Bibby on Smoove.

[Admin]

I think it's great that Bibby said it and great that Woody took it like a man since he knew he was wrong. I will say though that there is a time and a place to yell at your boss and it's not in front of thousands in attendance and millions (perhaps?) watching worldwide. Bibby should have talked to Woodson in private about it but I can understand him reacting like that in the heat of the moment.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I was not at the game.....so I missed Woodson's reactions and all the stuff that goes on off camera for Game 7. I just watched this one on TV.

On TV it showed Woody yelling at Smith after a missed perimeter shot in the early part of the 4th quarter. You could see him making signs with his hands to take it to the hole next time. The TV announcers even commented on it.

The commentator said something to the effect that.........Well, that missed shot got Mike Woodson out of his seat. Look at him (as the put the camera on Woody) tell Smith to take it in the paint next time.................either Jackson or VanGundy then chimed in.........that is where he is at his best.

I wonder if that was before or after Bibby told Woody what he thought ?

It was midway in the 2nd quarter when that went down. Bibby drove and dished it to Smoove, who missed about an 18 - 20 footer. He WAS wide open, and Bibby could've easily been called for a charge on that play, because Joel Anthony was in perfect position. They just didn't call it.

But Smoove basically drifted out to the perimeter when Bibby started to drive. Smith actually did right on that play, because Bibby basically had nowhere to go. That's why he passed it to Smith, who once again, was WIDE OPEN.

The shot wasn't a 3, so I can't be mad at him for that shot.

When Miami had the ball on the next possession, that's when you see Woody talking to somebody, and motioning something with 3 fingers up.. Woody seemed to be mad.

It was at that point when Van Gundy said something about Woody being disgusted with the shot that Josh took.

On the Hawks next possession, Smith pretty much tries to post up James Jones in the high post. He gets the ball with Jones on him, and Haslem ( for some reason ) drifts off of Bibby toward Smoove. Smoove then casually passes the ball back to Bibby, who knocks down a wide open 3 to give us an 11 point lead.

Edited May 4, 2009 by northcyde

[the_sheff]

After more thought i dont see how anyone can defend Woody and his offense at this point. Instead of crafting an offense which puts people in position to use their strengths, his solution is to simply not pass them the ball.

[cherie]

I think it's great that Bibby said it and great that Woody took it like a man since he knew he was wrong. I will say though that there is a time and a place to yell at your boss and it's not in front of thousands in attendance and millions (perhaps?) watching worldwide. Bibby should have talked to Woodson in private about it but I can understand him reacting like that in the heat of the moment.

James Jones got fouled on the next play. Woodson yelled at Bibby first for passing it to Smoove, hence the response. I don't see how that could have been done any differently, especially if he felt like he did nothing wrong

[Admin]

James Jones got fouled on the next play. Woodson yelled at Bibby first for passing it to Smoove, hence the response. I don't see how that could have been done any differently, especially if he felt like he did nothing wrong

First off, welcome to Hawksquawk!

In regard to what Bibby could have (should have) done it should be no different than it is in any other profession which is to show your boss respect and not argue with him in front of everyone else and you discuss it with him in private. I understand that it was a heated moment and that some people view athletes as something other than employees but the bottom line is that there is still a level of respect that they should show their boss and Bibby's lucky that Woody took the criticism with the humility that he did.

Just ask yourself this question, if your boss "yells" at you in the way that Woody did with Bibby, are you going to "yell" back at him defensively and say that you did nothing wrong?

[AtLaS]

Classic Woody offense.

He puts Smith on the perimeter and yells at Bibby when he passes it to him because he's wide open. I'm guessing Woody wants us to play 4 on 5 offense? Because that is essentially what he's saying...

[bronnt]

It was midway in the 2nd quarter when that went down. Bibby drove and dished it to Smoove, who missed about an 18 - 20 footer. He WAS wide open, and Bibby could've easily been called for a charge on that play, because Joel Anthony was in perfect position. They just didn't call it.

But Smoove basically drifted out to the perimeter when Bibby started to drive. Smith actually did right on that play, because Bibby basically had nowhere to go. That's why he passed it to Smith, who once again, was WIDE OPEN.

The shot wasn't a 3, so I can't be mad at him for that shot.

When Miami had the ball on the next possession, that's when you see Woody talking to somebody, and motioning something with 3 fingers up.. Woody seemed to be mad.

