Mike Woodson on Atlanta Radio

[NineOhTheRino]

Mike Woodsonhttp-~~-//media.790thezone.com/Podcasts/2446/Mike%20Woodson%206-7-12.mp3Slow day Edited June 8, 2012 by NineOhTheRino

[Diesel]

"I think the fans are the best that I have been around. ""Knicks fans are true... they know basketball."

[Admin]

Always love hearing Woody talk. I'd like to wish him success, but only limited success and never against Atlanta. Would have liked to have heard him talk more about the Josh Smith thing there are the end.

[Brotha2ThaNite]

Woody just told the truth. The media did hyped the Woody vs Josh. Fans listen to the media and follow their lead.Everyone talks about how Josh has improved every year but some Hawks fans.I remember Kenny the Jet talking about Josh on 790 to BO "The Dean"... Dean kept talking about Josh shot selection at the end of some games. Kenny said, the guy has gotten better and brings you so much more than just offense. Kenny said, hey some time you just have to deal with somethings you don't like if the person is that good.He gave an example of his son who gets nothing but good grades but he comes into his room to find shoes everywhere and him eating pizza on his bed. (It was something like that)

[Diesel]

Woody just told the truth. The media did hyped the Woody vs Josh. Fans listen to the media and follow their lead.Everyone talks about how Josh has improved every year but some Hawks fans.I remember Kenny the Jet talking about Josh on 790 to BO "The Dean"... Dean kept talking about Josh shot selection at the end of some games. Kenny said, the guy has gotten better and brings you so much more than just offense. Kenny said, hey some time you just have to deal with somethings you don't like if the person is that good.He gave an example of his son who gets nothing but good grades but he comes into his room to find shoes everywhere and him eating pizza on his bed. (It was something like that)

Both Kenny and LD is wrong.It sets the wrong example to let the kid leave his shoes everywhere and eat pizza on the bed. For Children, you have to set boundaries. Once set, you have to be willing to enforce them.Put Josh on the Detroit Bad Boys team... With all of his ability and talent. Do you think that lockerroom put up with his shit?? I'll tell you exactly what would happen. Mahorn and Lambeer would have pinned him into a corner while Isiah and the rest continued whacking him until he played the game right. That's the problem with children and basketball players today. You tell them all that it's their world to rule and they feel like they don't have to pay dues. They feel like they are entitled to the best of everything. They feel like that they're not supposed to take direction. You allow Josh to do this and you release the floodgates and send the message that the coach is not in charge.. Phil Jackson, Jerry Sloan, Mark Jackson, nor Popp would put up with this. Only the lowest paid coach in the game in the last year of his contract (every year) would put up with this.

[thecampster]

Both Kenny and LD is wrong.

It sets the wrong example to let the kid leave his shoes everywhere and eat pizza on the bed. For Children, you have to set boundaries. Once set, you have to be willing to enforce them.

Put Josh on the Detroit Bad Boys team... With all of his ability and talent. Do you think that lockerroom put up with his shit?? I'll tell you exactly what would happen. Mahorn and Lambeer would have pinned him into a corner while Isiah and the rest continued whacking him until he played the game right. That's the problem with children and basketball players today. You tell them all that it's their world to rule and they feel like they don't have to pay dues. They feel like they are entitled to the best of everything. They feel like that they're not supposed to take direction. You allow Josh to do this and you release the floodgates and send the message that the coach is not in charge.. Phil Jackson, Jerry Sloan, Mark Jackson, nor Popp would put up with this. Only the lowest paid coach in the game in the last year of his contract (every year) would put up with this.

Let me get this straight Diesel. Kenny Smith, the tv analyst, 10 year NBA vet and Larry Drew, the NBA head coach, 10 year assistant coach and 11 year NBA player are wrong and you are right?

You know, some of the hubris filled opinions of the members of this board get to be a bit much at times.

Mike Woodson, "I think there are a lot of teams that would like to have Josh".

Edited June 8, 2012 by thecampster

[AHF]

Let me get this straight Diesel. Kenny Smith, the tv analyst, 10 year NBA vet and Larry Drew, the NBA head coach, 10 year assistant coach and 11 year NBA player are wrong and you are right?You know, some of the hubris filled opinions of the members of this board get to be a bit much at times.Mike Woodson, "I think there are a lot of teams that would like to have Josh".

