Opportunities knocking at the door

[FutureGM]

With all the floating trade rumors going around involving the hawks, I think its time to get some trades done. While Smoove is my favorite player on the hawks, but with him on the team we will NEVER win a championship, or with Joe for that matter. While Smoove is a great player but he has a mentality of an 8 year old, he has a very low basketball I.Q. on the offensive end. Personally, if the Hawks are ever gonna make a legitimate run in the playoffs then they have got to blow this team up, just keep some of the players we have and build around them ( Preferably build around Horford/Teague )

Now i know the hawks have been hit hard by the "injury bug" this year, so i can't say a whole lot about them losing games as of late. Although, i still believe the hawks are just a few moves away from being a contender in the playoffs. The main piece needed is an actual big man, now i think the hawks would be a lot better once Horford comes back if they can start playing him at is real position which is PF. Horford is a great player but he has to do to much, he is too small to play Center, but taking that into consideration he does a pretty good job playing out of position. Also, I think that Jason Collins is actually a pretty good Center, he would start on many other teams in the league... Remember how he shut down Dwight in the playoffs last year? So maybe our "Jeremy Lin" type player has been on our bench all this time.

Its highly doubtful that the Hawks can make a real push for Howard, especially if we trade Smoove. Although who knows, if the Hawks can build a team through some moves before the trade deadline maybe it would entice Howard to come to the Atl... Its doubtful but if we show that we are trying to build something great here in the A then Howard may want to come here, he is from here.

[GameTime]

Also, I think that Jason Collins is actually a pretty good Center, he would start on many other teams in the league... Remember how he shut down Dwight in the playoffs last year? So maybe our "Jeremy Lin" type player has been on our bench all this time.

[hawkrule152]

There is no way Collins would start on any team. Not taking anything away from him, but he is only around for a big body vs dwight..

If we were to trade smoove, i would take zaza starting C and move Horf to PF.. Zaza has been nothing but great for us since al went down.

[FutureGM]

Im just saying if Collins would work on his post moves and was given a chance to play, he could be a starter... Im not the only one who thinks so either, Charles Barkley said the same thing.

[NineOhTheRino]

I'd rather start Jason Whitlock

[FutureGM]

shoot y'all are crazy, Collins won me over last year taking a dump on Dwight... he was one of the only reasons we won that series.

[hawkrule152]

Collins is only effective against Dwight.. His entire career he was known as a defensive player.. He has been past his prime since ne played for the Nets.. He has never had post moves in his career, and he never will have post moves.. Hes only on the team for defensive purposes vs D12 and guys of that size.

[Buzzard]

I laugh when people call Josh talented. He is not talented, he is a gifted athlete. Big difference. CP3 is not a per se gifted athlete but he is a over the top kind of talented NBA player.

Josh can jam and dunk because he is athletic as hell. He cannot shoot, dribble drive, or post up because he does not have the talent to develop these skills at a high level. He is 27 years old and has been playing basketball all his life, if he has not honed these skills by now it is because he does not have the talent to do it.

I use to think this was the smartest NBA fan board anywhere, I am now beginning to wonder if there is such a thing.

Edited March 2, 2012 by Buzzard

[coachx]

I think the posters intentions are good.............he is just has no concept of the CBA rules dictating what teams can sign Dwight Howard to a contract......and the Hawks are not one of them unless we dump Marvin and Smith for an expiring contract like KG.

[AHF]

Im just saying if Collins would work on his post moves and was given a chance to play, he could be a starter... Im not the only one who thinks so either, Charles Barkley said the same thing.

If other teams thought he was starter quality, they would have offered him more than a vet minimum contract. Starter centers get paid.

[Guest]

Im just saying if Collins would work on his post moves and was given a chance to play, he could be a starter... Im not the only one who thinks so either, Charles Barkley said the same thing.

Collins days of working on post moves are long gone, all he is a big body against BIG centers to keep them off their sweet sports in the post.

