Can we win with this core?

[tonegully]

Im sitting here thinking and reading, the hawks have stepped up their defense and Dennis, Paul, and Sap are doing what it takes to win games. Do you guys think we can build a team around the core of Howard, Dennis, and Sap?

I know Sap is a UFA but im thinking we already have Dennis locked in, Howard locked in for another 2 years. You think we can offer Sap 3 year, Max deal with an option, team or player what ever. And build a championship roster around them? Im thinking of us having a 2-3 year window to make a legit run at a championship. 

 

[ViewsFromTheSquawk]

Hate to be that guy but Sap is leaving. I do think we have the front office to lure in the big names guy (finally) but I don't think it benefits this team or Millsap if he was to resign. Maybe we use that saved money to go get a PG13,Hayward,Griffin,etc. 

[sturt]

I don't rule that out, @ViewsFromTheSquawk, but I do think Bud was being forthright when he told us yesterday not to be too quick to reach any assumptions... and thus, I don't believe any firm decisions have been made on either Budcox' side, nor will any be made until after the season where Sap himself is concerned. Too many variables in-play. I think it will be clearer if/when this team would stop winning games, and all the more so, games on the road.

[tonegully]

So you think a deep run, say the ECF would motivate the Hawks to keep Sap? Obviously not a full 5 year deal but a 3 year deal with max money? 

[andpau]

vor 13 Minuten, tonegully sagte:

So you think a deep run, say the ECF would motivate the Hawks to keep Sap? Obviously not a full 5 year deal but a 3 year deal with max money? 

He will lose a lot of money if he subscribes a 3Y Deal... 

[Buzzard]

18 minutes ago, tonegully said:

So you think a deep run, say the ECF would motivate the Hawks to keep Sap? Obviously not a full 5 year deal but a 3 year deal with max money? 

Its not being talked about but I think Sap wants to test free agency. 3 years at 20 a year is a good deal; but he may get a big 4 year offer with raises. I don't see him doing us a 20 million dollar or more favor at his age.

In all likelihood this will be his last 20 + million a year contract.

Edited January 8, 2017 by Buzzard

[Diesel]

1 hour ago, ViewsFromTheSquawk said:

Hate to be that guy but Sap is leaving. I do think we have the front office to lure in the big names guy (finally) but I don't think it benefits this team or Millsap if he was to resign. Maybe we use that saved money to go get a PG13,Hayward,Griffin,etc. 

I think it depends on how we do this offseason

[Diesel]

5 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

Its not being talked about but I think Sap wants to test free agency. 3 years at 20 a year is a good deal; but he may get a big 4 year offer with raises. I don't see him doing us a 20 million dollar or more favor at his age. In all likelihood this will be his last 20 + million a year contract.

I can easily see us offering him a 3 yr 70 million dollar deal and no other team wanting to match it.   You are right it is his last big contract so he may take it because it's the best deal that he will get.  Also, I think he really respects Bud.  

[Buzzard]

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

I can easily see us offering him a 3 yr 70 million dollar deal and no other team wanting to match it.   You are right it is his last big contract so he may take it because it's the best deal that he will get.  Also, I think he really respects Bud.  

I think he likes our organization and this team as well. I am not sold on him not getting more than what you propose though. There are 4 to 6 teams dying to make the playoffs and Sap could very well be their ticket.

[sturt]

22 minutes ago, tonegully said:

So you think a deep run, say the ECF would motivate the Hawks to keep Sap? Obviously not a full 5 year deal but a 3 year deal with max money? 

Still too many variables to make a good guess at that, imo. Let's wait until closer to the trade deadline and see what's evident then. That's really when a decision has to be reached on how you want to think beyond this season.

Biggest variable, really, is injury... one high ankle sprain to a key player on our side or on our competition's side can change a season in a split second... or one ACL or achilles tear can drastically change prospects for multiple seasons.

[Diesel]

5 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I think he likes our organization and this team as well. I am not sold on him not getting more than what you propose though. There are 4 to 6 teams dying to make the playoffs and Sap could very well be their ticket.

So you're saying that they will give him more years?

Nobody wants the next Nick Collison. Aged out with big money.   They'd rather spend money that big on guys who may at somepoint because unhappy with their current team. 

 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Sap isn't getting the full max from a team.

The crazy thing is that we need Sap more than he needs us.  A Hawks offer should START with what they gave Dwight ( 3 yrs - 70 mill ).  He probably won't take that, and will ask for another year.  A 4 year - 100 mill contract sounds ridiculous, but in this new market, it really isn't.  So the Hawks have to evaluate if he's worth it.  

Sap is the "Anchorman" ( as Nique and Bob calls him ), because he truly is the anchor of this team, especially on the defensive end.  Millsap's game isn't based on crazy athleticism.  It's based on solid fundamentals.  Because of this, a guy like Millsap could be an effective player well into his mid-30s, much like a Zach Randolph.

But the Hawks could go into a different direction.

