Smith Vs Odom

[Packfill]

OFFENSE:

Better jumpshot?: Odom

Better post player?: Odom

Better inside finisher?: Odom

Better ball handler?: Odom

Better passer?: Odom

Better FT shooter?: Smith

Better 3-point shooter?: Odom

Better offensive rebounder?: Odom

DEFENSE

Better perimeter defender?: Smith

Better interior defender?: Smith

Better shot blocker?: Smith

Better defensive awareness to get steals/blocks/defections?: Smith

Better defensive rebounder?: Odom

Tougher player defensively?: Smith

INTANGIBLES

Hustles more?: Smith

Smarter player?: Odom

More coachable?: Odom

More likely to take over a game either offensively or defensively?: Smith

In the end, an Odom - Smith swap, just makes us a more potent offensive team. You lose a lot defensively with Smith, but you gain a lot offensively with Odom. If the Hawks are going to trade Smith, Odom is the guy I want.

Hawks w/Odom + Kwame or Randolph . . . minus Smith and Claxton

PG: Bibby ( 28 min ) - Law ( 20 min )

G: JJ ( 30 min ) - Evans ( 18 min )

F: Marvin ( 32 min ) - JJ ( 8 min ) - Evans ( 8 min )

PF: Odom ( 36 min ) - Horford ( 12 min )

C: Horford ( 24 min ) - Zaza ( 16 min ) - Kwa/Ran ( 8 min )

total minutes:

JJ - 38

Horford - 36

Odom - 36

Marvin - 32

Bibby - 28

Evans - 26

Law - 20

Zaza - 16

Kwa/Ran - 8

That's a good of a starting unit that you'll see in the East. Odom's ability to post up and most importantly, pass out of the post, would be a godsend for shooters like JJ and Bibby. It'll be up to the 3 main guys off the bench, to hold everything together when they sub in for a starter.

That trade idea is horrific for the Hawks. It might make the team better in the shortrun but in the long run it is a real loser.

If Odom can't win a title with Kobe and Gasol then there is zero chance he is going to win one with JJ and Bibby, unless Horford is the second coming of Tim Duncan. Trading away a young asset like Smith only makes sense if you are getting a franchise player in return (like Boston getting Garnett for Jefferson).

[Buzzard]

That trade idea is horrific for the Hawks. It might make the team better in the shortrun but in the long run it is a real loser.

If Odom can't win a title with Kobe and Gasol then there is zero chance he is going to win one with JJ and Bibby, unless Horford is the second coming of Tim Duncan. Trading away a young asset like Smith only makes sense if you are getting a franchise player in return (like Boston getting Garnett for Jefferson).

A franchise player for Smoove would be a dream deal. Amare is probably about as close to that as we may be able to get. I do agree that Odum for a one year rental is nowhere near enough; but knocking his talents because all they did was get to the championship series is going overboard...

[Chris18]

A franchise player for Smoove would be a dream deal. Amare is probably about as close to that as we may be able to get. I do agree that Odum for a one year rental is nowhere near enough; but knocking his talents because all they did was get to the championship series is going overboard...

If we can't get a franchise player for Smoove there is no reason to trade him. Getting a role player would be good in addition to re-signing Josh but trading him for one would set us back for years.

[AtLaS]

Don't pick which years you want to compare. Just compare career numbers vs career numbers.

You are the one that said Odom maintained good and efficient production as a Clipper and he didn't. I only responded to what you said.

And, like you now want to do, if we compare career numbers, Lamar is a career 46% shooter who averages about 3 turnovers per game. That's essentially the same as Smith at age 22.

Odums numbers have beeen accumualted over a longer span and they are still better than Smooves. God help us if we ever ask Smoove to bring the ball up the court like they did Odum in Clipperland.

He brought the ball up SOMETIMES, but he was never the key ball handler nor was he the key playmaker. The fact is that Odom is and always has been an inefficient turnover prone guy who isn't a good scorer or defender. No thanks.

[Buzzard]

You are the one that said Odom maintained good and efficient production as a Clipper and he didn't. I only responded to what you said.

And, like you now want to do, if we compare career numbers, Lamar is a career 46% shooter who averages about 3 turnovers per game. That's essentially the same as Smith at age 22.

He brought the ball up SOMETIMES, but he was never the key ball handler nor was he the key playmaker. The fact is that Odom is and always has been an inefficient turnover prone guy who isn't a good scorer or defender. No thanks.

Odom was always at the minimum the #2 ball handler on those Clipper teams and at times their primary ball handler who not only brought the ball up but started the half court set as well. They were in worse shape than us most years when it came to PG's. And when did Smoove all of a sudden become a more efficient scorer than Odom? Are you nuts or just biased? My guess is biased.

I like Odom's game. I have been following him his whole career; and despite being a part of one of the worse franchises in all of sports, I never once saw or heard of him pitching a p*ssy tantrum like Smoove. He is a better all around player than Smoove. Being a Smoove fan is OK; but do not try and convince anyone who also watches the rest of the league closely that Smoove is better than Odom. It is a crock and you would know that if you were not such a Smoove fan and watched any games other than Hawks.