[FutureGM]

I didn't say Josh was a great player, i just stated that he is my favorite player. I also said that he has " a very low basketball I.Q." I do understand the CBA rules as well, what i was trying to say is that if the Hawks make some trades then maybe it would entice Howard to want to come to Atl... If he wanted to come Orlando would end up doing a sign and trade and we would end up getting rid of a lot of lingering contracts to free up enough space for Howard... But one of those players delt couldn't be Josh because Howard and Smoove are friends therefore I'm sure he would want to play with him

This post isn't about Collins, Im merely stating that the Hawks need to make moves. I threw Collins name in their just because I believe he is the best center that we have on our roster, sure Zaza is good but he isn't very good on the defensive end.

Maybe y'all should fully read the topic before jumping to conclusions...

[Guest]

Have you watched Zaza play against D12 this year? He more than held his own, he rebounds, he hustles and can score a little if he doesn't try to do too much.

It may not be a thread about Collins, but you talk about Collins starting and him working on post moves, you gotta expect some comments - that is what stood out in your post besides all the other stuff....just saying.

Edited March 3, 2012 by JayBirdHawk

[FutureGM]

Yea but then again has Dwight really tried at all this year? He hasn't been playing like superman all year. Nothing against Zaza, he did have 2 steals on Dwight last game, but like i said Dwight isn't playing like Dwight.

[Brotha2ThaNite]

Man, you had me rolling with this.... I'm right there with you after reading that quote. lol

[FutureGM]

its not that hysterical, he is a pretty good big man. Not so much on the offensive end but he is the best "big" defender on the team. Hint, why we always play him when we play a team with a dominate big man.

[Diesel]

Opportunity knocks.

It's Danny Ainge floating hints in the press. He is not "actively" seeking to trade Rondo.. BUt he is definitely still picking up his phone.

I have a feeling that Boston doesn't want to rebuild with Rondo because it would KILL him.

I think that Josh is the way he is because he doesn't have a real PG who distributes. Use Horf to get Rondo or even Deron... but seeing that Rondo is available and plays better defense, let's get him. That's the move that makes sense here. You get Rondo and Josh will fall in line. Rondo won't put up with Josh's stuff. I was watching those old men last night. Nash and Hill could get Josh trained too... the problem with them is that they are 38 and 39.

[BrazilianHawk]

its not that hysterical, he is a pretty good big man. Not so much on the offensive end but he is the best "big" defender on the team. Hint, why we always play him when we play a team with a dominate big man.

Ok. Let's looks at some Howard data from last year's series against the Hawks:

http://espn.go.com/nba/scoreboard?date=20110428

Game 1 (ORL): 46 points, 19 rebounds (16-23 FG)

Game 2 (ORL): 33 points, 19 rebounds (9-12 FG)

Game 3 (ATL): 21 points, 15 rebounds (8-14 FG)

Game 4 (ATL): 29 points, 17 rebounds (9-14 FG)

Game 5 (ORL): 8 points, 8 rebounds (1-4 FG), ORL up 23 by halftime, Dwight played 29 minutes

Game 6 (ATL): 25 points, 15 rebounds (8-14 FG)

Now please explain to me HOW did Collins dominate Howard again?

Nimbers don't lie. Enough with this nonsense. Collins is horse crap!

[hawkrule152]

Yea but then again has Dwight really tried at all this year? He hasn't been playing like superman all year. Nothing against Zaza, he did have 2 steals on Dwight last game, but like i said Dwight isn't playing like Dwight.

LOL everything you say doesnt make any sense.. Have you watchted the NBA this year?? He is having the BEST rebounding season of his career grabbing 15 per game (but yeah thats weak i guess?) and it still averaging 20ppg while making 56% of his shots..

Edited March 3, 2012 by hawkrule152

[Admin]

Ok. Let's looks at some Howard data from last year's series against the Hawks:

http://espn.go.com/n...d?date=20110428

Game 1 (ORL): 46 points, 19 rebounds (16-23 FG)

Game 2 (ORL): 33 points, 19 rebounds (9-12 FG)

Game 3 (ATL): 21 points, 15 rebounds (8-14 FG)

Game 4 (ATL): 29 points, 17 rebounds (9-14 FG)

Game 5 (ORL): 8 points, 8 rebounds (1-4 FG), ORL up 23 by halftime, Dwight played 29 minutes

Game 6 (ATL): 25 points, 15 rebounds (8-14 FG)

Now please explain to me HOW did Collins dominate Howard again?

