The near ideal trade for Atlanta using the 3rd pk

[Guest Walter]

First, given our contract signing restrictions not allowing us to sign or trade for a player with > 4 years on his contract without unanimous approval from the owners, we cannot expect to trade away a player for cap space (i.e. Speedy) AND sign a max FA. No max FA of worth will sign for 4 years or less. PERIOD. Thus, with the 3rd overall pick we should look to either draft a player, draft a player and trade, or trade the pick.

I suggest the following listed as trade scenario # 3807190 at realgm.com

1) Hawks trade the #3 pick, Marvin Williams, and Speedy Claxton, all to Minnesota and get Bynum, Foye, Radman, and Cook.

2) The Lakers trade Lamar Odom to Minnesota and Bynum, Radman, and Cook to Atlanta and get Garnett.

3) Minnesota trades Kevin Garnett to LA and Foye to Atlanta and get the #3 pick, Marvin Williams, Odom, and Speedy Claxton. Obviously, they rebuild with the 3rd and 5th picks this year, MW, and Odom.

This deal could easily be tweaked to send Lue to LA. Possibly SW and JC instead of MW if that's what it takes to make the deal work.

Anyhow, the lineup would be

Bynum/ZaZa

JS/SW/Cook

JC/Radman

JJ

Foye/Lue or AJ

We draft whomever with the 11th pick.

Basically, I think a 3rd pick is to Minny's liking if they decide to trade Garnett and rebuild. LA want's Garnett. Bynum and Foye fill our two needs perfectly and very well respectively. We have a high pick to spare.

W

[ncthompson11]

i think you should of put rashad mccants in there somewhere. as dominant as he was in college it seems crazy he hasnt been given much of a chance to show his stuff. his career high is 28 and guess who that was against? thats right the hawks.

[BusBoyIsBack]

I love Marvin but I'd make that trade in a second.

We could replace Marvin with best available swingman with the 11th pick whether if it's Brewer or Batum.

I think Bynum could be something special.

This idea seriously needs to be submitted to BK.

[txsting]

That's one of the best complex trades I've seen on here. It's equitable for all parties, seemingly. Minnesota may like a little more back for Garnett and Foye, but someone could throw in a highly protected pick or 2nd rounder perhaps.

Couple q's:

1) is Bynum > Hibbert? Hibbert is the likely alternative if keeping the 3rd pick.

2) could Marvin + Speedy (or Marvin + whatever) bring back a better guard on the open market?

3) is Foye better than the top PG available at 11?

[bfwolf]

Minnesota will want more for Garnett and Foye.

[Packfill]

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Minnesota will want more for Garnett and Foye.

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Agreed. Plus, if they are going to rebuild then they are definitely going to package some of their other bad contracts with Garnett.

[Diesel]

Minnesota's not giving up Foye.

They finally got it right (even though they gave up Roy to get him???) so it's not likely that they trade him for anything.

[CBAreject]

I think Minn doesn't want to move Foye, as he's perceived as a major piece in the rebuilding effort. I think they can do very well for Garnett while moving contracts without giving up Foye.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

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First, given our contract signing restrictions not allowing us to sign or trade for a player with > 4 years on his contract without unanimous approval from the owners, we cannot expect to trade away a player for cap space (i.e. Speedy) AND sign a max FA. No max FA of worth will sign for 4 years or less. PERIOD. Thus, with the 3rd overall pick we should look to either draft a player, draft a player and trade, or trade the pick.

I suggest the following listed as trade scenario # 3807190 at realgm.com

1) Hawks trade the #3 pick, Marvin Williams, and Speedy Claxton, all to Minnesota and get Bynum, Foye, Radman, and Cook.

2) The Lakers trade Lamar Odom to Minnesota and Bynum, Radman, and Cook to Atlanta and get Garnett.

3) Minnesota trades Kevin Garnett to LA and Foye to Atlanta and get the #3 pick, Marvin Williams, Odom, and Speedy Claxton. Obviously, they rebuild with the 3rd and 5th picks this year, MW, and Odom.