Riley gave up Odom for one of the best centers to play the game; and Odom was the primary part of that deal. Who would not do that? If Miami would not include Odom there would not have been a deal. And even though I know without a doubt he is a better player, if all we get is Odom for a one year rental, I still say no thanks!

[AtLaS]

Being a Smoove fan is OK; but do not try and convince anyone who also watches the rest of the league closely that Smoove is better than Odom. It is a crock and you would know that if you were not such a Smoove fan and watched any games other than Hawks.

LOL I probably watch as much non-Hawk basketball as anyone here. And, I guarantee if you make a poll on a general NBA board, Smith would be rated as good as Odom. It's not that far-fetched to say Smith is as good as Odom. Odom is better offensively, Smith is WORLDS better defensively and that's not even questionable.

when did Smoove all of a sudden become a more efficient scorer than Odom? Are you nuts or just biased?

Please show me where I said Smith was a more efficient scorer than Odom.

[Buzzard]

LOL I probably watch as much non-Hawk basketball as anyone here. And, I guarantee if you make a poll on a general NBA board, Smith would be rated as good as Odom. It's not that far-fetched to say Smith is as good as Odom. Odom is better offensively, Smith is WORLDS better defensively and that's not even questionable.

Please show me where I said Smith was a more efficient scorer than Odom.

From your 1st post when talking about Odom:

"He can't score very well and he's not a good defender."

Odom is hands down a better scorer than Smoove. Odom is also as good a defender as Smoove when it comes to guarding his man. Smoove is a better help defender who also leaves his man to soon to go get the block....

As far as you watching other NBA games, there is no way you watched any Clipper games when Odom was there, if you did not know he was at least the #2 ball handler all four seasons. I know fantasy does not count for much, but he started over 30 games at PG one season and qualified as a PG in fantasy play. If you really kept up with west coast ball, how in the world did you not know that Lamar Odom started over 30 games at PG?

Just blows my mind when people post crap like he was not even the #2 ball handler just to try to make their point; when the truth is he was either the #2 or #1 ball handler every season...

This is why Riley loved him and the reason Jackson would not trade Shaq unless he was included. A 6'10" player who can score, rebound, and average 5 assist a game two years in a row!

[AtLaS]

From your 1st post when talking about Odom:

"He can't score very well and he's not a good defender."

Odom is hands down a better scorer than Smoove. Odom is also as good a defender as Smoove when it comes to guarding his man.

Smith is a much better overall defender and that is all that matters.

As far as you watching other NBA games, there is no way you watched any Clipper games when Odom was there, if you did not know he was at least the #2 ball handler all four seasons. I know fantasy does not count for much, but he started over 30 games at PG one season and qualified as a PG in fantasy play. If you really kept up with west coast ball, how in the world did you not know that Lamar Odom started over 30 games at PG?

You got me, I will admit I wasn't a big Clipper watcher during the Sterling dominated early 2000s. I do remember the season they almost made the playoffs when Odom, Darius and Brand were playing well, though. I even have the SLAM magazine with them on the cover, I've had a subscription to that mag for about 10 years now. Regardless, Odom has proven turnover prone wherever he has played during his entire career, not just for the Clippers.

This is why Riley loved him and the reason Jackson would not trade Shaq unless he was included.

That's because Miami had nothing else of value except Butler who was also included in the trade. Wade was absolutely not getting traded, that's a no brainer. And, that was 4 years ago, Lamar will turn 30 by the time the season starts. He's no longer in his mid-twenties.

Also, since you seem to think Odom is much better than Smith, and you said you'd make the trade if he was locked up for longer, how about posting a thread on ANY active general NBA board and asking fans who would be better for the Hawks, and I'll let you say a 3 year deal for Odom, meaning he won't still be under contract into his mid-thirties, giving you an advantage. Odom for the next 3 years vs. Smith for the next 3, who would be better for the Hawks?? I'd love to see the response.

[Buzzard]

Smith is a much better overall defender and that is all that matters.

You got me, I will admit I wasn't a big Clipper watcher during the Sterling dominated early 2000s. I do remember the season they almost made the playoffs when Odom, Darius and Brand were playing well, though. I even have the SLAM magazine with them on the cover, I've had a subscription to that mag for about 10 years now. Regardless, Odom has proven turnover prone wherever he has played during his entire career, not just for the Clippers.

That's because Miami had nothing else of value except Butler who was also included in the trade. Wade was absolutely not getting traded, that's a no brainer. And, that was 4 years ago, Lamar will turn 30 by the time the season starts. He's no longer in his mid-twenties.

Also, since you seem to think Odom is much better than Smith, and you said you'd make the trade if he was locked up for longer, how about posting a thread on ANY active general NBA board and asking fans who would be better for the Hawks, and I'll let you say a 3 year deal for Odom, meaning he won't still be under contract into his mid-thirties, giving you an advantage. Odom for the next 3 years vs. Smith for the next 3, who would be better for the Hawks?? I'd love to see the response.

Thanks for admitting the not following Clipper team part. That was cool! I absolutely thought Brand and Odom on the same team was awesome; they just needed a point guard and unfortunately for them Darius was not it...