Nimbers don't lie. Enough with this nonsense. Collins is horse crap!

You can't use those "nimbers" though as Collins only played a limited amount of minutes. Last year Collins held Dwight significantly below his averages in FG% and EFF%, if I remember those correctly. Check out this article from a Magic Blog on SBNation.

http://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/2011/4/15/2112319/orlando-magic-atlanta-hawks-playoff-preview-jason-collins-dwight-howard

Jason Collins might be among the least skilled players in the NBA. He also has the power to shift the balance of an entire playoff series.

When the Orlando Magic face the Atlanta Hawks in the Eastern Conference Quarterfinals beginning this Saturday, they'll have to contend with Collins, Atlanta's seven-foot defensive specialist. Collins' task? Defend Magic center Dwight Howard, the league's most efficient volume scorer, one-on-one.

Collins, no stranger to Howard, has a solid track record against Orlando's superstar. Indeed, two of Howard's worst offensive games as a pro came against Collins: as a rookie, Howard shot 1-of-5 for 2 points against Collins' New Jersey Nets. Two years later, he missed all six of his shot attempts, managing just 1 point in 26 minutes, against New Jersey.

That success carried into this season as well, and credit first-year Hawks coach Larry Drew for trusting Collins against Orlando. Collins averaged 19.8 minutes per game against the Magic, compared to 11.4 against all other clubs. Though Howard still scored better than one point every two minutes against Atlanta--19.3 points in 37.1 minutes, to be precise--Collins limited his efficiency; Howard's 43.1 percent shooting mark against Atlanta is his worst against any team this season.

Thanks to PopcornMachine GameFlows and ESPN play-by-play data, we can further isolate instances in which Collins and Howard played together. The results are staggering: in the 78:10 both players shared the court this season, Howard shot 14-of-33 (42.4 percent) and committed 13 turnovers. The data don't tell us whether or not Collins actually defended Howard on each possession--he could have gotten caught on a switch, or lost in transition--but they nonetheless show Collins' tremendous defensive impact.

As a bonus for Atlanta, Collins does more than bottle Howard up: he also limits his minutes by drawing fouls. In the teams' most recent meeting, Howard committed two fouls against Collins in the game's first four minutes, forcing him to the bench until the start of the second period. The score stood at 6-6 when Howard exited, but Atlanta had a 27-25 edge when he returned. In the first two minutes of the next period, with Howard back on the floor, the Magic went on a 9-0 run to take a five-point lead.

Collins drew eight of the 14 fouls Howard committed against the Hawks this season; five were offensive outright, and another two came in a loose-ball situation, which automatically gave Atlanta possession. Generally speaking, both teams play at slow paces, which raises the value of each trip down the floor. The Magic must limit their giveaways anyway, but especially ones which also tack a foul onto their best player.

The good news for Orlando is Howard utterly dominated the Hawks whenever Collins sat, which indicates it's in the Magic's best interest to saddle Collins with fouls to keep him on the bench. In 69 minutes versus the Hawks without Collins on the floor, Howard overwhelmed Atlanta offensively to the tune of 47 points on 13-of-16 shooting. That Howard attempted almost twice as many foul shots (31) as field goals with Collins benched indicates how vital Collins is to Atlanta's success, as neither his backups (Zaza Pachulia, Josh Powell, and Etan Thomas) nor the other Hawk capable of playing center (two-time All-Star Al Horford) can muscle Howard out of the lane or limit his easy shot attempts.

That Atlanta views Collins as a "Howard Stopper" is not news; that much became clear when Drew plugged Collins into his starting five when his Hawks played the Magic for the first time this season. That Collins has enjoyed success against Howard isn't exactly a surprise either. But now we know the extent to which the unassuming veteran can limit Howard. And those results are simply too eye-popping to ignore.