Today's Question for the day... 9-8-2021...

[Diesel]

Will Deing and the maturation of OO give us what we need to beat the frontlines of Milwaukee, NJ, and Philly?

Explore the matchups.

 

[Peoriabird]

Maybe it was a dream but I thought we beat Philly last season to go to the conference finals.

[Diesel]

5 hours ago, Peoriabird said:

Maybe it was a dream but I thought we beat Philly last season to go to the conference finals.

We did...  But do you think that puts them in the rear view?

[AHF]

8 hours ago, Diesel said:

We did...  But do you think that puts them in the rear view?

As long as they have Embiid, they will be threats.  What happens with Simmons will define where they sit on the pecking order. 

[Diesel]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

As long as they have Embiid, they will be threats.  What happens with Simmons will define where they sit on the pecking order. 

From a statistical POV.. They not only beat us, they dominated us.   But we won the series.  If we played them 100 times, I think we'd win 50 and they'd win 50.   I don't put them in the rear view at all.   I think we took advantage of how out of shape Embiid is (as we should) and the Ben Simmons issue.  I don't think anybody knows how this Simmons thing will shake out.  But just like us.. they get to have a training camp and they get to be less injured.   It's going to be interesting.   But because of that, we should not stop trying to improve.   We haven't gotten "there" yet. 

 

[sillent]

18 hours ago, Diesel said:

We did...  But do you think that puts them in the rear view?

Did we not destroy the Process?

We got better. They got problems and more than likely are going to be weaker defensively once Simmons is gone.

Rear view until proven otherwise...

[MarylandHawk]

On 9/8/2021 at 10:00 AM, Diesel said:

Will Deing and the maturation of OO give us what we need to beat the frontlines of Milwaukee, NJ, and Philly?

Explore the matchups.

 

Not sure. Length is my only concern. I know their wingspans are pretty good but I need to see it in action against those guys. If what we saw defensively out of OO17 is real and here to stay, then we are in good shape. Gorgi Porgi will bring that stretch 5 action to the party and give other teams backup bigs a real problem. 

[Spud2nique]

2 hours ago, MarylandHawk said:

Gorgi Porgi

[Diesel]

18 hours ago, sillent said:

Did we not destroy the Process?

We got better. They got problems and more than likely are going to be weaker defensively once Simmons is gone.

Rear view until proven otherwise...

We did not.  We exploited their weakest link but that's not the same as destroying the process??  Embiid healthy is the process all by himself.   Did you not watch that man?  Maybe it was me but they seemed more formidable with Simmons on the bench.   Simmons is something that they do have to figure out.. but if they traded him for future picks.. I think they are still good enough to provide a challenge for us.  And you say we got better?  That's putting a lot of trust in Wright.   The truth is we HOPE we're better.. .but until we see it on the floor, we don't know. 

[Gray Mule]

Seeing is believing!  Yes Diesel.  We must see before we really believe.  Back up PG and center have not proven to us but we've watched them with their former teams and we live in hope that we are better.

We're better because we're healthy.  Except Agent 0017 is out with surgery until after the 1st of the year.  Whenever he is well enough to return our two draft picks may be moving up from Skyhawk country to take their rightful place with the big boys.

[sillent]

9 hours ago, Diesel said:

We did not.  We exploited their weakest link but that's not the same as destroying the process??  Embiid healthy is the process all by himself.   Did you not watch that man?  Maybe it was me but they seemed more formidable with Simmons on the bench.   Simmons is something that they do have to figure out.. but if they traded him for future picks.. I think they are still good enough to provide a challenge for us.  And you say we got better?  That's putting a lot of trust in Wright.   The truth is we HOPE we're better.. .but until we see it on the floor, we don't know. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/sixers/sam-hinkie-joel-embiid-tobias-harris-sixers-trust-the-process-20190207.html%3foutputType=amp

You're right the process was a joke to begin with. 85 players countless top 3 picks and only one player left (Joel Embiid) to show for it.

If you wanna say the Process is ongoing because of Embiid be my guest. Almost 10 yrs of being a laughing stock and not making the ECF the process killed itself.

Especially when a team that only spent about 3yrs rebuilding & one tearing it down to run thru "the process" without Dre and Cam.

How do I know we should be better? If we remain healthy without any individual improvements we will be better. We didn't play full force all season last year.

People will copy our system. No good GM will be following the process. Process destroyed.

 

 

[sillent]

Jrue Holiday, TJ Mc Connell, Markelle Fultz, Michael Carter Williams, Ish Smith, JJ Reddick, Jimmy Butler, Josh Richardson, Evan Turner, Timothe Luwawu-Cabarrot, Robert Covington, Thaddeus Young, Wilson Chandler, Carl Landry, Jerami Grant, Erson Ilyasova, Luc Mbaha Moute, Nerleons Noel, Richaun Holmes, Christian Woods, Dewayne Dedmon and more... What do they have in common? They've all been thru the process. 