This deal could easily be tweaked to send Lue to LA. Possibly SW and JC instead of MW if that's what it takes to make the deal work.

Anyhow, the lineup would be

Bynum/ZaZa

JS/SW/Cook

JC/Radman

JJ

Foye/Lue or AJ

We draft whomever with the 11th pick.

Basically, I think a 3rd pick is to Minny's liking if they decide to trade Garnett and rebuild. LA want's Garnett. Bynum and Foye fill our two needs perfectly and very well respectively. We have a high pick to spare.

W

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Decent trade.

And one thing about Foye. Foye CAN play the point, but that isn't his ideal position. So we're running the risk of putting a "young" JT-like player at the point, hoping he can develop into an efficient one. He's a scoring PG, not a playmaking one.

Right now, he's just decent at that position, with decision making being his biggest problem while playing PG. He's had his biggest games in Minny, when he's able to be the main option with the reserves, or when KG tosses the ball out to him for open jumpers. What Randy can do, is defend PGs. And that would definitely be a benefit for the Hawks.

It's funny though. You're completely against Law, compared to the other 2 PGs, but Foye and Law are pretty comparable players, when it comes to offensive play. The exception being that Law is a truer PG than Foye, and a far better playmaker. Foye is the better defender though.

But I think you're making this way too complicated to get Bynum here. I wouldn't even make Minny part of the deal.

( Note: As bad as BK is villified on this board, he'd be dealing with arguably two GMs who have done a worse job than him . . McHale and Kupchak. So any deal involving the three of them would be "interesting" to say the least. )

Here's what I would do, to try to pry Bynum away from them. I could only do this if Corey Brewer keeps rising on the draft board.

Atlanta trades: Marvin + #3 pick to Lakers

LA Lakers trade: Bynum + Maurice Evans + 1st round 2008

If Kobe is definitely in a "win now" mode, they need to start acquiring people that can help them "win now" . . right now.

If you add Minny into a deal, they're more than likely will want Bynum, because everyone already knows what Odom will bring to the table. Bynum has "upside" that the Lakers can sell teams on, in which that team can sell to their fan bases who need a center ( like us ). Odom doesn't. You already know what you'll get with Odom. That's the main reason why you keep Minny out of the deal.

But this is what you sell the Lakers on. If they take Marvin and the #3 pick, they'll have their choice on how their roster can look for the 2008 season.

Frist option:

You can go extremely athletic, and take Brewer with the #3 pick.

( Note: the triangle offense doesn't require you to have a playmaking PG . . just one who can guard the other teams PG, and one that can knock down open shots. If push came to shove, Kobe or Brewer have the ability to bring the ball up the court and guard both guard positions. )

Lineup:

G - Kobe

G - Brewer

F - Marvin

F - Odom

C - Brown

2nd option:

You can address the center you just lost, and take Hibbert to take his place.

G - Farmar

G - Kobe

F - Marvin

F - Odom

C - Hibbert

3rd option:

If you want to keep Odom in the starting lineup, and bring Marvin off the bench as a hired gun, take Brandan Wright.

G - Farmar

G - Kobe

F - Odom

F - Wright

C - Brown

Marvin ( 6th man )

** And there's a reason why I would ask for the Lakers 2008 pick, instead of their #19 pick this year. You would do that in order to essentially give the Lakers three 1st round picks this year. The Lakers have to be sold on the fact that Marvin + the #3 pick, could give them enough athletic talent to get them past a team like Phoenix, and give Kobe the adequate help that he needs. That may be enough for them to let go of Bynum.

And you would do it in order for the Hawks to have a 2008 draft pick in the 1st round. ( A pick that we would lose, if we got the #3 pick this year ). Even if it's a pick in the 20s, it's still a 1st round pick.

And here's what some of you Hawks fans would HATE. I would sell them on the fact that they ( the Lakers ) could also acquire a young PG waiting for them at the #19 spot. Guess who it would be?