I think it would be interesting to see reaction on who would be the better fit over a three year period. I really think Odom and Horf could be as good as Brand and Odom over that period; which means I think Odom would be better for us....after three years Odom will be going down hill. Just a fact of life for most athletes ....

[AtLaS]

I think it would be interesting to see reaction on who would be the better fit over a three year period. I really think Odom and Horf could be as good as Brand and Odom over that period; which means I think Odom would be better for us....after three years Odom will be going down hill. Just a fact of life for most athletes ....

I understand your point now. Since you think Smith has hit his peak and will not significantly improve, you'd rather have who you think is the better player (Odom) if he was locked up for the next few years.

But, if you think Smith will continue to improve, and the general consensus is that he will, than you'd much rather keep Smith and a trade like this wouldn't be desirable.

To me, Lamar is just one of those guys that always underperforms. Reminds me of Sheed. He had so much ability and potential, and he just never came close to meeting it. The fact that Odom's never been an all-star with all his natural talent is insane. That leads me to believe that he's just not a hard worker. I'm always questioning his decisions on the floor. He just doesn't play to his strengths nearly enough, it just seems like he's a player with ability but never really makes an impact on the floor, and I've seen Odom play a LOT in recent years.

[Buzzard]

I understand your point now. Since you think Smith has hit his peak and will not significantly improve, you'd rather have who you think is the better player (Odom) if he was locked up for the next few years.

But, if you think Smith will continue to improve, and the general consensus is that he will, than you'd much rather keep Smith and a trade like this wouldn't be desirable.

To me, Lamar is just one of those guys that always underperforms. Reminds me of Sheed. He had so much ability and potential, and he just never came close to meeting it. The fact that Odom's never been an all-star with all his natural talent is insane. That leads me to believe that he's just not a hard worker. I'm always questioning his decisions on the floor. He just doesn't play to his strengths nearly enough, it just seems like he's a player with ability but never really makes an impact on the floor, and I've seen Odom play a LOT in recent years.

That is funny you compare him to Sheed. Odom had his issues with pot as well. I do not see the Lakers moving Odom unless they can get a big time PF and the team that gets Odom will be doing it in all likelyhood for cap releif next season. I do not want us to do that with Odom. If Smoove has to go; we have to get much more than a one year rental and cap releif.

We need a center or big PF that can help Horf down low....Amare would be almost perfect in my mind...

[AtLaS]

I never once saw or heard of him pitching a p*ssy tantrum like Smoove.

Oh yeah, forgot to respond to this :D.

I'd rather have a player who gets upset with the play on the floor rather than a guy who gets busted with Marijuana twice in less than a year, at age 22. http://espn.go.com/nba/news/2001/1107/1274985.html

I wonder what people would say about Smith had this happened to him this past year?

[AtLaS]

That is funny you compare him to Sheed. Odom had his issues with pot as well. I do not see the Lakers moving Odom unless they can get a big time PF and the team that gets Odom will be doing it in all likelyhood for cap releif next season. I do not want us to do that with Odom. If Smoove has to go; we have to get much more than a one year rental and cap releif.

We need a center or big PF that can help Horf down low....Amare would be almost perfect in my mind...

Well, not comparing his game to Sheed, just their potential to be top NBA players that never panned out.

But, if Bynum comes back healthy than they'll have a Gasol/Bynum frontline which would be dangerous. Odom is a pretty good fit for that team, but a player who can play defense at the SF and hit the three would be ideal. Keeping Odom would probably be a good option also, though.

Of course I'd trade Smith for Amare in a second, but we know that's not happening.

[BossTweed]

No he's not. Smoove is a better open court dunker than Lamar. But Lamar's post up game and ability to drive and finish, is superior to Smith's.

Lamar Odom is a horrible finisher from what I saw in the playoffs. When he tried to take people off the dribble, he just drives to the basket and can't get around his man, so he lets himself get shielded out of the lane, then he throws up a horrible prayer shot high off the glass that doesn't even get close while he runs out of bounds by the side of the basket.

Edited July 28, 2008 by BossTweed

[spoken20]

This is sounds great and very nice to hear with u brother. What a great news and it is interesting and I couldn't wait to see their face off. I'm started to chilling out to know who is the victorious.

[TanAdam]

This is sounds great and very nice to hear with u brother. What a great news and it is interesting and I couldn't wait to see their face off. I'm started to chilling out to know who is the victorious.

Ummm...what?

[exodus]

The Smith-Odom comparison in the original post ignores Smith's possible upside. Given the rate Smith has been improving and obvious flaws in his game that would be easily addressed by a real coach this is a big omission.

There is no way i would trade Smith for Odom. Our interior D would be an absolute joke without Smith.

[HawkNJersey]

why in da hell was this topic, revisited?

[exodus]

Ummm...what?

haha yeah i have no idea what that is supposed to mean.

[Admin]

This is sounds great and very nice to hear with u brother. What a great news and it is interesting and I couldn't wait to see their face off. I'm started to chilling out to know who is the victorious.

Post of the year I'd say!