You telling me they couldn't build a good sustainable team in the last 9yrs with all of these players. I didn't even mention some others whose careers didn't get to launch because of the process (Fultz was almost another victim) or nobody currently on the team.

It's sickening when you think about it and look at it. Not a coach nor GM could even withstand the destruction the process has caused. Worse it had to hurt seeing Mikal Bridges, a hometown kid they drafted and traded and Jrue Holiday in the Finals.

It's getting better now (maybe) but the cost is a "Process" completely destroyed. Ben Simmons is all but gone and the team will inevitably look a little different once he leaves. 

 

 

[Diesel]

35 minutes ago, sillent said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inquirer.com/sixers/sam-hinkie-joel-embiid-tobias-harris-sixers-trust-the-process-20190207.html%3foutputType=amp

You're right the process was a joke to begin with. 85 players countless top 3 picks and only one player left (Joel Embiid) to show for it.

If you wanna say the Process is ongoing because of Embiid be my guest. Almost 10 yrs of being a laughing stock and not making the ECF the process killed itself.

Especially when a team that only spent about 3yrs rebuilding & one tearing it down to run thru "the process" without Dre and Cam.

How do I know we should be better? If we remain healthy without any individual improvements we will be better. We didn't play full force all season last year.

People will copy our system. No good GM will be following the process. Process destroyed.

 

 

Embiid + Simmons is the Process.   There are a bunch of failed picks.   A few bad contracts... But whatever happens with Embiid and Simmons tells the story.  Now... Embiid is MVP candidate.   Simmons, First Team Defense, All NBA second team.   Even if they trade Simmons they will get something back. 

If  a process can get you an MVP candidate and a First Team All Defense and Second team All NBA.. GMs will follow it.

So that you will have a reference. 

The Hawks have NEVER had an MVP candidate.

So in our whole franchise history... nothing we have done has produced a MVP candidate.  Yet... you call a process that produced an MVP candidate and a First team All defensive player (at the same time) Destroyed???

Opps.. there goes gravity.. Come back to reality. 

[Diesel]

33 minutes ago, sillent said:

Jrue Holiday, TJ Mc Connell, Markelle Fultz, Michael Carter Williams, Ish Smith, JJ Reddick, Jimmy Butler, Josh Richardson, Evan Turner, Timothe Luwawu-Cabarrot, Robert Covington, Thaddeus Young, Wilson Chandler, Carl Landry, Jerami Grant, Erson Ilyasova, Luc Mbaha Moute, Nerleons Noel, Richaun Holmes, Christian Woods, Dewayne Dedmon and more... What do they have in common? They've all been thru the process. 

You telling me they couldn't build a good sustainable team in the last 9yrs with all of these players. I didn't even mention some others whose careers didn't get to launch because of the process (Fultz was almost another victim) or nobody currently on the team.

It's sickening when you think about it and look at it. Not a coach nor GM could even withstand the destruction the process has caused. Worse it had to hurt seeing Mikal Bridges, a hometown kid they drafted and traded and Jrue Holiday in the Finals.

It's getting better now (maybe) but the cost is a "Process" completely destroyed. Ben Simmons is all but gone and the team will inevitably look a little different once he leaves. 

 

 

I thought I would point out to you the players that were worth one good gotdam...

Most of these players are journeymen.  And of the ones I pointed out.. .Only two have been allstars.   If you build a team with the pile of crap that you have placed before us, you have picks between 15-20 every year.    

I see that you don't understand what the process really is?

The process is a tanking strategy meant to get a team away from the mid first round players that turn out to be journeymen and towards the top of the draft where it's possible to pick up an MVP candidate.   Now If Philly had been able to pick worth a damn... they would have a monster team right now... Similar to OKC back in the day.. But because they sucked at drafting... they only came away with an MVP candidate and a First team All Defense and a Second team All NBA.

Just imagine Philly with Jayson Tatum, Lonzo ball or DeArron Fox instead of Fultz.

[sillent]

40 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Embiid + Simmons is the Process.   There are a bunch of failed picks.   A few bad contracts... But whatever happens with Embiid and Simmons tells the story.  Now... Embiid is MVP candidate.   Simmons, First Team Defense, All NBA second team.   Even if they trade Simmons they will get something back. 

If  a process can get you an MVP candidate and a First Team All Defense and Second team All NBA.. GMs will follow it.

So that you will have a reference. 

The Hawks have NEVER had an MVP candidate.

So in our whole franchise history... nothing we have done has produced a MVP candidate.  Yet... you call a process that produced an MVP candidate and a First team All defensive player (at the same time) Destroyed???

Opps.. there goes gravity.. Come back to reality. 

So pretty much you'd except Travis being Hinkie... Oh Hinkie couldn't even see it all the way thru. Say no more.

Edited September 12, 2021 by sillent

[sillent]

25 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I thought I would point out to you the players that were worth one good gotdam...

Most of these players are journeymen.  And of the ones I pointed out.. .Only two have been allstars.   If you build a team with the pile of crap that you have placed before us, you have picks between 15-20 every year.    

