Joe sure is getting alot of hate

[Diesel]

ah , no you cant . Wade can carry a team by himself . Lebron can carry a team by himself . Jordon can carry a team , and so could 'Nique .

Let me be fair . Perhaps Joe deserves an incomplete , because I really don't think its fair to judge anyone in this travesty of an offense.

Where can these guys carry a team??

Where??

because by themself, none of these guys sniffed Championship.. Well maybe No rings Lebron.

I'll put Joe's first round against the Celtics up against any of these guys who you mentioned Playoffs without another star and I think we can call it even.

[Supporter]

as one of the best 2 guards in the league, Joe sure doesn't have the stats in this series to back up that claim . Personally , I'd like to see how the team develops with a new coach and Joe still with the team.

lol before this game Joe had about as good stats as any one else in the league. I think like 26 points, 6 assists 5 rebounds or something like that.

[Guest]

For the countless number of JJ haters on this forum and in the ATL fanbase in general this is a day to rejoice. As it is every time Joe has a rough game. They may get their wish to see what this team looks like without one of the best 2-guards in the league. I hope not.

I was at the game and got a glimpse of what the Hawks look like without Joe....yikes.........I am finally convinced that Woody has no offensive game plan with or without Joe, there was no ball movement from side to side to force the Bucks defense to move.

[hogfulness]

as one of the best 2 guards in the league, Joe sure doesn't have the stats in this series to back up that claim . Personally , I'd like to see how the team develops with a new coach and Joe still with the team.

?????

JJ's stats are among the best of any player in the playoffs.

[OldTimeHawk]

Oh , so the criteria is winning championships . So does that make Dominique the same class player Joe as Joe Johnson ? Or Lebron ? Or Wade ? You aren't going to suggest that Joe would be the go to guy on any teams with these guys ? Joe would be a piece .

[Joker]

Joe didn't play that badly. PFs effects players...especially when they are BS.

IN the Lakers game last night, Kobe didn't have a stellar night.

When your star is not on, others have to pick it up.

He played well overall, in fact he had the best game even though the stats favor Horford and Marvin. The problem is what I wrote. Reread it, I never said he played bad, but he's doesn't know how to win. Simple as that.

[niremetal]

I was at the game and got a glimpse of what the Hawks look like without Joe....yikes.........I am finally convinced that Woody has no offensive game plan with or without Joe, there was no ball movement from side to side to force the Bucks defense to move.

Yyyyyuuuup. +1

[dhawk]

as one of the best 2 guards in the league, Joe sure doesn't have the stats in this series to back up that claim

Prior to game 5, Joe was 6th in the league in Playoff Scoring, 25.8 pts (only behind Carmelo, Lebron, Wade, Deron, Rose), ahead of everybody else Kobe, Dirk, Amare, etc. and after game 5 he is still in top 10 (#9 at 23.2 pts). Looks like stats to me. 23/6/6

[Diesel]

He played well overall, in fact he had the best game even though the stats favor Horford and Marvin. The problem is what I wrote. Reread it, I never said he played bad, but he's doesn't know how to win. Simple as that.

He doesn't know how to win??

That's some old vague B.S. there Nbasuperstar40. IF you haven't noticed Basketball is a team sport.

The other day, Wade had his game of the playoffs and he said.. every star has at least one game in him that he can win by himself.

The next game, Wade is out of the playoffs.

The truth is if any player "Knew how to win" they would never lose... right?

Here's what you need to understand...

Basketball is about matchups and Adjustments.

When you lose a game, you can always pinpoint it to a matchup or an Adjustment.

When the Lakers loss to the Pistons.. it was matchups and adjustments that won the day. Surely.. Kobe and Shaq "Knew how to win"... they were going for a three peat. The problem was that Larry Brown outcoached Phil Jackson.

And that's what is happening to us now. You can't look at the leader of a team who has won 53 regular season games and say.. he doesn't know how to win. What kind of BS is that. We are being beat up at the PG position. That's matchup.

