BlackHawkDown Top 50

[BlackHawkDown]

It finally here

1. Shaq

2. KG - Lone player on a bad team; manages to make them look good

3. T Mac

4. AI

5. Kobe

6. C Webb

7. P Pierce

8. Kidd

9. T.Duncan - Need to stop letting Shaq make him look like a sissy

10. Payton

11. K.Malone - Too old to be top 10

12. Stevie Franchise

13. Ray Allen

14. Carter - Overrated by most he is a solid star though

15. Finley - the most underrated star in the league

16. JT

17. Jordan - Probably wont be around next season

18. Wallace - Good player too emotional and childish for me

19. Reef - Needs to be more assertive

20. J. Oneal - this is a prediction for next year

21. Marbury - he is a good point he just needs another passer on court with him to be effective

22. Brand - Solid player

23. Stackhouse - giffted on offense maybe top 6 everything else in his game is weak

24. Dirk could go as high as #20

25. Baron Davis

26. A.Miller - Good on paper; still has to prove to me he is a top 10 player

27. the Matrix. Marion is going to light it up someday

28. Nick Van Exel.

29. Deke - say what you want he is the #2 center in the league

30. Ben Wallace

31. Richard Hamilton

32. Walker - will move up he is probably closer to 20

33. Reggie Miller - Old Man can still hoop.

34. Jamison

35. Grant Hill- used to be #1

36. McDyess - Should be higher

37. Nash

38. Mashburn - second tier star probably to high on the list.

39. Jalen Rose

40. Bonzi Wells

41. J.Tinsley - I dont care what anyone says this guy put up better numbers than A.Miller his rookie year. Will be Top 15 soon.

42. Big Dog - Lost respect after last season

43. Spree/Houston - fading skills would have been 17 or higher 2 years ago.

44. E.Jones - great seond option horrible 1st option.

45. Mobley - He and franchise are a decent one two punch in Houston

46. K MART

47. D.Miles - Based purely on what he will do nt what he has done

48. Pau Gasol - Eurotrash Player of the year. If he improves on last season he will move up

49. Mike Miller

50. Rashard Lewis

Close calls Tony Parker will make the list next season. Peja - sissyballer; Q. Richardson - will be on the list soon; Jay Williams - has to play an NBA game first; Battier - will be 50 at the end of next season; Jason " White Chocolate" Williams. Damon Stodamire; Stockton - I hate stockton but he did get #51;Penny - Needs to revive his career; Injured to often

Will be on the list someday Joe Forte; Richard Jefferson; Caron Butler; Curry and Chandler.

PS Sissy does not imply white so if you have any comments Walter keep them about basketball.

[capstone21]

That is interesting that you rated JT so high and so far above Baron and Dre Miller.

I think JT is a top 50 player but I would not rate him so high. Marbury is pretty high on your list too. My opinion of this guy is that he brings a team down with his play. He is not a team player by any means and it has hurt a lot of teams progress including NJ and the Suns.

I know you don't like them but you really don't think Peja or Vlade are not top 50 players? Also what about Lamar Odom I think this kid has all the skills to belong on the list too.

[Gambit99]

Grant Hill #35! He hasn't played in almost two years, yet Theo is not on the list, nor Morning(who played last year).

It's evident that your bias, because Gasol and Kmart should be ahead of Tinsely, Spree, Houston, Big Dog and Eddie Jones.

You may not like the Euro ballers, but thier here and producing, better than most of these guys coming out of college. They play text book ball like Tim Duncan, but...OOh he's an American...my bad.

Oh TMac should be ahead of KG...TMac makes his team better, KG doesn't.

Jordan, brings intangibles, but I'd take Dirk, Reef, Brand, Stackhouse, Miller, Nash and Davis before him.

Just my opinion.

[Diesel]

I'm not going through your list with a fine toothed comb becuase it's your list... Your opinion.