I see that you don't understand what the process really is?

The process is a tanking strategy meant to get a team away from the mid first round players that turn out to be journeymen and towards the top of the draft where it's possible to pick up an MVP candidate.   Now If Philly had been able to pick worth a damn... they would have a monster team right now... Similar to OKC back in the day.. But because they sucked at drafting... they only came away with an MVP candidate and a First team All Defense and a Second team All NBA.

Just imagine Philly with Jayson Tatum, Lonzo ball or DeArron Fox instead of Fultz.

So you're telling me a squad of

PG Jrue Holiday/Ben Simmons/Ish Smith/Markelle Fultz/MCW

SG Jimmy Butler/Seth Curry/JJ Reddick 

SF (Ben Simmons)/Tobias Harris/Thaddeus Young

PF Jerami Grant/Christian Woods/(Carl Landry, Ersan or Mike Scott/Al Horford)

C Joel Embiid/Richaun Holmes/Dewayne Dedmon/Nerleons Noel 

Team couldn't contend

I guess not with Brett Brown. Maybe Lloyd Pierce would've had a better start to his coaching career if he was hired as their head coach a few yrs earlier. 

Either way if they would've built with their best picks and players they could've still had a nasty team a lot earlier (especially when the East was weak) and not still be going thru a process.

Edited September 12, 2021 by sillent

[Diesel]

6 hours ago, sillent said:

So pretty much you'd except Travis being Hinkie... Oh Hinkie couldn't even see it all the way thru. Say no more.

Did you miss it??  Travis did follow the Hinke Process!!

His first move was to move DHoward for a bunch of stiffs with lesser contracts. 

He then drafted JC and signed a lot of players that couldn't win. 

He fired Bud... and Hired a young coach LP... who had never coached before. 

Got Trae...  From there he kept the team in lottery status... I mean...both Hunter and Cam are lottery picks. 

OO is a lottery pick.

So Just like Hinke.. Bud did the:

1.  Firesale.

2.  Kept the team good enough to be in the lottery. 

And grew the core of the team from the lottery.  That's the same thing as the process.   Travis is just better at spotting talent. 

[Diesel]

7 hours ago, sillent said:

So you're telling me a squad of

PG Jrue Holiday/Ben Simmons/Ish Smith/Markelle Fultz/MCW

SG Jimmy Butler/Seth Curry/JJ Reddick 

SF (Ben Simmons)/Tobias Harris/Thaddeus Young

PF Jerami Grant/Christian Woods/(Carl Landry, Ersan or Mike Scott/Al Horford)

C Joel Embiid/Richaun Holmes/Dewayne Dedmon/Nerleons Noel 

Team couldn't contend

I guess not with Brett Brown. Maybe Lloyd Pierce would've had a better start to his coaching career if he was hired as their head coach a few yrs earlier. 

Either way if they would've built with their best picks and players they could've still had a nasty team a lot earlier (especially when the East was weak) and not still be going thru a process.

Sure they could contend... but you have to put into perspective the problems that they had..

They had Embiid, Butler, Simmons and JJ at the same time.    Butler got pissed and left. 

Coaching and player development means a lot. 

Many of those trade mistakes was not on Hinke.  Bryan Coangelo made a lot of dubious trades.  The question is... Was he in on the process?  I mean, without him, they would have Jayson Tatum. 

 

 

[AHF]

The Sixers haven’t been a failure.  They’ve been pretty darn successful without having made the leap to the Finals.  I do think the post-Hinkie GMs squandered the impressive cabinet of assets he left the but even with that they’ve made the conference finals, been the #1 seed, etc.  As long as they have Embiid, they can still win a ring from the fruits of that tree.  
 

That said, TS runs circles around them.  If he had that range of picks….wow.

[sillent]

3 hours ago, AHF said:

The Sixers haven’t been a failure.  They’ve been pretty darn successful without having made the leap to the Finals.  I do think the post-Hinkie GMs squandered the impressive cabinet of assets he left the but even with that they’ve made the conference finals, been the #1 seed, etc.  As long as they have Embiid, they can still win a ring from the fruits of that tree.  
 

That said, TS runs circles around them.  If he had that range of picks….wow.

I agree for the most part. 6 yrs of losing horribly and 3 yrs of winning unfortunately isn't that bad a rebuild in the nba smh...

When they are down to their last (picked) player of "the process" after so many lottery attempts it's hard to call that a success though. Especially when everyone who built/started the process is gone.

Depending on their next move they could very well eventually lose Embiid too and have to start the process all over again.

I love the Hawks but if we went thru that many yrs of torment and bad records I definitely want the winning to trump that. If they don't get what they need from the Simmons trade (which looks very likely at this point) it will have to be heart breaking to a fan. Worse it was by a team that rebuilt way quicker and look to be a serious problem from here on. 

If anyone copies "the process" again I'd be highly surprised. To intentionally tank for that long without alot of major assets to show for it is just ridiculous.