Now . . let's go back and redo those lineups, with the Lakers getting that young PG at the #19 spot.

Brewer scenario:

G - Crittenton

G - Kobe

F - Brewer ( or Marvin )

F - Odom

C - Brown

Hibbert scenario:

G - Crittenton

G - Kobe

F - Brewer ( or Marvin )

F - Odom

C - Hibbert

Wright scenario:

G - Crittenton

G - Kobe

F - Odom

F - Wright

C - Brown

Marvin or Brewer ( 6th man )

For the Hawks, we'd basically sell "less" our soul to get Bynum, and PRAY TO GOD that he pans out immeadiately. Evans is just a filler to make the numbers work, with his contract expiring after the 2008 season. And the 1st round pick would at least give the Hawks a pick to work with in the 2008 draft. But we'd be basically selling our soul, just to get a center.

Hawks lineup.

G - Speedy ( or Law )

G - JJ

F - Childress

F - Smoove

C - Bynum

Bench:

G - Law . . Lue . . Salim . . AJ ( or Speedy, if not the starter )

F - Evans, Solomon, Shelden

C - ZaZa, Wright

We would've addressed both the needs at PG and at C with this, but in turn, possibly given the Lakers two potential All-Star players ( Marvin and Brewer ), with the remote opportunity of them drafting a 3rd guy who might develop into a star in Crittenton. We'd still have our expiring contracts to work with ( Lue, AJ, Wright ), to possibly make another move with to get a veteran player here. And we'd be assured to have a 1st round draft pick in 2008.

This means that Bynum BETTER be as good as people think he can be, and not just a "run of the mill" center.

Personally, I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't do it because I would rather trade Marvin for a more established player ( lol . . like a Lamar Odom or a Zach Randolph ). And this Hawks lineup would be interesting as well . . if we wanted to run, and go extremely athletic.

G - Speedy

G - JJ

F - Brewer

F - Marvin

F - Smoove

But if this team ( and the fan base ) really wants a center that bad, the best way to go about it is to sell the Lakers on the fact that they could essentially acquire the #2 pick in the 2005 draft and the #3 pick in this year's draft, to significantly upgrade their team.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

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Wright scenario:

G - Crittenton

G - Kobe

F - Odom

F - Wright

C - Brown

Marvin or Brewer ( 6th man )

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Forget Brewer being the 6th man. He's not on the team if the Lakers take Wright. So Marvin would be the 6th man.

[jezmund]

This works cap wise:

Atlanta

trades: Marvin Williams, Zaza Pachulia and Tyronn Lue

receives: Andrew Bynum and Kwame Brown

Lakers

trade: Lamar Odom, Andrew Bynum and Kwame Brown

receive: Kevin Garnett and Tyronn Lue

Minnesota

trades: Kevin Garnett

receives: Marvin Williams, Lamar Odom and Zaza Pachulia

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Obviously this might not be 100% fair for everone and I don't really know what these teams are looking for but it is a good base to work from without adding 10+ players. I don't care to add contracts like Radmonovic, etc. This way Minnesota shores up its frontcourt with young players. They are rebuilding now if they were to move KG. Lakers go win-now with KG and Lue. Lue isn't a huge addition by any means but he is a veteran PG who knows Phil Jackson. From the Atlanta side, I guess I could see us adding more to the pot to even value but I'm not sure what kind of value Marvin and Zaza have around the league. Also, the Lakers would have to have a contingency for getting a Center. Kwame's deal is expiring and I assumed he doesn't have much value around the league.

[KB21]

When did Andrew Bynum become such a great player that it would cost the Hawks Marvin Williams, a far better player, AND the #3 pick in the draft to get him?

[TexasPete]

McCants is coming off major knee surgery...microfracture surgery. That is a major deal and the T-Wolves will have keep him because he is now unproven with the knee.

[Packfill]

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When did Andrew Bynum become such a great player that it would cost the Hawks Marvin Williams, a far better player, AND the #3 pick in the draft to get him?