I think all the many coaches that would not accept Josh's free shooting are right. Just because an NBA vet who is coaching accepted Antoine Walker shooting 3's "because there weren't 4's" doesn't mean that it is the concensus right approach.Woody let Josh have too much rope, IMO, but even he got Josh to all but eliminate the 3 in his last year with the team.Is it hubris to say that Woody was right (better late than never) making this progress because LD and Kenny Smith would let Josh shoot a dozen long-range shots per game? Edited June 8, 2012 by AHF

[Wurider05]

I agree with Diesel in that both Kenny Smith and LD are both dead wrong. Josh Smith isn't a championship level superstar. You can't let 2nd and 3rd tier players do whatever the hell they want on the floor. That's my problem with the team and the franchise. Are we so low of a franchise that a player the calibur of a Josh Smith gets to do whatever he wants to do? We apparently are so low of a franchise that we gave 120 million to a that averages 16.9 a game in the playoffs while shooting 41%. The mentality and pride of this team has to change before anything else.

[Guest]

Josh's "great" things does not tip the scale enough to just overlook the bad things and say "we will live with it" because he does so much other good things. And it's not only Josh's shot selection that is a problem, his boxing out on rebounds, loafing up the court on defense sometimes not even getting past half court, slow and half-hearted effort to close out on shooters because he thinks his athleticism will be enough.I've always been a Josh fan but "I am just tired"

Edited June 8, 2012 by JayBirdHawk

[AHawks89]

I love how every thread is always about Josh Smith.

"I aint Mike Jones, keep my name out yo mouth Bi..."

[Admin]

I love how every thread is always about Josh Smith.

"I aint Mike Jones, keep my name out yo mouth Bi..."

What else are we gonna talk about? LOL

[Admin]

If the only way to keep Josh active and interested in all areas of the game is to let him shoot jumpers then so be it. Better that than him becoming a locker room cancer. Not saying that's acceptable behavior but I doubt any coach could do much to change it at this point. Our best bet would be for Josh to buy into playing like he did 3 years ago under Woody with the promise that he'd be a lock for the all-star game playing like that.

[Admin]

If that is the only way then OK. Now how do you know it is? Seems lazy for a coach to just give up just as much as it is lazy for a parent to let their kid have a messy room just because they got good grades.

I don't know that it is but after 7 years I'd have to think that LD would know best how to motivate him by now.

[Joker]

Both Kenny and LD is wrong.It sets the wrong example to let the kid leave his shoes everywhere and eat pizza on the bed. For Children, you have to set boundaries. Once set, you have to be willing to enforce them.Put Josh on the Detroit Bad Boys team... With all of his ability and talent. Do you think that lockerroom put up with his shit?? I'll tell you exactly what would happen. Mahorn and Lambeer would have pinned him into a corner while Isiah and the rest continued whacking him until he played the game right. That's the problem with children and basketball players today. You tell them all that it's their world to rule and they feel like they don't have to pay dues. They feel like they are entitled to the best of everything. They feel like that they're not supposed to take direction. You allow Josh to do this and you release the floodgates and send the message that the coach is not in charge.. Phil Jackson, Jerry Sloan, Mark Jackson, nor Popp would put up with this. Only the lowest paid coach in the game in the last year of his contract (every year) would put up with this.

A strong locker room usually has a player better than Josh caliber or a team that fits Josh. Atlanta has neither. Send Josh to Houston for their two 1st's and Scola, let them have him with McHale. In a year, they can go after Dwight and move on with all of their cap space and let them do that. As for us, we need to build around Horford, get him a PnR PG like Marshall, get a lot more depth and build our own destiny. Edited June 9, 2012 by Joker

[thecampster]

Two economists are walking down the street. There is a $100 bill laying on the sidewalk, so one economist says to the other "hey is that a $100 bill?" The other looks at him and proudly proclaims "certainly not, if there was a $100 bill on the ground someone would have picked it up by now."I think Diesel makes a fine point. This lack of discipline with coaches trickles down to the players. Josh should not be shooting long jumpers and we need a coach to stop him from doing this. Doing something right should not allow you to do something wrong.

A better example of your argument would be:3 wall street economists talking in the back of a limo Diesel is driving. One economist says, I'm thinking of investing in fund x, it's a fund comprised of 12 stocks of which 10 have historically produced at a high level and 2 have had mixed to poor returns. The 3 economists determine that the fund is reasonably priced and the overall production is in the top 10% of funds managed. They decided to recommend the fund because of the value and overlook the 2 poorly performing stocks. Diesel hearing this goes around to all of his friends and tell them to never listen to the economists again because he heard them recommending a fund with 2 bad stocks in it. He recorded their conversation and plays it for his friends. One of them says, "Dude, they point out the overall value and the performance of the 10". Diesel responds, "There are 2 losers in the fund, they're dead wrong".Now the friends debate among themselves and because they are familiar with the 2 dog stocks yell "Listen to Diesel, he knows best" and ignore the advice of the wall street economists. This isn't "Trading Places".

[NineOhTheRino]

What else are we gonna talk about? LOL

Pape Sy?Joe Johnson's truck?WNBA pre-draft thread?idk

[AHF]

If the only way to keep Josh active and interested in all areas of the game is to let him shoot jumpers then so be it. Better that than him becoming a locker room cancer. Not saying that's acceptable behavior but I doubt any coach could do much to change it at this point. Our best bet would be for Josh to buy into playing like he did 3 years ago under Woody with the promise that he'd be a lock for the all-star game playing like that.

The fact that he already cut out his 3's in Woody's last season and then quickly reversed course under LD makes me think (a) it is possible for Josh to play more to his strengths and to minimize some of his weaknesses and (b) that LD isn't the guy to do it.

[Admin]

The fact that he already cut out his 3's in Woody's last season and then quickly reversed course under LD makes me think (a) it is possible for Josh to play more to his strengths and to minimize some of his weaknesses and (b) that LD isn't the guy to do it.

We've also seen Josh be better in almost every other area of his game since LD took over so maybe LD decided that he'd get more out of Josh overall by allowing him more freedom. Is that the right move? I don't know, but it's been effective outside of the long jumper aspect, but really Josh needs to look at himself and decide to play to his strengths while continuing to do the things at his highest possible level that make him so valuable to the team.

[AHF]

We've also seen Josh be better in almost every other area of his game since LD took over so maybe LD decided that he'd get more out of Josh overall by allowing him more freedom. Is that the right move? I don't know, but it's been effective outside of the long jumper aspect, but really Josh needs to look at himself and decide to play to his strengths while continuing to do the things at his highest possible level that make him so valuable to the team.

I'm not sure I agree with your premise.

Bold = best; itallics = second best; nothing = worst

2009-10 15.7 ppg, .535 ts%, 8.7 rpg, 4.3 apg, 1.6 spg, 2.2 bpg, 1.72 a/to

2010-11 16.5 ppg, .540 ts%, 8.5 rpg, 3.5 apg, 1.3 spg, 1.6 bpg, 1.29 a/to

2011-12 18.8 ppg, .499 ts%, 9.6 rpg, 4.0 apg, 1.4 spg, 1.8 bpg, 1.6 a/to

So in the season in which he took fewer jumpers and almost no threes, Josh had his best season for assists, blocks, steals, a/to ratio, and was dramatically more efficient than last year. Last season, Josh shot more but much worse and did a better job on the boards.

I think you can make an argument he has done less the last two seasons than he did in his best season in 2009-10.

Edited June 11, 2012 by AHF

[Admin]

I'm not sure I agree with your premise.

Bold = best; itallics = second best; nothing = worst

2009-10 15.7 ppg, .535 ts%, 8.7 rpg, 4.3 apg, 1.6 spg, 2.2 bpg

2010-11 16.5 ppg, .540 ts%, 8.5 rpg, 3.5 apg, 1.3 spg, 1.6 bpg

2011-12 18.8 ppg, .499 ts%, 9.6 rpg, 4.0 apg, 1.4 spg, 1.8 bpg

So in the season in which he took fewer jumpers and almost no threes, Josh had his best season for assists, blocks, steals, a/to ratio, and was dramatically more efficient than last year. Last season, Josh shot more but much worse and did a better job on the boards.

I think you can make an argument he has done less the last two seasons than he did in his best season in 2009-10.

The assists, steals and blocks from this year are all within reason of 2009-2010 and it's plausible (though certainly not an absolute) that he'd have a little more in each category had Horford been around... though rebounds would have certainly gone done some.

Looking at 82games.com, in 2009-2010 Josh played almost all of his minutes at PF and had a NET PER of 3.5 and an overall win share of 63.3, whereas this year at PF he had a NET PER of 4.4 and an overall win share of 68.8. Considering the lapse in his efficiency and shooting this year it leads me to believe that he had a greater positive impact in other areas to create such a disparity.

To me it just seemed like Josh took fewer risks defensively and played better positionally this year than he ever has on defense and I don't think you can prove or disprove that with these stats.