Was matching Josh Smith offer from Memphis the worst thing our franchise did?

[Joker]

Think about it.

We could have had CP3 or Deron? True but the hype for Marvin was he had the highest potential. He was going to be James Worthy with more athleticism. He was flashy quote the "take a picture dunk at UNC". In retrospect, was it dumb now, totally but understand considering Atlanta need for a potential superstar and most considered CP3 and Deron to be good PG's but not superstars. It's wasn't like we were passing on Durant for Marvin. Durant was a sure fire superstar and the same was assumed for Marvin. I wanted Deron the whole time and hated Marvin who couldn't start but I can't blame Atlanta as much as I usually would.

Drafting Shelden was bad. Really bad.

Resigning Joe Johnson could be awful if this team stays the same as it currently is. I am undecided right now, just know that Joe isn't the big money guy we are paying him to be. Too much for a Robin.

Now matching Josh. To me, this was the worst. Why?

We had a PF in Al Horford.

Josh had a lot of potential and is an impact player but what it did was took us out of any chance to sign Wade or Lebron James.

The chance to sign Lebron James and Joe Johnson to play with Al Horford could have been amazing. Lebron James knows Joe would be the perfect running mate. Al Horford is the leader PF with a will to do whatever it takes to win.

The potential of that team alone with the fact that we could hire Avery Johnson would be the icing on the cake. Now I know it's no guarantee that Lebron, Wade, Amare, or Boozer would have signed but at least we can draft, make trades and fight again for Melo, CP3, and Deron. A chance to win with two All Stars with addition of a superstar. Nothing against Smith but I don't see him being a championship player. I really like what I seen in his improvement but it isn't enough. We need that superstar or another star to add to our core.

I just think this one wasn't a crap shoot like the draft. We knew what we had with Horford and Johnson. We blew it because we matched Smith contract. It might seem like nothing now but we could have gotten Lebron. This city would never be the same in terms of Basketball viewership for the home team. I rather lose Smith for the chance at a player like Lebron, Wade CP3, or Deron.

[macdaddy]

No.

[spotatl]

You can't be serious... Are you under the impression that the Hawks wouldn't be able to trade josh Smith today if they wanted to? Even if the GM wanted him gone why on earth would they let him go for no compensation rather than matching him and trading him?

Think about it.

Edited February 14, 2011 by spotatl

[Joker]

You can't be serious... Are you under the impression that the Hawks wouldn't be able to trade josh Smith today if they wanted to? Even if the GM wanted him gone why on earth would they let him go for no compensation rather than matching him and trading him?

Think about it.

What's the purpose of trading him now. We won't get value and don't have the money to land a max guy anyway. I was referring to when we matched him in 2008. We would have had enough to sign another max deal with Joe. It could have been James, Wade, etc. The chance at landing those guys would have been much greater in terms of winning than what this team is currently.

Did you even bother to read what I wrote or just saw the title and decided to post?

[spotatl]

If the Hawks were willing to trade Josh Smith they could get Carmelo. They could have traded Josh Smith at the deadline last year if they wanted the caproom plus picks. Its a ridiculous thread- Not matching Josh Smith would have been the worst move on your list.

[EazyRoc]

No.

I still think passing on Chris Paul or Deron Williams was the worst move the Atlanta Hawks have ever made.

[coachx]

Fundamental lack of knowledge on the CBA.

[Joker]

Well yeah, this isn't the worst move we did clearly but it's one that painful right now. Considering we could have had James, Joe, Horford. Instead of resigning Marvin, we could have signed Felton to the same deal.

Felton

Joe

Lebron

Horford

Who cares?

[coachx]

What's the purpose of trading him now. We won't get value and don't have the money to land a max guy anyway. I was referring to when we matched him in 2008. We would have had enough to sign another max deal with Joe. It could have been James, Wade, etc. The chance at landing those guys would have been much greater in terms of winning than what this team is currently.

Did you even bother to read what I wrote or just saw the title and decided to post?

Wrong !

Even without Josh's $12 mill per year the Hawks would not have had the money to sign a max player with JJ.

Read up on cap holds, salary cap, and luxury tax threshholds in the current CBA if you don't believe me.

[Joker]

Fundamental lack of knowledge on the CBA.

Wouldn't we have over 20 million without Smith ext for the 2010 FA class? If I remember right, before we resigned Joe, we had 7 million in capspace, correct? I am not up on the CBA, I stated it numerous amount of times. I just know the affect it has a trade today which is common logic for someone who is a Basketball stan.

Can you explain what we could have had if we didn't have Smith contract for the 2010 FA class aka The Decision?

