Who here has expectations for Marvin?

[Diesel]

First for a reference...

Read this.

It's been three years now. We're coming up on an RFA year. A decision on Marvin will have to be made after this year. I want to know if you have an expectation for Marvin Williams going into the future. IF so, could you share it?

My take doesn't have to change from before...

Quote:

---

Marvin is the highest pick we have ever had.

Marvin is the culmination of several years of tanking in the draft and getting rid of so-called good players.

Marvin was drafted ahead of Paul, Deron.

Marvin was drafted in spite of a logjam at the SF/PF position.

THEREFORE...

I have real expectations...

Now... Lascar, you may not. You may be the type of guy who likes to pull a Scooby Doo and Check things out... Put your money into investments and NOT expect anything back... Maybe you're just a good samaritan like that...

However, I think that for everything the Hawks have given up to get Marvin, he must meet some type of expectation... Not a fantasy expectation, but a real one...

You don't have one... then say so.

If you don't mind the Hawks just Neandering around from year to year eating mayonaise sandwhiches then Say so...

But I think that there are some fans like me who have heard Babcock say " in 4 yrs", waited, only to see him blow up the team and grab JJ, JR, JT, and Glover. Unlike you, we don't blindly follow anymore and praise for no reason.

I praise BK for drafting Josh & Josh.

I question him for passing on Josh Howard and taking Diaw.

I praise BK for trading Big Dog, REEF, THEO, and JT.

I question him for trading away Nazr.

When you get to where I am, there's not enough love to blindly follow.

[thescout5]

Diesel you bring up a controversial subject in Marvin. We have the doubters like myself and the advocates for Marvin. What I want to see from Marvin next year are:

1.Increased scoring

2.Many more go to moves including a more consistent long range jumper

3.Scoring in crucial minutes not garbage minutes

4.Being a difference maker much more consistently

5.Learning to dribble instead of being uncoordinated letting the ball bounce off his foot creating turnovers.

It's time Marvin steps up and becomes the no2 pick he is supposed to be.He won't be Paul or Deron Williams but in his own way be a difference maker. Now if we don't see much improvement from last year then I would trade him. I know there have been posts on his work ethic but I have serious doubts how good Marvin really wants to be. The greats will be out on the court day and night trying to get better putting in the hard work. Marvin was taking classes at UNC last year. Now I have nothing against bettering yourself intellectually but basketball is Marvin's livelyhood and he has alot riding on his development.

This will be a make or break year for Marvin other teams are going to be watching his development also.If he does well they may offer him a huge contract if he doesn't then he'll probably get less. The project called Marvin needs to show some big benefits for this team if it wants to get to the next level otherwise were wasting our time with an overrated player that will never become the star we all hoped when drafting him no2.

[DawsonsCreek]

If you are drafted that high, you cant not have high expectations. Will he cash in on those expectations? I dont know. This year is going to tell alot and to tell you the truth I dont know which way its gonna go. He puts up an decent stat line but his game still leaves alot to be desired for someone who was picked so high. To me, hes the biggest question mark on this team that matters (sorry speedy).

I browsed the list of FAs next year and I dont see many good 5's that will be available (no surprise there, quality bigs are at a premium and we sure as heck cant compete salary wise with other teams for the top tier guys). If Marvin can fetch us someone thats on the up and up like Bierdens.... would u do that via SNT if the numbers matched up?

[DrReality]

D

Are you OCD, obsessive compulsive disorder? Man you just can't let this Marvin thing go. There are meds for it.

[Guest Walter]

Here's why I think that.

Not one mention of resigning MW. Yes, they are focused upon the Joshes but not even a peep about an offer to MW (unlike JS). I do not expect MW to be extended an offer but I-F MW is extended an offer at this time, it will be LOW.

W

[Teeareess]

Quote:

---

Here's why I think that.

Not one mention of resigning MW. Yes, they are focused upon the Joshes but not even a peep about an offer to MW (unlike JS). I do not expect MW to be extended an offer but I-F MW is extended an offer at this time, it will be LOW.

W

that's probably part low expectations, part short-sighted/cheapness.