My question though is this:

Why do you rank Duncan so Low? He leads the NBA in damn near ever statistic. He's dominant from start to finish of every game he plays. What's the deal?

Secondly, Mash is not too high. If you look at his numbers and games, he should be higher?

[DJ_Money]

Mike Bibby.

Granted, he's not the Top 10 player that everyone wants to make him out to be after his playoff run. But, he's gotta be somewhere in the Top 50. I'd likely put him in the 25-35 range.

[BlackHawkDown]

Capstone21 Odom was left off by mistake.

DJ Money I thought about Bibby but I am just not a 100% sold on him yet. I do however thaink he is a solid PG.

Gambit 99 Biased How so?

Morning would have been top 20 2 years ago however he does have a terminal illness and his play has tappered off . Theo was barely top 50 before the injuries.

Outside of Kobe, who doesn't count, TParker,Gasol, Dirk and Peja I dont really see much talent. When you look at all the top players recent past and present you will notice 90 % are hard nosed ballers that developed fundamentals. Outside Bird their hasn't been a championship player that had a game of pure fundmental Nique Jordan TMac Shaq Kobe Magic, all where exceptional physically and atheletically. Saying Euro players are better because they play very technical ball is wrong

As for TMac KG it is debateable I could live with Either in the 2 slot but I think even though TMac is more explosive KG has a better all around game.

PS Tim Duncan isn't American he is Croixian, a Caribean colony which has been oppressed by the US and the Royal Dutch Sell company for too long.

[Hawksfreak]

Theo Ratliff!

[cyman3]

Yes i know about his health issues, but look at the numbers bro.

www.nba.com

He still has game.. more than MUTOMBO

[Guest]

Mourning is better than Mutombo.Mourning was underrated

badly before his injuries.Mourning is a player that had never

got the due he deserved.He brought attitude to the game

but wasn't a [censored] in doing it.It always felt like he was

gunna EXPLODE and rip peoples heads off.

Duncan is the 2nd best player in the league,Mash is too

low(I grew more respect for his game this past season)

Pau Gasol is too low..Marbury is too high because he

takes good teams and makes them bad.

[BlackHawkDown]

Two years ago I would have said Zo was 1st or 2nd best in the league but right now he is on the decline. Deke is about the same as he as always been. If their was an honorary list for players that have been great Zo would be at the top. Leaving him off the list wasn't a dis it was just a recognition that he isn't the playe he was a couple of years ago.

As for Marbury I dont blame him for the problems in NJ or Pho he was forced to be a leader in NJ for a team that wasnt as good then as it is now. Kidd deserves a lot of credit for the nets turnaround but many others are responsible.Marbury will start to shine in Phoniex in a couple of years.

Monster Mash lost my respect in Miami he just didnt assert himself and played sissyball for long stretches at Miami. Maybe it was the team, maybe it was him but who knows for sure.

[Guest]

I disagree about Marbury.The Suns are gunna be in the

sellar for a LONG TIME.

Spurs/Dallas/LA/Clippers/Wolves/Portland/Houston/Memphis/

Golden State/Seattle/Kings are all better than the Suns next

year.Plus Denver has a good rebulding project going.PHX is

going nowhere and nowhere fast.The Suns lack the talent

to make the playoffs in the west.They have trash for a

bench/they can't board(big no no in west) and really don't

have much of a head coach.

"Deke is about the same as he as always been."

I disagree,Dekes effectiveness is wearing off in Philly.Mutombo

wasn't very effective in the playoffs this season.The trade from

our team to Philly gave him a boost for the playoffs.But he wasn't

much for Philly this season.

"Monster Mash lost my respect in Miami he just didnt assert himself

and played sissyball for long stretches at Miami. Maybe it was the

team, maybe it was him but who knows for sure."

That was due to Pat...the same thing is happening to Eddie Jones.

[BlackHawkDown]

I dont really disagree very much Pat Riley is an idiot, not on par with George Karl, Lon Kruger or Larry Brown those 3 are absolute knit-wits , Good ol Pat could be the reason for the decline of Mash and E.Jones.

