Your Opinion?

[Plainview1981]

Ownership, if they really wanted to make a run at a title, or at the very least generating revenue, could've made a tremendous splash in the offseason. It would've taken a financial commitment from them. Just remember folks, this is what the front office passed on:

- hiring Avery Johnson as coach

- using the #31 pick on a young big man

- finding a way to re-sign Josh Childress, or at least get a player for him

- trading someone on this team, or using the full MLE to acquire Shaq

Had ownership just done 2 of these 4 things ( especially if they would've hire Avery as coach and acquired Shaq ), fan apathy would be minimal and the buzz around the Hawks would've definitely be at a high level. And that's including what we kind of see in Jordan Crawford.

Instead, this is what the Hawks did:

- hired Larry Drew as coach

- traded the #31 for 3 million

- traded Childress for a 3+ million trade exception

- re-signed Jason Collins

- signed Josh Powell

- signed Etan Thomas

When you look at those moves, compared to what we could have realistically done, you see why people are upset and even expect less out of this Hawks team.

Contrary to popular belief amongst Hawks fans, it was the defense that was the main problem last year, not the offense. Even in those games in which we couldn't score in the 4th quarter, those games were also times in which our defense broke down the most.

If the Hawks are up 11 points in the 4th, they should still be able to win a game, even if they only score 15 points. But what would happen, is that we couldn't stop the other team ( usually the other team's PG ), and we'd lose by 6, because we'd given up 32 points in the final quarter.

Tonight's game vs Orlando, has to be a little more than a "it's just preseason" game. Orlando has been steamrolling people this preseason, basically playing their main 9 to 10 man rotation. This is the Hawks first dress rehearsal against the team that has dominated them for the past 2 seasons.

Can they prove to the fans, and most importantly, to themselves, that they can compete against this team?

We all know what happened last preseason . . . the completely embarassed us on national TV. Let's see what happens tonight. Injuries or no injuries, I want to see this team at least compete tonight . . both starters and the bench.

Same s***, different day. The Hawks MANHOOD should be questioned.

They play ball like girls. Tonight was just more proof that they will not amount to anything of importance. And no, getting KILLED in the 2nd round is nothing doing something of importance.

[Chickenstanley]

Very good points Northcyde! I would have been in favor of every one of them. And like you say, none would have been expensive, but would have sent a message to potential fans that they were making an "attempt" to build a quality product. This could easily have led to increased ticket sales and cable TV viewership ---which would eventually lead to having more money to spend.

I also agree that this was not "just another pre-season game" for the Hawks. Every player I remember being quoted during the offseason seemed to mentioned how badly the team wanted to avenge their embarrassing performance(s) against Orlando.

CS

[Swatguy]

this is what the front office passed on:

- hiring Avery Johnson as coach

- using the #31 pick on a young big man

- finding a way to re-sign Josh Childress, or at least get a player for him

- trading someone on this team, or using the full MLE to acquire Shaq

Yes and amazingly most of this board was against signing Chillz and Shaq. Ownership is the culprit and many here enable them. It dawns on me, it wasn't a problem with Chillz and Sund as thought, it was the pride of ownership, Shaq debacle too.

Well pride cometh before the fall.

Edited October 19, 2010 by Swatguy

[spotatl]

And like you say, none would have been expensive,

Thats ridiculous. Bringing in Shaq would have cost around 12 million dollars for just this season once you factor in the luxury tax. If the Hawks also paid Childress what he got from the suns then the hawks would have paid 25 million just this season for the 2 of them.

I don't blame the ownership for not wanting to pay the luxury tax for the third best team in the division.

Edited October 19, 2010 by spotatl

[Gray Mule]

Hotlanta1981: I agree and disagree. Same old s***, different day. Yes. Played like girls. Now, you're

insulting the Atlanta Dream. These gals played last season like eastern conference champions. Don't

think these Hawks came anywhere close to that.

Hawks are still unhealthy. Point Guard is still a huge problem. And, last year's rookie has missed

so much valueable time this pre-season. Bibby is still Bibby and he hasn't shown any signs of having

a hot hand in any game yet. Stay tuned. He's capable of that.

JJ has a huge new contract, soaking up a lot of the alloted payroll. He's being paid super star money.

He's good. He's very good. Yet, he's not the super star that he's being paid to be. Will this change

once the season begins?

First round draft pick. Better than we could hope for. Second round pick - - Still out injured and a big

question mark. Could be the steal of the draft and could be a complete bust. Another wait and see.

We all knew that, with a new head coach and new assistant coaches, it was a wait and see how

things worked out for the Hawks. With all the injuries and missed time, we're still wondering, You

can't expect to win games with a bunch of players out.

Our 6th man of the year last season - Injured, for the most of pre season. Our point guard, out

with injury. Our starting center. Injured and missing a lot of time, even when he plays some. Our

second round pick, hasn't been in any pre season games because of injury. And, the list goes on

and on.

Hawks have won one pre season game and that against a second rate team, expected to again

miss the playoffs. Most of us haven't had the opportunity to watch any of these games - We read

about them, check the box score and come away with a bitter sweet taste about everything.