[Diesel]

Quote:

---

D

Are you OCD, obsessive compulsive disorder? Man you just can't let this Marvin thing go. There are meds for it.

This is a Hawks discussion board right? I think one of the biggest things to come (now that Bogut has been signed) is what do we do with Marvin? Well, to even begin to answer that question, we must first ask what are your expectations?

So for the record DrReality.... Aside from your continuous critique of me... What are YOUR expectations for Marvin?

My bet is that all of you who defend Marvin constantly are too afraid to put an expectation of him down for the record...

In your heart, you know if you put down one, it will either be something that a nondrafted rookie could do OR Marvin will fail terribly at reaching it. So I can understand why you feel threatened by the question. IN fact, I'm almost sure that I won't see expectations from Yourself, Northcyde, MrHonline, Chris18, Traceman, or any of the MPF (Marvin Protection Force).

So DrReality, now you know the relevance of the question...

Personal Challenge....

Do you have some expectations?

[Swatguy]

Quote:

---

Here's why I think that.

Not one mention of resigning MW. Yes, they are focused upon the Joshes but not even a peep about an offer to MW (unlike JS). I do not expect MW to be extended an offer but I-F MW is extended an offer at this time, it will be LOW.

W

A VP has said privately that they (the Adminstration) are disappointed in Marvin and Law. Initial examinations (as they may) are in, particularly for Law. However, Marvin has been (of course) in the fold for three years. His (Marvin) disappointment is greater.

I expect him to be moved.

But I would have allowed Shelden more time too.

I'm not the GM.

[pound4pound]

Marvin Williams is a servicable Small Forward and probably in the top 40-50 3's in the leauge. I think if you give any top 40 small forward in the nba 34 minutes a game - they will average 15 points - and probably more. He is roughly the equivilant to Correy Magette and should get MLE type of money.

What he should be is someone who could put his back to the basket and tower over smaller 3's, extend that great shooting stroke from behind the arch, look to take his man off the dribble not only in the 1st quarter but the 4th, and use some semblence of body control to not hurt himself.

Maybe he will become that guy - but he isn't that guy now and shouldn't get paid like one.

[Swatguy]

Quote:

---

Marvin Williams is a servicable Small Forward and probably in the top 40-50 3's in the leauge. I think if you give any top 40 small forward in the nba 34 minutes a game - they will average 15 points - and probably more. He is roughly the equivilant to Correy Magette and should get MLE type of money.

What he should be is someone who could put his back to the basket and tower over smaller 3's, extend that great shooting stroke from behind the arch, look to take his man off the dribble not only in the 1st quarter but the 4th, and use some semblence of body control to not hurt himself.

Maybe he will become that guy - but he isn't that guy now and shouldn't get paid like one.

Hilarious. You opin Marvin is in the "top 40-50 3's in the leauge" and say "He is roughly the equivilant to Correy Magette".

ARE YOU MAD ? Marvin cannot lace Maggette's sneakers. Maggette just signed for 5 and 50 mil. You think Marvin is worth that?

[Teeareess]

Quote:

---

Maggette just signed for 5 and 50 mil. You think Marvin is worth that?

Maggette's not worth that either.

[Diesel]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Maggette just signed for 5 and 50 mil. You think Marvin is worth that?

Maggette's not worth that either.

I think there are 2 truths here.

Maggette is not worth 10 Million per... But at the same time, Maggette is much better than Marvin. Maggette is a powerful guy because he can score at will. He's not a shooter, but he goes to the rim. When I think Sf, he's a certain kind that can help a team tremendously. Maggette has much more confidence in his game than Marvin does.

[exodus]

Quote:

---

My bet is that all of you who defend Marvin constantly are too afraid to put an expectation of him down for the record...

I can't speak for everyone but i made my expectations of Marvin pretty clear before this past season. i wanted to see him average 15-16 ppg shooting 47-48%. he came up a bit short of that after a hot start.

Long term i said i hoped he could be as productive as Deng. I don't see him being an All-Star candidate at all down the road.

This coming season i want to see one thing from him. I want to see him shooting 3s. Long term i think he needs to be a 3 pt threat to be a better than average 3.

