Steve Kyler on Twitter (Hoopsworld)

[MrMeltdown]

Building around your most immature, selfish player who really does not have a defined position is just stupid. No-one ever built around Lamar Odom. Ferry or whoever is making a huge mistake if they think this clown is worth building around. I ignored it and moved on but Teague tried to gather the team before some free throws in the Clippers game and Josh just ignored him while everyone else gathered. Yes Teague made a mistake by not coming back to the ball, but what if someone held every stupid play Josh made against him? We need to move on from the guy not build around him. He is just as much of a reminder of everything that is wrong with the organization as Marvin was.

Edited November 28, 2012 by MrMeltdown

[EazyRoc]

People didn't want to hear it when I said Pau will get worse before he gets better.

[thecampster]

Just a quick question: Is it me or does it seem like 80% of NBA fans only look at the offensive side of a NBA player? Josh is one of the best defensive players in the league, if not the best as of now. That alone is good enough for me, but when you add in great passing skills, rebounds, blocks, and the fact that he can fill up the stat sheet too, makes me wonder why people only judge him on the offensive side (where is isn't even bad, just bad decisions from time to time). It's not like he is making us lose games, and making our team terrible.

Uhm....tough question. You see, the average NBA fan doesn't understand total defense like more knowledgable fans do. They look at the box score and see "0" blocks and say, Oh must have been a tough game. Or they see a player post up your player and score and they think...ah he sucks in the post.

What they don't see. How many times the team decides not to go at that player in the post. The person on the wing who wasn't open because the person being posted did not need help to hold the player to 50/50 chance of making the basket. The no decisions. That's the biggest one. When people don't go at the basket afraid of a block, run the possession clock low because an entry pass is denied. There is a reason the Hawks were so good defensively last year and have been even better this year. This isn't just Josh Smith. Many players on our team (Teague and Al specifically) that disallow another teams offensive set to continue as planned. The other team may score or we may not get a steal or block but the other team's offensive rhythm has been disrupted.

An NBA game is 48 minutes long. We tend to focus on highlight plays, but teams get 70-100 possessions in an average game. (last game 92 for the bobcats for ex). Most NBA games are decided by 5 or fewer possessions. Disrupting 5-10 extra offensive sets usually is what a defense needs to succeed.

[Wretch]

Just a quick question: Is it me or does it seem like 80% of NBA fans only look at the offensive side of a NBA player? Josh is one of the best defensive players in the league, if not the best as of now. That alone is good enough for me, but when you add in great passing skills, rebounds, blocks, and the fact that he can fill up the stat sheet too, makes me wonder why people only judge him on the offensive side (where is isn't even bad, just bad decisions from time to time). It's not like he is making us lose games, and making our team terrible.

First let me say that I agree with you. Josh has been my favorite Hawk over the years FIRST because of his defensive ability and secondly because of the way he plays all over the court. Playing within his limits, and doing what he's GREAT at makes him an invaluable PIECE to our team. As opposed to TRYING to take on a game that he doesn't have and performing that role rather poorly...but let's not digress.

One argument that I have made over the years is in regards to a player being able to score. In this day of advanced stats and readily available micro-data, I honestly think it gets lost on people that the object of the game...is to put the ball in the basket. Defending the basket is a secondary objective. So, when you're talking about winning, building a team, championships...the conversation begins with guys who can score.

It's important.

Josh Smith is a great player...but his role is not that of a scorer. He has the potential to be phenomenal, but it's not going to come from his ability to put the ball in the basket. So, he's never going to be looked at (or he SHOULD NOT BE looked at) in the same way that a prolific scoring leader is. Unless Josh ditches the jumpers and just suddenly finds a way to put up 20-25ppg at a high %, then we will (and rightfully should) continue to look for the guy that can be the centerpiece for our team.

[ag82]

He is a good defender, but his offense can be so inefficient enough to cancel that out.Look at his dws/48 and then his ws/48. The difference is shockingly horrific.

[MaceCase]

He is a good defender, but his offense can be so inefficient enough to cancel that out.Look at his dws/48 and then his ws/48. The difference is shockingly horrific.

This is correct. People try to minimize his issues on offense to "oh, a bad jumper here, a bad pass there" when the truth is that he dominates a very large percentage of the offense while putting up far less than mediocre efficiency. You can easily excuse it if it was the opposite where it's a lower total of possessions but that's not the case when you are looking at 18-19 points on 22 shots.