Lets get healthy - Hopefully. Let's give our new coach and his staff time. They will change things

for the better - Hopefully. Before pre season, we, or at least most of us, thought things would start

off slow with everything being new, different. And, it has. We believed things would improve as

we advanced into the regular season - Hopefully.

Things look bad right now. Give it time. It will get better. Hopefully!

:angel19:

[Plainview1981]

Hotlanta1981: I agree and disagree. Same old s***, different day. Yes. Played like girls. Now, you're

insulting the Atlanta Dream. These gals played last season like eastern conference champions. Don't

think these Hawks came anywhere close to that.

Hawks are still unhealthy. Point Guard is still a huge problem. And, last year's rookie has missed

so much valueable time this pre-season. Bibby is still Bibby and he hasn't shown any signs of having

a hot hand in any game yet. Stay tuned. He's capable of that.

JJ has a huge new contract, soaking up a lot of the alloted payroll. He's being paid super star money.

He's good. He's very good. Yet, he's not the super star that he's being paid to be. Will this change

once the season begins?

First round draft pick. Better than we could hope for. Second round pick - - Still out injured and a big

question mark. Could be the steal of the draft and could be a complete bust. Another wait and see.

We all knew that, with a new head coach and new assistant coaches, it was a wait and see how

things worked out for the Hawks. With all the injuries and missed time, we're still wondering, You

can't expect to win games with a bunch of players out.

Our 6th man of the year last season - Injured, for the most of pre season. Our point guard, out

with injury. Our starting center. Injured and missing a lot of time, even when he plays some. Our

second round pick, hasn't been in any pre season games because of injury. And, the list goes on

and on.

Hawks have won one pre season game and that against a second rate team, expected to again

miss the playoffs. Most of us haven't had the opportunity to watch any of these games - We read

about them, check the box score and come away with a bitter sweet taste about everything.

Lets get healthy - Hopefully. Let's give our new coach and his staff time. They will change things

for the better - Hopefully. Before pre season, we, or at least most of us, thought things would start

off slow with everything being new, different. And, it has. We believed things would improve as

we advanced into the regular season - Hopefully.

Things look bad right now. Give it time. It will get better. Hopefully!

:angel19:

It's been 1 1/2 years since Bib has had a hot hand.

This was the most healthy team last year and still got killed by Orlando. This year it looks to be the same old thing.

[macdaddy]

What "has not" happened that has made the team worse this offseason. We needed 2 things this offseason 1 - PG 2 - Big. I think other teams improved in the eastern conference and our division. We have a ownership problem that is ran by those that do not have the money to operate a franchise.

What is needed by this team is so simple even us fans see it.

Most of the fans on this board think Jason Collins and Etan Thomas are better centers than Dampier so I don't think fans are smarter than Sund. Getting a starting PG and a Big to defend Howard is far from simple. In fact 80% of the league is looking for the same thing. Not only are they hard to find but they are very expensive.

As Al said we are going to war with what we've got. LD is smart enough to realize that we have unique talents on this team that require playing a different style to be successful against the elite teams. Its pre-season. Getting embarrased is not good but we're still 0-0.

[benhillboy]

Ownership, if they really wanted to make a run at a title, or at the very least generating revenue, could've made a tremendous splash in the offseason. It would've taken a financial commitment from them. Just remember folks, this is what the front office passed on:

- hiring Avery Johnson as coach

- using the #31 pick on a young big man

- finding a way to re-sign Josh Childress, or at least get a player for him

- trading someone on this team, or using the full MLE to acquire Shaq

Had ownership just done 2 of these 4 things ( especially if they would've hire Avery as coach and acquired Shaq ), fan apathy would be minimal and the buzz around the Hawks would've definitely be at a high level. And that's including what we kind of see in Jordan Crawford.

Instead, this is what the Hawks did:

- hired Larry Drew as coach

- traded the #31 for 3 million

- traded Childress for a 3+ million trade exception

- re-signed Jason Collins

- signed Josh Powell

- signed Etan Thomas

When you look at those moves, compared to what we could have realistically done, you see why people are upset and even expect less out of this Hawks team.

Contrary to popular belief amongst Hawks fans, it was the defense that was the main problem last year, not the offense. Even in those games in which we couldn't score in the 4th quarter, those games were also times in which our defense broke down the most.

If the Hawks are up 11 points in the 4th, they should still be able to win a game, even if they only score 15 points. But what would happen, is that we couldn't stop the other team ( usually the other team's PG ), and we'd lose by 6, because we'd given up 32 points in the final quarter.

Tonight's game vs Orlando, has to be a little more than a "it's just preseason" game. Orlando has been steamrolling people this preseason, basically playing their main 9 to 10 man rotation. This is the Hawks first dress rehearsal against the team that has dominated them for the past 2 seasons.

Can they prove to the fans, and most importantly, to themselves, that they can compete against this team?

We all know what happened last preseason . . . the completely embarassed us on national TV. Let's see what happens tonight. Injuries or no injuries, I want to see this team at least compete tonight . . both starters and the bench.

Funny how you failed to mention the biggest, dumbest move of the offseason: ensuring that Joe Johnson retires with a compound to live on. I wouldn't read too much into a pre-season performance against a team who has proven our mismatch, plus you're kidding yourself if you think Joe Johnson cares either way. But when the season starts, you're gonna have to defend this guy a whole lot. 10 games in we battle. I can't wait.

Edited October 19, 2010 by benhillboy

[Chickenstanley]

"I don't blame the ownership for not wanting to pay the luxury tax for the third best team in the division."

_________________

The above comment seems based purely on speculation and personal opinion. But you presented it as fact, for some odd reason? You couldn't have been talking about last season based on the context of the rest of your post, imo. You're "crystal-ballin'" us here a bit, I feel.

But....

I'll leave the debate on the money end of things to those who know more than I do. But Shaq is still, in my opinion, much better NOW than Al Horford (will ever be) and 6 million (or so) for him seems like a steal to me when everything including intrinsic value is added in.

I also can't think of more than 4 players on our current roster that I would take over Childress. ( yes, Al is one of them)

CS

I

[spotatl]

Chickenstanley- The Heat are a better team than the Hawks. The Magic are a better team than the Hawks. That makes the Hawks the third best team in the division. If you want to present an argument that the Hawks are better than either of those teams I'd love to hear it.

[Diesel]

Please turn in your chips, fellas; I got this hand won. I'll see your Mike Fratello with Marion Campbell's second run with the Falcons, Eddie Haas, and Bob Weiss. I'm all in....

Dejay....

I will see your Haas and Weiss...all in

I will call you with a Bobby Petrino (I quit), Lon Kruger (playoff guarantee), and three Hawks draft picks (Rumeal Robinson, Roy Marble, and Marvin Williams = Over Rated).

:handshake:

[Diesel]

Most of the fans on this board think Jason Collins and Etan Thomas are better centers than Dampier so I don't think fans are smarter than Sund. Getting a starting PG and a Big to defend Howard is far from simple. In fact 80% of the league is looking for the same thing. Not only are they hard to find but they are very expensive.

As Al said we are going to war with what we've got. LD is smart enough to realize that we have unique talents on this team that require playing a different style to be successful against the elite teams. Its pre-season. Getting embarrased is not good but we're still 0-0.

I don't think that Collins and Thomas are better than Damp. I just don't think Damp is that good. Nor do I think he really fits. He's just big. I'm tired of just running after old has beens whoose only claim to fame is being big.

You are right, there's no body available to matchup with Howard. We would be wasting our efforts trying to find that now. I was on the Shaq bandwagon because he would have been a good pick up for many reasons. Still we will have to happen upon something in trade if we get one.

[Vol4ever]

Most of the fans on this board think Jason Collins and Etan Thomas are better centers than Dampier so I don't think fans are smarter than Sund. Getting a starting PG and a Big to defend Howard is far from simple. In fact 80% of the league is looking for the same thing. Not only are they hard to find but they are very expensive.

As Al said we are going to war with what we've got. LD is smart enough to realize that we have unique talents on this team that require playing a different style to be successful against the elite teams. Its pre-season. Getting embarrased is not good but we're still 0-0.

You cant take a knife to a gun fight..................................................

If you cant afford to compete...................then get out of the game.

[Chickenstanley]

Spot,

You have once again made a statement that is forward-looking and based on nothing but pure speculation. Not you, me or anyone else can say with any degree of certainty which teams will or will not be better this season. That, if I'm not mistaken, is what you presented as fact.

You may be able to make a good argument for Orlando or Boston -- but you have absolutely no grounds for any argument that includes Miami--- a team that has never played a game with remotely the same unit as they will have this season.

Irregardless of this, I thought you/we were *speculating* about a Hawks team that would have hypothetically included Shaq and Chillz? A purely hypothetical team --much like Miami. Correct me if I'm wrong --- but you made the statement that this *hypothetical* Hawks team would be the 3rd best in the east. Am I correct? Sorry, but you cannot know this Spot (it's not knowable) and thus, cannot present it as fact ---- and then continue with an argument that was based on pure speculation to begin with.

Even more interesting is that folowing this, you come right back and make the same type of baseless (unknowable) claim about another hypothetical team ----Miami. And also present this as fact and then attempt to base your argument on it once again.

It's not up to me to make an argument for anything. To the best of my recollection, I never made any claim that I knew where any real (or hypothetical) team would finish at the end of a season that has yet to be played. You did this! Now tell us how you knew.

CS

[AHF]

Most of the fans on this board think Jason Collins and Etan Thomas are better centers than Dampier

That statement is not remotely true, IMO. If you ran a poll, there is no way a majority would pick Collins or Thomas over Dampier, IMO.

[spotatl]

Chickenstanley- if you are so delusional that you are incapable of seeing that the Heat are a better team than the Hawks then I don't really see the point of trying to explain it to you.

Edited October 21, 2010 by spotatl