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Bynum needs alot of work, but I would trade Marvin for Bynum in a nanosecond. So far both have done nothing in their pro careers but Bynum has the higher ceiling since he is an athletic big who is so very young.

[Johnnybravo4]

So is Saer Sene and Patrick O'Stiff. And Channing Fries. The league is full of athletic bigs.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

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When did Andrew Bynum become such a great player that it would cost the Hawks Marvin Williams, a far better player, AND the #3 pick in the draft to get him?

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KB . . I agree with you. That's why I wouldn't do the deal.

But if the Hawks were that desperate to get a center, that's probably what it would take to get one here, if they felt that Hibbert at #3 isn't as good of an option as Bynum.

From our perspective, it'll basically be us giving up the #3 for Bynum . . and giving up Marvin in order to clear some room for Chill, Smoove, and Shelden to get 30+ minutes a game, even if all are healthy.

If this team is so unbalanced, a move like that will instantly balance out the team. It's a gamble that I'm not willing to take, because I'm not convinced at all that Bynum can even be better than Eddy Curry, let alone be a dominant center. But I could see why the Hawks would do it.

PG - Speedy . . Law . . Lue/AJ ( until traded or contracts expire )

G - JJ . . Salim

F - Chill

F - Smoove . . Shelden . . Solomon

C - Bynum . . ZaZa . . Wright

Chill is solid, and we know what we get from him. His upside isn't nearly as great as Marvin's though. Right now, Chill is the better player until Marvin becomes a more consistent player.

Smoove is still growing and has a chance to be an all-star caliber player at the 3/4 combo spot. It's also has been cited many times on this board that Shelden produces when he actually gets major minutes. Moving Marvin may free him up as a guy who can get major minutes at the 4 and the 5, while not compromising the floor time of Smoove, who could easily move to the 3 in a Smoove - Shelden - Bynum frontcourt.

I wouldn't make the trade, because I don't believe in trading young talent with potential, for more young talent with potential ( especially when the talent we're trading for is younger than what we already have ).

I'm all for a Marvin/Chill/or Smoove trade, if it will bring us an established veteran player who we know that can play.

But I definitely see why the Hawks would do it. And it would only be a bad move if Bynum turned out to be a complete bust or didn't develop past the level of a Mark Blount ( who isn't bad, but nowhere near great ).

[Packfill]

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So is Saer Sene and Patrick O'Stiff. And Channing Fries. The league is full of athletic bigs.

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Don't be ignorant.

There are projects and then there are "projects." Sene and O'Bryant are years away from contributing. Bynum has already contributed at least a little. Plus, he is about the youngest guy in the league.

And it's not like Marvin has done anything either. Marvin is a project too, but he is a project at a position the Hawks already have some depth at.

[gsuteke]

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When did Andrew Bynum become such a great player that it would cost the Hawks Marvin Williams, a far better player, AND the #3 pick in the draft to get him?

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that's what I was thinking minus the Pachulia part. that dude has potential written all over him more than Marvin for Christ's sake!

let's think about this. Is Andrew Bynum that much better than Hibbert to the point of adding in your #2 from 2 years ago?

I mean you've already invested the capitol in the form of time in Marvin Williams. he hasn't exactly looked terrible while on the floor.

This thread to me reads like a bunch of Laker fans talking back and forth, atleast when you consider the pedestal that Bynum is being put on here.

[Johnnybravo4]

A problem we would have if we traded Marvin is that we would instantly become weak in a position where we had youth and depth. We would have to either move Smoove back to SF or find a midlevel player to play behind Chills.

[Packfill]

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A problem we would have if we traded Marvin is that we would instantly become weak in a position where we had youth and depth. We would have to either move Smoove back to SF or find a midlevel player to play behind Chills.

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What are you talking about. Chill and Smoove could rotate at small forward, with Smith playing additional minutes at power forward. Back-up power forward is ostensibly not a problem since the Hawks spent another high lottery pick on some dude named Sheldon Williams. Solomon could then get some minutes as well.

That is a heck of a lot more talent and depth then the Hawks currently have at center.