul trouble, and still considered a bit of an injury risk. NO THANKS...

btw. Nate Robinson is a good bench scoring dynamite option (sort of what Speedy was before he came here), but I think he's one of the few guys D'Antoni will want to keep. And I think the Knicks still owe someone a first round pick in 09 or 10 (not 100% sure)...

Yeah...

Eddy Curry put the So in Sorry!

I'm not so high on Nate Robinson either.

If you were to say Zach Randolph and David Lee, now we're talking

[pimp]

Lee, Balkman, and Chandler are the only players i would want off their roster.

I would take Qrich in a deal, if they would take Speedy

[exodus]

You are nothing if not consistent. If there is an overpriced, no defense chucker with an attitude problem out there you want to trade for him.

What is Franchise up to now? Do you still want Marbury?

I am fine with trading Marvin and Bibby but only to get quality back. This deal doesn't do that.

[frosgrim]

I would never trade for Curry. Guy is a locker-room cancer, doesn't give a damn about playing and makes way too much money.

However, you bring up a slightly interesting idea.

If the Pacers really are looking to clear the books, why not offer Bibby and Claxton to O'Neil? The Pacers get to clear some salary off the team and get to see what Bibby can do for them. Claxton is thrown in to make the salaries work. Heck, they can have Zaza as well. JO, when healthy, is a good player, but the problem is that he can't stay healthy. When he gets back into the game he's not in sync with the game due to all the injuries. That said, JO would give the Hawks what the team needs in terms of a post presence, even if its for 24 minutes a night. I am in no way enthralled with this trade idea, but its something that would work.

[JackB1]

2 problems with this....

#1 - Curry is not good enough to start. Curry/Horford at the 5 and 4 is not really better than

Horford/Smoove

#2 - Smoove will not work at the #3 with his bad handle and bad jump shooting. To me,

moving Smoove to the 3 will only encourage more of this. He needs to work on his post

game more.....not his jumpers.

[frosgrim]

Quote:

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2 problems with this....

#1 - Curry is not good enough to start. Curry/Horford at the 5 and 4 is not really better than

Horford/Smoove

#2 - Smoove will not work at the #3 with his bad handle and bad jump shooting. To me,

moving Smoove to the 3 will only encourage more of this. He needs to work on his post

game more.....not his jumpers.

Huh? I said I would never trade for Curry. Adding JO is an option for adding a post player, but he'd only play 24 or so minutes a game rotating through the C/PF positions with Horford and Smith. I don't see how Smith would go out to SF for long stretches in that scenario.

[cowa]

NY would move Curry for Zaza and Speedy. No need to move Bibby and Marvin in that scenario. Not that I'm advocating trading for Curry, just that I don't want to give either of those guys in a deal where Curry is the main piece coming back.

Bibby will either be signed to an extension or moved, but if we move him, I think a team to look at is Chicago. A really bad season, a need to shake up their team, new coach coming in, and the team wasn't happy with most of their players. A deal like Bibby for Hinrich and Thomas works salary wise, and seems to make sense if they truly want to shake things up. Hinrich and Gordon are too small to really team up, and they are grooming Sefalosha for the PG role. If they commit to Gordon this summer, Hinrich is likely trade bait. Thomas is now blocked by Gooden, and Chicago loves Gooden. Thomas acted immaturely this past season, and they may just want to move him. Bibby is expiring, and could groom Sefalosha into being a PG.

The reason I like this is this deal is all about getting better defensively. Hinrich is a very good defender (and can handle defending the SG if neded), and his outside shooting has been getting better. It's not as good (or as streaky) as Bibby's, but it's not bad. Thomas oozes potential, and depending what you do with Smith, he is another asset that could be moved down the road if necessary. And he is another very good defender, and solid bench help is also a critical need.

If championships are built around defense, this is a move that would take us in the right direction.

[Plastic Man]

Don't forget about Curry's heart issue. Not only does he play like he has no heart, he actually has a medical issue there that could be a major problem at any given moment.

I would imagine D'Antoni is salivating at the though of coaching guys like Lee, Chandler and Balkman. They are all athletic hustle guys with loads of energy. I don't see any of them on the trading block. Curry and Z-bo could be available--but I'm not interested.

[coachx]

I am no wear near ready to trade Bibby's veteran influence and leadership as a PG away for swiss chees like E. Curry and N. Robinson.

I want Bibby on the team next year.

If Law blows up and JO actuall plays with heart instead of crying to the sports writers then we consider it...but now is not the time. BTW, JO is NO KG....never has been and definately never will be.

Question....Is Bibby's expireing contract too valuable to trade away ?We will not know until closer to the trade deadline when the best offers are made.

For the first time in a decade this team is developing true chemistry. I think Bibby is part of the reason for that. His outside shooting from the PG position and veteran leadership were the missing links to our starting 5's offensive chemistry. Hopefully with a healed wrist and no tape or brace his shooting gets more consistent giving us a deadly offensive backcourt duo.

Bibby does not fit D' Antonie (Sp?) system any way.......I see the Knicks targeting TJ Ford as has been rumored.

[atlien]

I agree that moving Marvin and Bibby could get us a nice trade.

But, we get FLEECED in that trade. They'd love to dump Curry and his fat contract on someone.

You forget that an expiring contract like Bibby's is in itself quite valuable.

If we were gonna trade with NY, I'd want Crawford, David Lee and Robinson.

But, I'd rather get a player that will truly put us over the top.

Josh Howard comes to mind. Maybe even one of the Toronto PGs plus one of their wings that can nail 3s.

[coachx]

Quote:

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But, I'd rather get a player that will truly put us over the top.

Josh Howard comes to mind. Maybe even one of the Toronto PGs plus one of their wings that can nail 3s.

Now there is a trade worth mentioning from a skill stand point............However, if Avery Johnson is the next coach he may be the only guy who knows enough about Howard to know if he is worth the risk with his character issues.

Him smoking pot is not the major issue with me. Him planning a big time 28th birthday party bash for himself, (after Avery said NO partying in the playoffs), after elimnation playoff game scares the crap out of me.....How can you be a championship team with 2nd or 3rd best player like that who obviously cares more about partying then winning playoff series ?

B/c of this I prefer Richard Jefferson to Josh Howard. Similar type players from a skill set stand point but way different with their priorities in life.

[Johnnybravo4]

This is my rationale for this trade. If you have a PF in Horford who will avg about 12rpg and a SF in Smoove who will avg 7-9 rpg, then your center can be a below avg rebounder. There isn't a team in the league who has their entire front line avg 9-10 rpg. As far as his defense goes, there aren't any centers in the east who would abuse him defensively in fact we would benefit from having Horford defend more PF's who would keep him out of foul trouble and in the game.

There is a chance that who could slow down our running, but it doesn't seem that we make a commitment to that style of play in the first place. Therefore when he's out we can run. When he's in we play a half court game. It is our inability to play a half court game which ultimately did us in in the playoffs. Besides, if we need a must score, it would be comforting to be able to dump it down to a big man who can score in the post rather than giving the ball to JJ on the perimeter and wishing for him to "do something."

I think having Malik Rose improves our big man depth. He would give us rebounding and energy off the bench. That also goes for Nate Robinson. Please don't forget that in my scenerio we get a 1st round pick in next years draft which we can use for a defensive center or a backup 2 for JJ.

We have to move Bibby and or Marvin because there is no way we can improve the talent on the team since we will use cap space to resign our players and we have no draft pick. So unless you believe that the team is championship caliber as is or that David lee is the key to our post offense/defense then this is the type of move we should make.

[atlien]

Richard Jefferson is another good candidate. His contract is a bit longer and fatter than what I would want, but I do like his game. If we could get him and Sean Williams, I am on board strong. A front court of Smoove, Horford and Williams would be a BLOCK party.