[Swish]

I think Marvin could actually be a nice piece somewhere- albeit I really don't think he fits here.

A lot of teams would take a young, 15ppg, high % shooting SF. I agree with Ex. though- I don't think he will ever be an All-Star-it just isn't there.

I wish Marv the best but I hope we can turn him into a Center, packaged with Bibby.

[jhay610]

Quote:

---

MPF (Marvin Protection Force)

LOL. Do we get badges and a certificate for membership? I might join...

[Chris18]

Here are my expectations for Marvin next season

1) Score 16-17 points a night while shooting 47-48%

2) Take that jump hook he was using at the end of the year more

3) Improve on defense and boxing out

[AnakinJoe]

Quote:

---

Here are my expectations for Marvin next season

1) Score 16-17 points a night while shooting 47-48%

2) Take that jump hook he was using at the end of the year more

3) Improve on defense and boxing out

I don't think so. Let's face it, we're not going to have 4 16+ points/game players, Bibby, JJ Marvin and Smith. Someone has to give up shot opportunities and focus on helping the team in other ways. Not to mention, that I think most would hope Horford would get a few more offensive touches in the post. Anyone thinking that our strating 5 will all score 15 or more is being silly. Marvin is clearly a guy who is comfortable deferring, so I expect him to do that next season. I say Marvin will become more of a defensive presence while scoring closer to 14 points with 6 boards. And of course, he will be blistered on this board by guys who expect that we will in fact have 4 guys averaging 16+ points in the starting line-up while thinking that Horford should be right around 14-15 points per game.

[ATLBob]

Extend range to behind three-point line.

Improve man defense.

Finish more fluidly in the lane, look to attack.

Continue to get to the line at a higher rate than any other Hawk.

Score 15 ppg. (I actually think he could avg. more if the offense ran through him more often and the game-plan focused on establishing his offense early).

Rebound at a higher rate (6 rpg).

By age 25 Marvin will be a better all-around player than Maggette and G. Wallace are now.

Hell, I'm willing to say that Marvin, at 22, is already one of the top 15 SFs in the league.

Some of y'all may want to take another look at some other SF stats, especially at age 22, and take another look in the mirror.

No sense in punking yourself just because Diesel is awfully loud.

Hollering doesn't make you observant, or analytical.

And yes, I am implying that those of you on the ship Marvin out-of-town train are seriously analytically-challenged.

Would I trade him for the right pieces? Obv.

Would I prefer to lock him up long-term right now? You bet your sweet _______

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

My bet is that all of you who defend Marvin constantly are too afraid to put an expectation of him down for the record...

I can't speak for everyone but i made my expectations of Marvin pretty clear before this past season. i wanted to see him average 15-16 ppg shooting 47-48%. he came up a bit short of that after a hot start.

Long term i said i hoped he could be as productive as Deng. I don't see him being an All-Star candidate at all down the road.

This coming season i want to see one thing from him. I want to see him shooting 3s. Long term i think he needs to be a 3 pt threat to be a better than average 3.

And I did the same thing last summer. In fact, I did it for all the Hawks. I think I said 16/17 pts - 6 rebs - on 48% shooting for Marvin.

I would like him to develop the 3-ball, but not if it is going to hurt his overall efficiency as a shooter. The tendency for guys who try to shoot 3s, is that they'll fall in love with that shot, instead of taking better shots ( Salim was notorious for this, and Smith too after he hit his first 3 ).

So instead, I'd love for Marvin to develop the pull-up jumper off the dribble, shoot right over people, and become a better finisher around the rim. To me, it's all about him being as efficient as possible. I don't want him jacking up 3s, if he's only going to shoot it at a clip under 30%.

The starting 5 of this team is very balanced now, with Bibby in the mix. We could very well resemble the Pistons of a few years ago, where all the starters averaged 14 - 20 ppg.

[Diesel]

Quote:

---

I say Marvin will become more of a

defensive presence

while scoring closer to 14 points with 6 boards.

AnakinJoe, could you be more specfic about exactly what a defensive presence is? Hell, I can put a chair in front of the goal and it would be a defensive presence. Sheez, I think we can loosely define Paul Davis as a defensive presence. Could you give a little detail please?