[Admin]

This is correct. People try to minimize his issues on offense to "oh, a bad jumper here, a bad pass there" when the truth is that he dominates a very large percentage of the offense while putting up far less than mediocre efficiency. You can easily excuse it if it was the opposite where it's a lower total of possessions but that's not the case when you are looking at 18-19 points on 22 shots.Yep that's not a surprise at all. Just imagine if you put the brain and heart of a Kenneth Faried or Ben Wallace in Josh Smiths body. You'd be talking about a hall of fame lock and arguably the greatest Hawk of all time. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2Speaking of win shares where has KB been since the start of the season? Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

[capstone21]

People also overrate his defense too. He makes flashy blocks from the weak side and he does change some shots but do not be mistaken that brick is an excellent defender. He has excellent timing but he gambles too much. He is an average post defender and average man on man defender. On the perimeter he is average or below average because he can never stay in front of his man. Josh is not a shut down defender and calling him one of the best defenders in the league is laughable. I will agree that he is one of the best weak side defenders though. Probably one of the most aggravating things he does is he let's his man go to the basket so he can try to block the shot instead of just staying in front of him.

[Jody23]

At this point, imo, Josh's true value is not in his game, but in his ability to recruit. If Josh has the ability to recruit game changers and difference makers to come play here, then I can see why Ferry would be insistent on keeping him. But if he can't, it's time to move on. Judging by Dwight's comments in today's Realgm article, it doesn't sound like he's contemplating leaving the Lakers at all.

[Admin]

At this point, imo, Josh's true value is not in his game, but in his ability to recruit. If Josh has the ability to recruit game changers and difference makers to come play here, then I can see why Ferry would be insistent on keeping him. But if he can't, it's time to move on. Judging by Dwight's comments in today's Realgm article, it doesn't sound like he's contemplating leaving the Lakers at all.Wait until tomorrow, Dwight will have changed his mind. I wouldn't believe a word he says... But I do agree that he's not coming to Atlanta unless the Lakers are horrible this year and they run him out of town. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

[capstone21]

At this point, imo, Josh's true value is not in his game, but in his ability to recruit. If Josh has the ability to recruit game changers and difference makers to come play here, then I can see why Ferry would be insistent on keeping him. But if he can't, it's time to move on. Judging by Dwight's comments in today's Realgm article, it doesn't sound like he's contemplating leaving the Lakers at all.Wait until tomorrow, Dwight will have changed his mind. I wouldn't believe a word he says... But I do agree that he's not coming to Atlanta unless the Lakers are horrible this year and they run him out of town. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

Yes, Howard is not coming here.

[Jody23]

At this point, imo, Josh's true value is not in his game, but in his ability to recruit. If Josh has the ability to recruit game changers and difference makers to come play here, then I can see why Ferry would be insistent on keeping him. But if he can't, it's time to move on. Judging by Dwight's comments in today's Realgm article, it doesn't sound like he's contemplating leaving the Lakers at all.Wait until tomorrow, Dwight will have changed his mind. I wouldn't believe a word he says... But I do agree that he's not coming to Atlanta unless the Lakers are horrible this year and they run him out of town. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

I agree. I don't think Dwight is coming here. This is why I'm not sure why Ferry reportedly is set on re-signing Josh. There just has to be some unknown factor at play that makes keeping him worth it. After seeing LeBron up close and personal, you absolutely lose all credibility if you think Josh Smith is a player you can build around. Btw, in his latest Hoopsworld chat, Kyler continues to insist Josh and Ferry have talked and are on the same page regarding the future. Edited December 3, 2012 by Jody23

[DrReality]

If he stays we have to have a different coach who will stand up to hillAnd he has to learn his role. He's not the focal pointThat said gasol is not the guy

[Wretch]

People also overrate his defense too. He makes flashy blocks from the weak side and he does change some shots but do not be mistaken that brick is an excellent defender. He has excellent timing but he gambles too much. He is an average post defender and average man on man defender. On the perimeter he is average or below average because he can never stay in front of his man. Josh is not a shut down defender and calling him one of the best defenders in the league is laughable. I will agree that he is one of the best weak side defenders though. Probably one of the most aggravating things he does is he let's his man go to the basket so he can try to block the shot instead of just staying in front of him.

i think first, we need to make a distinction. A player's defense and their defensive presence are two different things. A guy can have a good defensive presence without being a great man defender - keeping his guy in front, holding his position, etc. Josh *CAN BE* an intimidating defensive presence and there was a time when he was just that. Teams respected his ability to patrol the paint and the game changed when he went to the bench. It is a pity that we chose to groom him (or allow him) to chase this career path rather than mold him into the player he was meant to be.

This would have been a different team...