[OldTimeHawk]

Joe was 6th best in the playoffs in ppg , and his shooting percentage is terrible . FFor the amount of shots he takes , for some reason he cant seem to hit the ones that matter, on the possessions that matter. And he pregame interview about not argueing calls and him ending up being the one to lose it was comical.

I think what we have ( taking blame off Joe ) is a team frustrated with their system and their coach.

[HawksFan87]

lol I really do hope we win, because you guys are going crazy right now!! Joe had a great game until the last few minutes of the qtr. Blame everyone else if you want but that doesn't change the fact he made just as many bone headed plays as anyone else. bad shots. to's everything..

[Joker]

He doesn't know how to win??

That's some old vague B.S. there Nbasuperstar40. IF you haven't noticed Basketball is a team sport.

The other day, Wade had his game of the playoffs and he said.. every star has at least one game in him that he can win by himself.

The next game, Wade is out of the playoffs.

The truth is if any player "Knew how to win" they would never lose... right?

Here's what you need to understand...

Basketball is about matchups and Adjustments.

When you lose a game, you can always pinpoint it to a matchup or an Adjustment.

When the Lakers loss to the Pistons.. it was matchups and adjustments that won the day. Surely.. Kobe and Shaq "Knew how to win"... they were going for a three peat. The problem was that Larry Brown outcoached Phil Jackson.

And that's what is happening to us now. You can't look at the leader of a team who has won 53 regular season games and say.. he doesn't know how to win. What kind of BS is that. We are being beat up at the PG position. That's matchup.

He's like a female looking for a man with a bunch of failed experiences. He thinks that changing attitudes would help or other little differences when it's easier then he's making it out to be. Think about this, he said we need to play tougher, so his idea of playing tougher is committing flagrant fouls, bowling over people, etc. That's not playing tough, that's playing stupid. Joe always does something like that, he complains, then starts trying to show an example of it. In the playoffs, it's this simple, if your team is in trouble and your the star, take over. Nothing else needs to be said or done. Better offense beats better defense and Joe has the advantage. Wade team is completely different then Atlanta's. Outside of Wade, no one their roster would even break our rotation.

He doesn't know how to win, he just doesn't. Crawford as well. Only Horford knows how to win and shows you on a regular basis. There is a certain thought process that goes into it as well as talent. Joe has the talent part, but lacks the logic. Of course Smith doesn't know how to win as well but that's understandable, never showed signs that he would anyway. Joe Smith knows how to win but is too sorry in our system to contribute. Bibby knows how to choke and how to act when he's on a loser. He helped us on the court but has little impact in the locker room. When the Lakers lost to Detroit, it was because LAL was combustible in the locker room and the players didn't know their roles as well(Payton and Malone) not to mention Detroit was feeling disrespected and playing up to their opponent. No so much to do with match-ups. The Warriors/Mavs series was about match-ups. In the series, we have a number of favorable match-ups on offense, so what's your point?

We knew they had the advantage at PG going into the series, it's the other positions where we are superior to them at. It comes down to who wants it more and who knows how to win, we don't do neither if we do not respect you.

Edited April 29, 2010 by nbasuperstar40

[Slamee101]

I really would like to see these superstars that guys are claiming could be in the situation Joe is in right now and lead this team to a championship. All the "stars" that I expect people would name (Kobe, Wade, etc.) struggle(d) when they didn't have the right coaches and personnel in place. Put Kobe on this team with these terrible "offensive sets" and a D that can't stop anyone and we're in the same position. JJ isn't the problem here.

[Joker]

I really would like to see these superstars that guys are claiming could be in the situation Joe is in right now and lead this team to a championship. All the "stars" that I expect people would name (Kobe, Wade, etc.) struggle(d) when they didn't have the right coaches and personnel in place. Put Kobe on this team with these terrible "offensive sets" and a D that can't stop anyone and we're in the same position. JJ isn't the problem here.