If they want to be big players in the free agent market, they could let Sap walk, and go for a box office player . . . like a Blake Griffin.  No doubt that Blake would fit in, and sell very well in Atlanta.  Another disappointing season in Clipperland could lead to that team being broken up a bit, much like what we went through with JJ, Josh, and Al.   In a decision between Chris Paul and Blake, the Clippers will choose to keep Blake.  Question is . . . will Chris choose to stay with them, when he opts out.  

Both of those guys could change the entire landscape of the league, if they decide to leave the Clippers.

 

[Diesel]

5 minutes ago, sturt said:

Still too many variables to make a good guess at that, imo. Let's wait until closer to the trade deadline and see what's evident then. That's really when a decision has to be reached on how you want to think beyond this season.

Biggest variable, really, is injury... one high ankle sprain to a key player on our side or on our competition's side can change a season in a split second... or one ACL or achilles tear can drastically change prospects for multiple seasons.

I think the bigger question now is will we move Dunleavy Jr.   I think that there are some teams with players with longer contracts who teams would love to trade for a shorter one.  I joked about Singler, Calderon,  Wesley Johnson, and others but there are those guys on longer than 1 year deals that could probably be had if we really wanted them. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 Because of this, a guy like Millsap could be an effective player well into his mid-30s, much like a Zach Randolph

So you do read my squawk posts......;-)

[Diesel]

6 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Sap isn't getting the full max from a team.

The crazy thing is that we need Sap more than he needs us.  A Hawks offer should START with what they gave Dwight ( 3 yrs - 70 mill ).  He probably won't take that, and will ask for another year.  A 4 year - 100 mill contract sounds ridiculous, but in this new market, it really isn't.  So the Hawks have to evaluate if he's worth it.  

Sap is the "Anchorman" ( as Nique and Bob calls him ), because he truly is the anchor of this team, especially on the defensive end.  Millsap's game isn't based on crazy athleticism.  It's based on solid fundamentals.  Because of this, a guy like Millsap could be an effective player well into his mid-30s, much like a Zach Randolph.

But the Hawks could go into a different direction.

If they want to be big players in the free agent market, they could let Sap walk, and go for a box office player . . . like a Blake Griffin.  No doubt that Blake would fit in, and sell very well in Atlanta.  Another disappointing season in Clipperland could lead to that team being broken up a bit, much like what we went through with JJ, Josh, and Al.   In a decision between Chris Paul and Blake, the Clippers will choose to keep Blake.  Question is . . . will Chris choose to stay with them, when he opts out.  

Both of those guys could change the entire landscape of the league, if they decide to leave the Clippers.

 

That's an interesting take.   I think that paying Sap close to 25 mil at the age of 35 is something that the higher ups would have to consider.  At that point are you paying him for his play or for his service?  I would strongly consider a 4 year 100 Million dollar deal for Sap knowing that Baze and Howard will be coming off of their deals a year before.  We'd have to have confidence in this core and in our ability to reload through the midrounds of the draft. 

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

I think the bigger question now is will we move Dunleavy Jr.   I think that there are some teams with players with longer contracts who teams would love to trade for a shorter one.  I joked about Singler, Calderon,  Wesley Johnson, and others but there are those guys on longer than 1 year deals that could probably be had if we really wanted them. 

Name names....give us a name!!!!

 

[Buzzard]

11 minutes ago, Diesel said:

So you're saying that they will give him more years?

Nobody wants the next Nick Collison. Aged out with big money.   They'd rather spend money that big on guys who may at somepoint because unhappy with their current team. 

 

No, but they would love to have the next Garnet, Gasol, Duncan, Zebo, Kidd etc....Sap has never been an injury concern, so nothing in his history says he can't be effective at 35 or 36.

If they are willing to pay for three good seasons and take the fourth at a small loss in production just to beat other teams out, why not?

[Diesel]

1 minute ago, Spud2Nique said:

Name names....give us a name!!!!

 

Let's take a Wesley Johnson for instance.   He's definitely not what they wanted in LAC.  He's got a few years left on his deal.  They will do a deal.

Let's take Cole Aldrich.  A shot blocker, a rim protector... however, I don't think he has found any love in Minny. 

You could easily take Monte Ellis from the Pacers.

You could probably get N.O. to give you Omer Asik and a first for Splitter and Dunleavy.

 

 

 

[BigDog90]

2 hours ago, tonegully said:

Im sitting here thinking and reading, the hawks have stepped up their defense and Dennis, Paul, and Sap are doing what it takes to win games. Do you guys think we can build a team around the core of Howard, Dennis, and Sap?

I know Sap is a UFA but im thinking we already have Dennis locked in, Howard locked in for another 2 years. You think we can offer Sap 3 year, Max deal with an option, team or player what ever. And build a championship roster around them? Im thinking of us having a 2-3 year window to make a legit run at a championship. 

 

No. I don't think so.

[BigDog90]

2 hours ago, ViewsFromTheSquawk said:

Hate to be that guy but Sap is leaving. I do think we have the front office to lure in the big names guy (finally) but I don't think it benefits this team or Millsap if he was to resign. Maybe we use that saved money to go get a PG13,Hayward,Griffin,etc. 

They weren't going to come. Relationships > FO.