It was at that point when Van Gundy said something about Woody being disgusted with the shot that Josh took.

On the Hawks next possession, Smith pretty much tries to post up James Jones in the high post. He gets the ball with Jones on him, and Haslem ( for some reason ) drifts off of Bibby toward Smoove. Smoove then casually passes the ball back to Bibby, who knocks down a wide open 3 to give us an 11 point lead.

Sure you can be mad about that shot. For Josh, that 20 footer is just as risky as a 3 point attempt with 50% less of a payoff.

It's like taking a long shot bet at worse odds than are offered. "I'll give you 30:1 odds on that." "No, make it 20:1!"

Josh can't hit from 18 any better than he can hit from 24.

[tonegully]

Are you serious? It took Woody this long to figure this out? It took Bibby to tell him this? Man Woody has no idea what he is doing on the offensive side of the floor. ASG get this man some help or some better basketball dvds.lol.

[Frenzy]

lol better basketball DVD's

[GameTime]

"Larry Brown didn't give me anymore plays!"

[AHF]

Classic Woody offense.

He puts Smith on the perimeter and yells at Bibby when he passes it to him because he's wide open. I'm guessing Woody wants us to play 4 on 5 offense? Because that is essentially what he's saying...

Exactly.

[DrReality]

I'm just glad it's getting so much press, out in the open. And either Sund or the assistants need to step up and address this. We need to make some adjustments going into the series and this is one of them. If we have a chance, Smoove has to play inside and draw fouls.

[coachx]

We all know Woody has gotten on to Smith about his perimeter shots for years. Hence, his 3 point shot attempts have gone down for 3 years in a row. Why are people acting like this is the first time Woody ever said something about it ?

Sure its the first time its getting national media attention b/c we are never on national TV but many squawkers see every game.

I know its funny Bibby, correctly shot back at Woody. Bibby can take in game criticsm. Josh is not mature enough to take it, in game, to but there have been plenty of locker room spats between Smith and Woody that are centered around his perimeter shooting and his argueing with the refs............you just have to pick your battles with Smith off camera due to his lack of composure and tendancy to pout.

Edited May 5, 2009 by coachx

[AHF]

We all know Woody has gotten on to Smith about his perimeter shots for years. Hence, his 3 point shot attempts have gone down for 3 years in a row. Why are people acting like this is the first time Woody ever said something about it ?

Two reasons people are talking about this:

(1) Woodson still structures his offense so that Smith is floating outside the 3pt line which either leaves the team playing 4 on 5 or leads to Smith shooting long jumpers; and

(2) Woodson has publically said Smith can continue shooting 3's.

I know I can't justify either one of those decisions, especially the offensive structure issue. Woodson is admitting that he is putting Josh Smith in a position to fail when he yells at Bibby for passing to Josh when Woodson is the one that put Josh on the perimeter in the first place, as Bibby so plainly made clear.

[crimedog]

We all know Woody has gotten on to Smith about his perimeter shots for years. Hence, his 3 point shot attempts have gone down for 3 years in a row. Why are people acting like this is the first time Woody ever said something about it ?

Sure its the first time its getting national media attention b/c we are never on national TV but many squawkers see every game.

I know its funny Bibby, correctly shot back at Woody. Bibby can take in game criticsm. Josh is not mature enough to take it, in game, to but there have been plenty of locker room spats between Smith and Woody that are centered around his perimeter shooting and his argueing with the refs............you just have to pick your battles with Smith off camera due to his lack of composure and tendancy to pout.

Its getting attention on the Squawk because its the first time we've really been able to confirm that it isn't just Josh breaking procedure and floating out the perimeter (whether its the 3pt line or 18 feet... same thing) but the actual offensive philosophy where we literally ask Josh Smith, the shooter that he is, to hang out on the perimeter. Its confirmation that we don't just have a mediocre offensive system but one that actually sets the team and Smith indivudually up for failure.

[AtLaS]

Two reasons people are talking about this:

(1) Woodson still structures his offense so that Smith is floating outside the 3pt line which either leaves the team playing 4 on 5 or leads to Smith shooting long jumpers; and

(2) Woodson has publically said Smith can continue shooting 3's.

I know I can't justify either one of those decisions, especially the offensive structure issue. Woodson is admitting that he is putting Josh Smith in a position to fail when he yells at Bibby for passing to Josh when Woodson is the one that put Josh on the perimeter in the first place, as Bibby so plainly made clear.