Edited February 14, 2011 by nbasuperstar40

[coachx]

Well yeah, this isn't the worst move we did clearly but it's one that painful right now. Considering we could have had James, Joe, Horford. Instead of resigning Marvin, we could have signed Felton to the same deal.

Felton

Joe

Lebron

Horford

Who cares?

Wrong again !

Please just stop, the CBA is clearly way over your head.

Edited February 14, 2011 by coachx

[Kimsey]

Just step away from the computer for a few hours.

[Joker]

Wrong again !

Please just stop, the CBA is clearly way over your head.

Instead of saying wrong, I asked you to explain, instead you want to be the pompous fellow when I clearly stated I am not sure about the CBA. Never have been, I am only sure when looking at the numbers of hoopshype and trades. I know trades, I know value from others in the industry. I don't care for the Larry Coon's CBA since I am not going to be a GM anytime soon. So if you could be kind to explain instead of saying wrong, I would appreciate that.

I stated it numerous times before.

Edited February 14, 2011 by nbasuperstar40

[coachx]

Can you explain what we could have had if we didn't have Smith contract for the 2010 FA class aka The Decision?

I don't have the time to be an educator but.........

OK...this is the basics of all explanantions:

2010-11 salary cap is $58 mill.

The Hawk current salary is at $69.7 mill.

Smoove makes $11.6 mill this season.

$69.7 mill - $11.6 mill = ($58.1 mill Team Salary minus Smoove )

This does not include the HUGE "cap hold" that was on JJ in order to retain his "Bird Rights." There are also cap holds for your draft picks and for each empty roster spot on the roster. Each empty roster is charged a minimum salary as a "cap hold." Since the Hawks filled these roster spots with minimum salary players (Collins, Powell, Thomas) its pretty much a non issue for this example.

Edited February 14, 2011 by coachx

[Joker]

I don't have the time to be an educator but.........

OK...this is the basics of all explanantions:

2010-11 salary cap is $58 mill.

The Hawk current salary is at $69.7 mill.

Smoove makes $11.6 mill this season.

$69.7 mill - $11.6 mill = ($58.1 mill Team Salary minus Smoove )

This does not include the HUGE "cap hold" that was on JJ in order to retain his "Bird Rights." There are also cap holds for your draft picks and for each empty roster spot on the roster. Each empty roster is charged a minimum salary as a "cap hold." Since the Hawks filled these roster spots with minimum salary players (Collins, Powell, Thomas) its pretty much a non issue for this example.

So if we never resigned Marvin, Zaza, and Bibby is a max guy still unlikely? What about Joe's caphold, how large it is? Horford was barely making more than Beasley so that would give us a lot of cap right? Would it still not be possible? Thanks for answering the question respectfully. I just remember about cap holds. Forgot all about it.

Edited February 14, 2011 by nbasuperstar40

[exodus]

[troubleman]

No, the draft choices under BK were the worst. Yeah, he got Horford, and yeah he got Josh Smith at 17, but I would rather have Deng over Josh Childress. Deron Williams or Chris Paul over Marvin. Heck, anybody over Shelden Williams. These were all picks I wanted, and I know the Hawks might not have been able to get Horford, but maybe they could have swung a deal to get a big man in his place. I never saw the potential in Marvin. Not sure where the James Worthy crap came from, but I wasn't buying it. The two hardest positions to find are a legit center, and a franchise type point guard. If the choice is between a 6th man at UNC in Marvin or a franchise pg type in D. Williams or Chris Paul you have to go with the point guard. Small Forwards are easier to find in the draft. Heck they could have drafted old bad knees Brandon Roy and received more value that Shelden Williams. Even with Brandon Roy and Joe Johnson being similar players, you had options as far as trade, or your bench.

[warcore]

Or we could have not given long term deals to Bibby, Marvin and Zaza the summer of 2009 to have even more capspace than not resigning Josh... did you think about that?

so the answer is no. I would rather have a good player on a reasonable contract than 3 overpaid reserves.

[Joker]

I deserve these negs and this thread isn't going anywhere. Mod plz lock.

[MaceCase]

So if we never resigned Marvin, Zaza, and Bibby is a max guy still unlikely? What about Joe's caphold, how large it is? Horford was barely making more than Beasley so that would give us a lot of cap right? Would it still not be possible? Thanks for answering the question respectfully. I just remember about cap holds. Forgot all about it.

You could add trading Acie's and Speedy"s expirings for the extra year of Jamal. We pretty much could be Miami right now had we had the foresight :computer2: