Every Hawk's issue cant be fixed right now!

[JTB]

To my fellow Hawksquawker's who have much love for the Atlanta Hawks and want to see them be a better team:

So many are saying we need a PG then others are saying we need a CENTER. Some people are actually showing Bibby alot of love and not bashing him but Hello people! We need BOTH! Number one every issue cant be fixed at once BECAUSE Sund including the ASG just doesn't seem as if they have the smarts to do a blockbuster trade to fix all weaknesses though of course it is possible. An you guys know this! Now there is two huge issues with the Hawks that are noticeable every night with the point guard position and center position.

-----------------------at the pg pos.- we have no penetration to the lane and no perimeter defense

--------------------------at the center pos.-we have no post scoring (main issue anyhow)

Now with all that said and assuming we all agree here. Lets take a vote (Im not going to do a poll). What makes more sense to get at the time, trading for a pg or for a center?

personally knowing we need some points in the paint, some penetration and just because Im sick of seeing every point guard in the NBA being able to penetrate the Lane on us I say we trade for a PG. Everybody knows we need some inside scoring most preferring a Post inside scorer, thats fine but I feel a penetrating point guard cannot only drive the lane and put it in the basket but also create for the BIGS we already have.

Also to add to this what BIG can we even get to help with inside scoring that we know is avaliable?.....There's either none or....none but there is quite a few PG's that we can get that can penetrate and play better defense than bibby So asking for a BIG right now or even hoping for one seems a bit silly to me cause there isnt one that is really avaliable!

JUST READ THE BOLD.....

Edited February 18, 2011 by JTB

[Joker]

I say this:

#1 need: talent infusion. We don't have enough talent to compete with Chicago, Orlando w/ D12, Miami, Boston, or NYK if they get Melo. That's much more important than adding just any PG or C.

#2 need: PG

#3 need: C

#4 need: backup PF who can really contribute.

#5 need: Adding someone to the core (very good player or a player with very good or better potential) or trading someone (except Al) for a superstar. This goes back to #1.

[Joker]

To my fellow Hawksquawker's who have much love for the Atlanta Hawks and want to see them be a better team:

So many are saying we need a PG then others are saying we need a CENTER. Some people are actually showing Bibby alot of love and not bashing him but Hello people! We need BOTH! Number one every issue cant be fixed at once BECAUSE Sund including the ASG just doesn't seem as if they have the smarts to do a blockbuster trade to fix all weaknesses though of course it is possible. An you guys know this! Now there is two huge issues with the Hawks that are noticeable every night with the point guard position and center position.

-----------------------at the pg pos.- we have no penetration to the lane and no perimeter defense

--------------------------at the center pos.-we have no post scoring (main issue anyhow)

Now with all that said and assuming we all agree here. Lets take a vote (Im not going to do a poll). What makes more sense to get at the time, trading for a pg or for a center?

personally knowing we need some points in the paint, some penetration and just because Im sick of seeing every point guard in the NBA being able to penetrate the Lane on us I say we trade for a PG. Everybody knows we need some inside scoring most preferring a Post inside scorer, thats fine but I feel a penetrating point guard cannot only drive the lane and put it in the basket but also create for the BIGS we already have.

Also to add to this what BIG can we even get to help with inside scoring that we know is avaliable?.....There's either none or....none but there is quite a few PG's that we can get that can penetrate and play better defense than bibby So asking for a BIG right now or even hoping for one seems a bit silly to me cause there isnt one that is really avaliable!

JUST READ THE BOLD.....

Just curious... What's your idea of the moves you are looking for?

Steve Nash?

Devin Harris?

Aaron Brooks?

Russell Westbrook?

[Blunt91]

Just curious... What's your idea of the moves you are looking for?

Steve Nash?

Devin Harris?

Aaron Brooks?

Russell Westbrook?

Why would OKC be willing to trade Westbrook?

[AnthonyI11]

Ok captain obvious. What was said in your thread that we didn't already know the past 3 years?

[Guest]

I agree we need both but with the current NBA being a guards league...we need a PG that can get in the lane and either make the correct pass or take the shot.

I don't really care what PG we get from the available ones, we need to get rid of the unproductive players for productive ones.

A deal similar to when the HAWKS traded Speedy and Acie for Jamal Crawford.

[Wretch]

I say this:

#1 need: talent infusion. We don't have enough talent to compete with Chicago, Orlando w/ D12, Miami, Boston, or NYK if they get Melo. That's much more important than adding just any PG or C.

#2 need: PG

#3 need: C

#4 need: backup PF who can really contribute.

#5 need: Adding someone to the core (very good player or a player with very good or better potential) or trading someone (except Al) for a superstar. This goes back to #1.

I agree with Supes. The #1 problem is overall talent level. We have a lot of talent, we just don't have that "special" talent. We can mask that fact and do pretty decently, but we're going to need to move Al to PF (get a center), improve our PG play (get a PG), and we need to take the ball from Josh Smith. We cannot and WILL NOT win as long as he thinks that he's a #2 option. His shots should go to Al - a guy who could be a legit 20/10.

More important than all that, the Hawks' biggest problem has nothing to do with any player we have or could have - it's attitude.

To put it bluntly, the attitude of this franchise f#@*ing sucks.

I'm SO tired of "just good enough." I'm tired of being handed excuses about money, up and coming talent, no available trade scenarios. I'm tired of hearing what ISN'T possible. If it's not possible, then why do teams go full circle in the time it takes us to just become average? If it isn't possible, or there just is no way to truly improve the team, then why the hell does it seem like every other team in the NBA manages to get it done at some point or another? Every team except us and the Clippers......(who now have one of the best big men I've seen in a LOOOONG time). I'm tired of having a management and ownership group that lacks the wits and passion to get a team over the hump.

Funny thing is....I say this as I'm making plans to spend upwards of $500 to drive 100+ miles to drag my boys and my big brother to their first Hawks game. This same team that I do not believe will get out of the 2nd round...if they get past Chicago, Orlando, or NY.

[JTB]

Ok captain obvious. What was said in your thread that we didn't already know the past 3 years?

Well my sarcastic friend whats being said is that we are not going to get a star pg and there is no BIGS avaliable that we would even want. You would be suprised for the love of Bibbs but it need to stop, i know the man can hit the 3 but thats it and the crying for a BIG MAN should stop as well cause no team in the NBA seems like they are willing to trade their BIG MAN. so at that position we have what we have.

What we should be looking for is talent we know the hawks will actually go for at pg or center. To me Center isnt anything to worry about at the time cause like I said none are avalible but to put in simpler terms if we were to bring a great player to the ATL it's going to be a PG before a Center. unfortuanately for us we are going to have to find that center through free agency or draft. True centers dont exist in the NBA anymore, maybe there's about 7 or 8 but thats it!

Just curious... What's your idea of the moves you are looking for?

Steve Nash?

Devin Harris?

Aaron Brooks?

Russell Westbrook?

well im just trying to be realistic with this franchise and find the best non star pg but has much potential to be one that the hawks will really go after. I know you hate sessions but i recommend him or andre miller who i know you like and would be better for this team but judging are owners i dont even see andre as a possibility cause of how cheap this franchise is......add devin harris to that list.

Why would OKC be willing to trade Westbrook?

thats just it they wont. everybody wants a star but the ASG wont pay for a star even if they had a chance of getting him unless it was steve nash, cp3, d will, rondo, rose and all these players arent availible so we need to be again realistic with what we can really get in a hawks uniform.

[JTB]

I agree with Supes. The #1 problem is overall talent level. We have a lot of talent, we just don't have that "special" talent. We can mask that fact and do pretty decently, but we're going to need to move Al to PF (get a center), improve our PG play (get a PG), and we need to take the ball from Josh Smith. We cannot and WILL NOT win as long as he thinks that he's a #2 option. His shots should go to Al - a guy who could be a legit 20/10.

More important than all that, the Hawks' biggest problem has nothing to do with any player we have or could have - it's attitude.

To put it bluntly, the attitude of this franchise f#@*ing sucks.

I'm SO tired of "just good enough." I'm tired of being handed excuses about money, up and coming talent, no available trade scenarios. I'm tired of hearing what ISN'T possible. If it's not possible, then why do teams go full circle in the time it takes us to just become average? If it isn't possible, or there just is no way to truly improve the team, then why the hell does it seem like every other team in the NBA manages to get it done at some point or another? Every team except us and the Clippers......(who now have one of the best big men I've seen in a LOOOONG time). I'm tired of having a management and ownership group that lacks the wits and passion to get a team over the hump.

Funny thing is....I say this as I'm making plans to spend upwards of $500 to drive 100+ miles to drag my boys and my big brother to their first Hawks game. This same team that I do not believe will get out of the 2nd round...if they get past Chicago, Orlando, or NY.

I agree and im tired too but if this ownership was different as far as spending money than we of course would have "special talent" but they are who they are. An like you im sick of the so called up and coming talent as well but I have a huge question for you and the rest of the hawk fans. Let's be honest for a sec......How many true up and coming players have the hawks really had?..........To me none. Acie Law was a rookie who didnt really play, same with teague and sy. only upcoming talent we have had are the stars on our team like smith and Al other that we havent had a real upcoming player since. Law, Teague, shelden, and whoever else was expected to do things coming straight out of college, we have not once went after upcoming talent that has played in the NBA and actually done something. So at this time ramon sessions and players like him who has did something in this league seriously need to be considered!

I should make a post of this cause i feel hawk fans think we really had some upcoming talent and we really didnt. I and others were only hyped on teague because of LD but hell he dont even use him. but in reality teague has don nothing where we should have thought he was going to be raw talent anyways.

[Diesel]

I disagree with the original poster's intent.

We can fix all problems. We just have to rightly identify what's wrong.

First. Why can't we get a guard like Ramon Sessions and then go after a big better than Jason Collins?? I think this piece by piece fixing is the problem. So many of us are so concerned about getting Steve Nash or some other big name star that we can't even fanthom getting a guy who does what we need right now. I believe it's this way because we actually have a very low opinion of the Hawks. The truth is that we're not bad. In fact, we beat some pretty good teams and we have good chemistry and we're actually pretty competitive on the road. In other words, we're vets.

However a slight change or a shakeup (for good) is due.

I would start by getting Sessions... We need a PG who can break down defenses. Even Brooks.. But Sessions in my mind is better because he can pass.

I would then look for a C better than Collins. There are plenty.

Marvin for Heywood has always been there.

There's also guys like Mozgov, Petro, or Earl Barron.

Thing is that Drew has to prove that he's a developing coach. Thus far, he's continue to Woody players and make room for them on his bench. We got to test Teague if we keep him.

[frosgrim]

The problems go beyond the ASG's willingness to spend into the LT. I get that they don't have the resources. That is fine, but if that is the case, then they need to get creative and find solutions. I completely agree that the attitude of the team, the coaches, the whole darn organization is terrible. Gearon comes on the radio and blasts the fans for not showing up. At the same time he says the core has to stay intact. Yet, this very same core got blasted by the Magic last year and the Cavs the year before.

The problem is that the ASG is poorly run and that has bled out to the teams. Frankly, the Thrashers are better positioned today than the Hawks are. The reason I say this is that Gearon isn't meddling in the Thrashers. He's letting the hockey people run the club. The trades they pulled off in the offseason were really good. They got creative with the budget they had and got some good players in. The problems they have right now is they don't have a legit scorer. A little more funding and they could get one. But that isn't going to happen.

The Hawks, however, are run by Gearon who sees himself as a brilliant basketball mind. His philosophy is to keep the same team on the court for as many years as possible becuase that will get better results. However, the history of modern pro-ball doesn't agree with this philosophy. The winning teams identified a couple of key guys and then used talent that didn't fit to bring in talent that does. The Hawks talent simply doesn't mesh well togehter. On top of that you have the cultural problems of apathy.

Thanks for starting this thread to let me get my daily vent on how crappy the Hawks are as an organization.

Back to my mantra: The ASG make it really hard to cheer for the Atlanta teams.

[Diesel]

The problems go beyond the ASG's willingness to spend into the LT. I get that they don't have the resources. That is fine, but if that is the case, then they need to get creative and find solutions. I completely agree that the attitude of the team, the coaches, the whole darn organization is terrible. Gearon comes on the radio and blasts the fans for not showing up. At the same time he says the core has to stay intact. Yet, this very same core got blasted by the Magic last year and the Cavs the year before.

The problem is that the ASG is poorly run and that has bled out to the teams. Frankly, the Thrashers are better positioned today than the Hawks are. The reason I say this is that Gearon isn't meddling in the Thrashers. He's letting the hockey people run the club. The trades they pulled off in the offseason were really good. They got creative with the budget they had and got some good players in. The problems they have right now is they don't have a legit scorer. A little more funding and they could get one. But that isn't going to happen.

The Hawks, however, are run by Gearon who sees himself as a brilliant basketball mind. His philosophy is to keep the same team on the court for as many years as possible becuase that will get better results. However, the history of modern pro-ball doesn't agree with this philosophy. The winning teams identified a couple of key guys and then used talent that didn't fit to bring in talent that does. The Hawks talent simply doesn't mesh well togehter. On top of that you have the cultural problems of apathy.

Thanks for starting this thread to let me get my daily vent on how crappy the Hawks are as an organization.

Back to my mantra: The ASG make it really hard to cheer for the Atlanta teams.

I think the fix is:

1. A new investor.

2. Selling Hockey.

The truth is that when our owners bought the Hawks, they had Belkin as the principle investor for the team. When they separated from Belkin, they took on more than they could handle. You're talking 70% of the share gone.

They have made it this far, but money is tight for what started as a Hobby.

They've enjoyed winning in the playoffs but not as fans. As owners.

They've enjoyed revenue sharing.

But now, they're at a place where they know they need to do something but first they need more revenue. I'm sure that they are open to another investor stepping in.

Personally, I would love to see somebody with a basketball mind step in and help to mold this franchise. Even... (I'm going to say it)... Ted Turner or Bernard Marcus.

[frosgrim]

I think the fix is:

1. A new investor.

2. Selling Hockey.

The truth is that when our owners bought the Hawks, they had Belkin as the principle investor for the team. When they separated from Belkin, they took on more than they could handle. You're talking 70% of the share gone.

They have made it this far, but money is tight for what started as a Hobby.

They've enjoyed winning in the playoffs but not as fans. As owners.

They've enjoyed revenue sharing.

But now, they're at a place where they know they need to do something but first they need more revenue. I'm sure that they are open to another investor stepping in.

Personally, I would love to see somebody with a basketball mind step in and help to mold this franchise. Even... (I'm going to say it)... Ted Turner or Bernard Marcus.

I agree that a new primary investor is needed. Either the hockey club needs to be spun off, or the new investor wants primary stake in both (unlikely). I would love to have Turner back in the fold, but I think that shipped sailed long ago. Marcus never seemed like a guy that wants to be an owner.

Whom ever they get needs to be extremely rich and be willing to install a new philosophy to the organization. The FO of the Hawks needs an infusion of new minds and talent. Then the owners need to get out of the way and let them find the right formula of players, coaches, and scouts.

[MaceCase]

If it's not possible, then why do teams go full circle in the time it takes us to just become average?

To give you the straight and blunt answer to that, because the fans and most unfortunately the owners think that their favorite players are untouchable and by no means can the team improve without said players remaining on the roster. The people that actually follow this franchise and those that run it genuinely want improvements but feel that unless the team receives Jesus H. Christ himself in return from a trade that the team actually lost in that transaction.

There was a time when Chicago thought their core of Hinrich, Gordon, Deng, Nocioni and Thomas were all untouchable and that through natural progression that group would be challenging for multiple championships. They made it to the 2nd round over the champs and won a couple games too against former champs and thought it all swell that they were turning down trades for KG and Kobe left and right and refused to allow other free agents from using their franchise as leverage similar to what Carmelo is doing now because their core was just to damn adorable and valuable. Flash forward two years and that team was letting guys just walk away without a care for receiving assets back in return and trading the rest for bums on expiring deals. They were quite literally offering up Luol Deng for a ham sandwich because they got a new shiny XBox and playing with dolls were now for kids.

The Pacers thought they were on their way too with a great core of Jermaine O'Neal, Ron Artest, Stephen Jackson and Jamaal Tinsley holding down all the important positions, dazzling teams with their myriad of ways to score and then turning around and locking the s*** out of you on defense. That team embarrassed their city and franchise, albeit with a brawl instead of a record for futility in the second round, and each and everyone of them were shipped off for "blue collar" guys or just told to go home and sit till their contract ran out. Now they have a decent remaining core and bags of money to blow to improve next summer.

The Knicks through all their trials and tribulations still felt they had a nice core of young draft prospects that were just being poisoned by their overpaid older teammates. David Lee, Nate Robinson and Wilson Chandler were the only good their drunken stepfather Isiah had done for them and they loved their hustle, heart and willingness to leave everything out on the court even on a perennial doormat. They thought each would be the perfect compliment for a star yet come next year not a single one will be on the roster and they won't even care, they'll have two shinny new superstars to play with instead.

These teams have all been given the same chances that we've had through the draft and free agency and they've all made the same mistakes just as badly if not worse than we have yet the clear difference between us and them? They stopped and realized halfway up the hill that their mule is not going to make it over the hump and it would be better if not quicker to race back down the hill and get a newer stronger one rather than hoping that an influx of willpower will give their already laboring mule it's second wind. We spun our wheels for 6 years building this team and have seen the best that it can do as is and recognize all of the deficiencies that are there.....What's the fans and management's answers? Let's throw 95% of our cap into this same core and spin our wheels for another 6 years with the inability to address any of the deficiencies....But oh no these players are simply caterpillars yet to metemorphise into their true beautiful selves so I have reservations about even seeing our 2nd round picks leave and become a butterfly on someone else's roster.

[Diesel]

I agree that a new primary investor is needed. Either the hockey club needs to be spun off, or the new investor wants primary stake in both (unlikely). I would love to have Turner back in the fold, but I think that shipped sailed long ago. Marcus never seemed like a guy that wants to be an owner.

Whom ever they get needs to be extremely rich and be willing to install a new philosophy to the organization. The FO of the Hawks needs an infusion of new minds and talent. Then the owners need to get out of the way and let them find the right formula of players, coaches, and scouts.

I would love to see Uncle Ted come in and Buy out the Washington Component as the Principle Investor.

I wouldn't want to see Gearon Jr. run wild with Uncle Ted's money but I would like it if Ted basically supported Gearons Nique, and Sydel by making use of a real Basketball GM. Maybe even pay big to get a guy like...Doc Rivers to be Coach/GM. Or bring Kasten Back as GM.

[AtlHomer]

To my fellow Hawksquawker's who have much love for the Atlanta Hawks and want to see them be a better team:

Now with all that said and assuming we all agree here. Lets take a vote (Im not going to do a poll). What makes more sense to get at the time, trading for a pg or for a center?

personally knowing we need some points in the paint, some penetration and just because Im sick of seeing every point guard in the NBA being able to penetrate the Lane on us I say we trade for a PG. Everybody knows we need some inside scoring most preferring a Post inside scorer, thats fine but I feel a penetrating point guard cannot only drive the lane and put it in the basket but also create for the BIGS we already have.

Also to add to this what BIG can we even get to help with inside scoring that we know is avaliable?.....There's either none or....none but there is quite a few PG's that we can get that can penetrate and play better defense than bibby So asking for a BIG right now or even hoping for one seems a bit silly to me cause there isnt one that is really avaliable!

I agree with the point of your post. It is probably easier to acquire an improvement at PG rather than Center at this time. I believe Bibby can be effective however because there is not an adequate backup, he is wearing down. Trading for a penetrating PG will provide a new dimension to the team. If they can also play better perimeter defense, it can also reduce the number of easy baskets by our opponents and possibly lower their shooting percentage against the Hawks.

We can only hope that they Hawks make a move before the trade deadline. At a minimum, it would create additional excitement for the team.

[Wretch]

I think the fix is:

1. A new investor.

2. Selling Hockey.

The truth is that when our owners bought the Hawks, they had Belkin as the principle investor for the team. When they separated from Belkin, they took on more than they could handle. You're talking 70% of the share gone.

They have made it this far, but money is tight for what started as a Hobby.

They've enjoyed winning in the playoffs but not as fans. As owners.

They've enjoyed revenue sharing.

But now, they're at a place where they know they need to do something but first they need more revenue. I'm sure that they are open to another investor stepping in.

Personally, I would love to see somebody with a basketball mind step in and help to mold this franchise. Even... (I'm going to say it)... Ted Turner or Bernard Marcus.

We definitely need someone to help these guys. If it was my money, I'd be just as tight as they are. I also believe there are many who sell the team short. We have a talented club and the talent actually fits together. BUT it doesn't fit a championship or ECF configuration. Some things need to happen before we can take that step - one of those has to be a change of attitude. We can't just sit around watching other teams get better.

[JTB]

I disagree with the original poster's intent.

We can fix all problems. We just have to rightly identify what's wrong.

First. Why can't we get a guard like Ramon Sessions and then go after a big better than Jason Collins?? I think this piece by piece fixing is the problem. So many of us are so concerned about getting Steve Nash or some other big name star that we can't even fanthom getting a guy who does what we need right now. I believe it's this way because we actually have a very low opinion of the Hawks. The truth is that we're not bad. In fact, we beat some pretty good teams and we have good chemistry and we're actually pretty competitive on the road. In other words, we're vets.

However a slight change or a shakeup (for good) is due.

I would start by getting Sessions... We need a PG who can break down defenses. Even Brooks.. But Sessions in my mind is better because he can pass.

I would then look for a C better than Collins. There are plenty.

Marvin for Heywood has always been there.

There's also guys like Mozgov, Petro, or Earl Barron.

Thing is that Drew has to prove that he's a developing coach. Thus far, he's continue to Woody players and make room for them on his bench. We got to test Teague if we keep him.

I dont see that happening as long as the ASG is running this team and has Sund as a GM. Dont get me wrong we can fix all these problems but not at one time cause the ASG and Sund arent creative enough or they think such players are untouchable but me as a fan is even sick of that! At this point all players are touchable maybe except horford. Anyways Im not arguing but simply saying I have no faith in Sund and the ASG to even think about making possible blockbuster deals to fix our problems. However I do believe we will take care of one problem before the deadline,