Adding to that, it's an even worse decision because Smith is SO effective inside. He has actually developed some nice post moves, and we already know how effective he is when driving to the basket. There is just no reason he should be out that far unless he's setting a pick.

The only people who defend Woodson are looking at our accomplishments this season and nothing else. They are ignoring all the flaws in our gameplan. I honestly believe this team could be a LOT better, and we'd be much more consistent with a more structured offense.

People say he preaches defense and he's a great defensive coach, yet we are one of the most inconsistent defensive teams as well. One night we're great and the next we are putrid. That isn't good coaching to me. We are still one of the worst first quarter teams and I honestly think that's because Woody isn't a good motivational speaker. I remember when they show the "Wired" on ESPN with Woody's pregame speeches, they just don't sound inspiring. Conversely, when they show Doc Rivers (even though I don't consider him a great coach either) or SVG, you get the opposite impression.

[Admin]

Its getting attention on the Squawk because its the first time we've really been able to confirm that it isn't just Josh breaking procedure and floating out the perimeter (whether its the 3pt line or 18 feet... same thing) but the actual offensive philosophy where we literally ask Josh Smith, the shooter that he is, to hang out on the perimeter. Its confirmation that we don't just have a mediocre offensive system but one that actually sets the team and Smith indivudually up for failure.

How is this confirming anything other than Josh being allowed to do whatever he wants? To me it sounds like Woody doesn't want Josh shooting 3's but he's afraid to ask him not to (which goes back to the quote from a couple months back) and then this incident only further illustrates that fear but also illustrates how Woody DOES NOT want Josh shooting 3's. So how are you coming to the conclusion that we ask Josh to be out there unless you're saying that by Woodson not specifically stating that he's not allowed out there is the same as them asking him to be out there.

[drzachary]

How is this confirming anything other than Josh being allowed to do whatever he wants? To me it sounds like Woody doesn't want Josh shooting 3's but he's afraid to ask him not to (which goes back to the quote from a couple months back) and then this incident only further illustrates that fear but also illustrates how Woody DOES NOT want Josh shooting 3's. So how are you coming to the conclusion that we ask Josh to be out there unless you're saying that by Woodson not specifically stating that he's not allowed out there is the same as them asking him to be out there.

Exactly: this proves that either Josh is uncoachable (or very difficult to coach), or Woodson is a bad coach. Has to be at least one of those (could be both!)

[Admin]

Adding to that, it's an even worse decision because Smith is SO effective inside. He has actually developed some nice post moves, and we already know how effective he is when driving to the basket. There is just no reason he should be out that far unless he's setting a pick.

The only people who defend Woodson are looking at our accomplishments this season and nothing else. They are ignoring all the flaws in our gameplan. I honestly believe this team could be a LOT better, and we'd be much more consistent with a more structured offense.

People say he preaches defense and he's a great defensive coach, yet we are one of the most inconsistent defensive teams as well. One night we're great and the next we are putrid. That isn't good coaching to me. We are still one of the worst first quarter teams and I honestly think that's because Woody isn't a good motivational speaker. I remember when they show the "Wired" on ESPN with Woody's pregame speeches, they just don't sound inspiring. Conversely, when they show Doc Rivers (even though I don't consider him a great coach either) or SVG, you get the opposite impression.

That's not true. I defend Woody as much as anyone but I know our offense sucks and I don't simply look at our accomplishments ... but I also realize that we could be worse with another coach just as we could be better with another coach. My defense of Woody is that unless there is an absolute upgrade available then a change for the sake of change is very risky.

Exactly: this proves that either Josh is uncoachable (or very difficult to coach), or Woodson is a bad coach. Has to be at least one of those (could be both!)

That is what I am leaning towards!

[AtLaS]

How is this confirming anything other than Josh being allowed to do whatever he wants? To me it sounds like Woody doesn't want Josh shooting 3's but he's afraid to ask him not to (which goes back to the quote from a couple months back) and then this incident only further illustrates that fear but also illustrates how Woody DOES NOT want Josh shooting 3's. So how are you coming to the conclusion that we ask Josh to be out there unless you're saying that by Woodson not specifically stating that he's not allowed out there is the same as them asking him to be out there.

Because Bibby told Woodson, "Well don't put him there, what do you want me to do, he's wide open". If Woodson is putting him there than that's his fault.