Our sets aren't that terrible, in fact it's better than Cleveland's. It's our execution that is. You put Kobe, Bron, or Wade with this talent and we will never lose a title unless we underestimate a team.

Edited April 29, 2010 by nbasuperstar40

[99PROBL3MS]

I really would like to see these superstars that guys are claiming could be in the situation Joe is in right now and lead this team to a championship. All the "stars" that I expect people would name (Kobe, Wade, etc.) struggle(d) when they didn't have the right coaches and personnel in place. Put Kobe on this team with these terrible "offensive sets" and a D that can't stop anyone and we're in the same position. JJ isn't the problem here.

You hit the nail on the head man. @OldTimeHawk, there are only 6 players in these playoffs that are shooting a better % and scoring more points than JJ. That is even after the 6-16 in game 5. Kobe has failed to win with better teams than this.

The Heat have some players believe it or not. Chalmers would start for this team. You really think Jermaine O'neal, Beasley, Haslem, and Richardson wouldn't play for this Hawks team? Halsem averages 9 and 9 off of the bench. The Celtics get Michael Finley for what the Hawks are paying Mario West. The Magic are getting Matt Barnes for 1.25mil less than what we are paying Mo.

JJ isn't why this team is losing. Jennings and Ridenour are combing for 30pts per at the PG position. Bibby is giving you 10 points and giving up 20pts. That is +30 in favor of the bucks at that position alone. Their bench outscored the Hawks 41-7 a few nights ago and outscored them 37-19 lastnight. The Hawks are getting owned bigtime at the PG position and getting nothing from the bench. All the fingers are being pointed back to Joe for that?

[troubleman]

ah , no you cant . Wade can carry a team by himself . Lebron can carry a team by himself . Jordon can carry a team , and so could 'Nique .

Let me be fair . Perhaps Joe deserves an incomplete , because I really don't think its fair to judge anyone in this travesty of an offense.

Nobody can carry a team alone. The Lakers were one and done in the playoffs until they acquired Gasol. The Heat have been one and done in the playoffs without Shaq. KG was one and done in Minnesota. Lebron's teams have advanced, so I'll give him a little credit, but they can't get over the hump, which is why they acquired Jamison and Shaq. The bottom line is this, no players can get it done alone.

[Joker]

You hit the nail on the head man. @OldTimeHawk, there are only 6 players in these playoffs that are shooting a better % and scoring more points than JJ. That is even after the 6-16 in game 5. Kobe has failed to win with better teams than this.

The Heat have some players believe it or not. Chalmers would start for this team. You really think Jermaine O'neal, Beasley, Haslem, and Richardson wouldn't play for this Hawks team? Halsem averages 9 and 9 off of the bench. The Celtics get Michael Finley for what the Hawks are paying Mario West. The Magic are getting Matt Barnes for 1.25mil less than what we are paying Mo.

JJ isn't why this team is losing. Jennings and Ridenour are combing for 30pts per at the PG position. Bibby is giving you 10 points and giving up 20pts. That is +30 in favor of the bucks at that position alone. Their bench outscored the Hawks 41-7 a few nights ago and outscored them 37-19 lastnight. The Hawks are getting owned bigtime at the PG position and getting nothing from the bench. All the fingers are being pointed back to Joe for that?

They would take minutes from Horford and Smith, the likelihood is they(J.O. and Haslem) would lose out in the end. I am skeptical of what Chalmers would be in this system. J.O. wouldn't start over Smith, and Smith will still get his minutes so in others words, he wouldn't break our rotation. Haslem as well. Richardson would be in Evans role and he's barely in the rotation if even that. Woody value Evans defense over bench offense unless the player is as talented offensively as Crawford which Q is not. Bibby spends a lot of time on the bench and they do a lot of the scoring on the switching. Not so much on Bibby as your trying to put out there. Once again, we knew they had the advantage at PG, but the advantage they had isn't even as big as your making it out to be. Lack of respect, focus, and not understanding how to win are bigger issues in this series than anything else.