Deke even on the decline is top 50. But when you look at it there are only 3 centers worth $2 in the league Deke Zo Shaq

Next gen Curry Chandler Marcus West Kentucky. Diop

Pho has Matrix and Marbury I dont think they will be cellar dwellers if they were in the east they would win 50.

[Guest]

Pho has Matrix and Marbury I dont think they will be cellar dwellers if

they were in the east they would win 50."

Those teams I listed are better this year and have been

futures than the Suns have.It realyl doesn't matter what

would happen if they were in the east because they aren't i

n the east.

But I agree about Pat.I really like him,but his habbits will never allow

him to coach a team that will make it to the next level again.His habbits

limited Miami and all the rest of his teams will do the same.

Marcus West??Don't think I know him.

[Gambit99]

I forgot Tim Duncan is an "Island Boy"...I'm not saying that Euro players are better than American players. I honestly believe that you must look at each player individually.

That being said, I read this board a couple times a day since the days of the AA board. Although I've only seen you on this board, you seem to dislike Euro player on all accounts. If a thread contains talk about them, you almost never have anything good to say about them. That's what I mean by you being biased. You have to admit that Paul, Dirk, Peja and Vlade are some of the best in the league.

And if you're wondering I'm an American, but I did live in Europe for a number of years. Maybe I'm biased also.

[cyman3]

"Two years ago I would have said Zo was 1st or 2nd best in the league but right now he is on the decline. Deke is about the same as he as always been."

Mutombo- 36.3 mpg, .501%, .764 FT%, 10.80 rpg, 1.0 apg, .36 spg, 2.38 bpg, 11.5 ppg

Mourning- 32.7 mpg, .516%, .657 FT%, 8.40 rpg, 1.2 apg, .36 spg, 2.48 bpg, 15.7 ppg

Other than FREETHROWS and REBOUNDING, Mourning is better. Hes more of a scoring threat and a defensive threat right now.

Mutombo has game and still is the leagues best center. I just dont know if hes the 2nd best, cuz this year his numbers dropped BIG TIME. Hes starting to go to the stage of ROBINSON, OLAJUWAN, and EWING (where they get old and fade away- at least numbers wise)/

[BlackHawkDown]

Your right Morning is better on paper but Deke brings some intangables that Zo doesn't since his illness. Plus Zo will always outscore Deke because he is never higher than a 3rd option.

Gambit 99 I lived in Europe for a few month I think that is when I became annoyed with the Euroleague.

PS Why would anyone rank Vlade Top 50 he is a hack I would rate him 89 - 100 at best.

[Guest]

Mourning is better on the court aswell...He actually has post

moves and he can shoot the jumper...All Deke does is get

striped in the lane after taking 10 minutes to get in position

for a shot.When Deke gets the ball in the post he looks like

a 80 year old man.Just take a time out while I get into

offensive position!

Deke is so slow it takes him two hours to watch 60 minutes.

Plsu Mourning didn't get caught at a strip club cheating on

his wife like Cookie Monster Deke did..

[BlackHawkDown]

Actually I have to tell you I met Deke at a club in Toronto last year and week later saw him at the club in LA. I have to give him credit he was pulling a lot of broads. Whether or not he slept with them I dont know. But Deke is an honorable Christian family man who has made some mistakes but has done a lot of good things in Zaire (Democratic Republic of Congo) as well as in Atlanta I still respect him as a person not just a baller. Same for Zo.

[Guest]

Fair enough....

but it isn't hard for a NBA to get good looking women.Believe

it or not even Bill Walton has a pretty good looking wife.Even

that 70's hippy mother has a decent looking women.

Which makes you wonder...How did Iverson end up with that

women???yuck!

[BlackHawkDown]

AI's wife isnt that bad she isnt exactly the finest woman I've ever seen.

Please tell me your joking Bill Walton is such a loser how could he pull a chick.