The One Question that has to be answered is.......

[Wurider05]

whether or not Smoove, Marvin, or CHillz can be better than AL. I mean if the answer is no then we might as well keep him. If the answer is yes then we move him to hopefully fill a need. That is the decision that must be made right now. We have too many forwards and somebody has to go. I like AL but we have seen the best that he can do and under the right conditions he is a very good ball player but he just doesn't seem to fit in with the way things are going and if he does fit into the way things are going what about Marvin?? I mean these guys are coming along pretty good. Smoove, CHillz, and Marvin are all better rebounders that AL but AL has the scoring touch they don't have. ONe way or anothter a decison is going have to be made and I bet that BK is praying that someone gives him an offer for AL that he can't refuse so that could take the pressure off a bit. BUT YOU SEE WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU DRAFT AND TRADE FOR GUYS WHO PLAY THAT SAME DAMN POSITION!!!!!!!!!

[SmooveTheFuture]

The question to ask yourself is this when Al Harrington was 19/20 Years old was he as good as Josh Smith and Marvin Williams were. I dont know if that is the case but you can not sign Al Harrington and hope to develop these young guys. There is a huge log jam at the Forward position someone has to be traded thats the bottom line.

[dalamchops]

I'd rather sit through the rest of the season developing our young players. Al is just being a roadblock. Really, the biggest knock on Al, is that he cannot play any D AT ALL. I watched smoove turn the ball over the other night. They were 2vs1 fastbreak and he just defended it like it was nothing. The fact is, defense wins championships in ANY team sports.

[exodus]

That is an easy question to answer.

Al is an 18/7 player.

Since both Smoove and Marvin are better than than Al on D and on the boards all they really need is to be able to average 14 ppg to be better than Al.

Do you think there is a chance that Smoove or Marvin could eventually average 14 ppg if they got as many minutes as Al?

[SmooveTheFuture]

Quote:

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That is an easy question to answer.

Al is an 18/7 player.

Since both Smoove and Marvin are better than than Al on D and on the boards all they really need is to be able to average 14 ppg to be better than Al.

Do you think there is a chance that Smoove or Marvin could eventually average 14 ppg if they got as many minutes as Al?

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Yes they can no doubt about it if they got the shot attempts he got they could do that with there eyes closed.

[warcore]

yea no doubt, if marvin got nearly as much PT he would put up at LEAST 14 ppg and grab a ton more boards. i feel that al also ruins the flow of the offense.

dont even get me started on the D, he needs to go so we can develop marv and smoove, with chill off the bench

[Diesel]

1. There are 4 forwards.. and 2 forward spots.

I wouldn't call that a HUGE logjam. Especially when you consider that neither Marvin or JC is starter quality right now anyway...

2. The maturity path is not the same for everyone

You bring up Al's play when he was 20 as if all players go the same path. IF it were true then Roy Marble and Harold Miner would have been just as good as Jordan. However ,the truth of the matter is that ALL potential doesn't mature. It's smarter in this case to hold on to a player who has matured as we wait for others to mature... Than to trade the mature player and get the unknown. Just because Marvin is a #2 pick doesn't mean that he will mature. Look at Darko. Look at Stromile Swift. Look at Shawn Bradley. Just because Smoove was a slam dunk champion doesn't mean that his game will be starter quality. Look at Harold Minor. Look at Kenny Walker. And Just because Chillz came out of Stanford doesn't mean he's destined to be great... Adam Keefe, Borchardt, etc, etc... The point is that we have a hand full of hope and Al.

[chillzatl]

I think it's a given that Marvin will match Al's production within 3 years (including this season). Al is a good player. But his numbers are not astronomical.

Think about this.. you consistantly dog Marvin and what he's done (so far) in his rookie season. yet you throw out Stromile Swifts name as an example of players whose talent didn't mature. But you petitioned for Stromile Swift to be a Hawk for years now.. I just thought there was an odd bit of irony there.

Anyway, I like Al. But his numbers aren't great. In fact, he's not really great at anything. Just good to very good. Which isn't a knock, just a fact. I'd like to keep him for the season and do an SnT.

[Diesel]

Yeah, let's put Diesel on trial to try to save my failing point.

Your first statement Chillz was wrong.

You say it's a foregone conclusion that in 3 yrs Marvin will match Al's output.

That's not true... nor is tht conclusion forgone.. The truth is that NOBODY Knows what Marvin will be in 3 yrs. It was a forgone conclusion that JT would be a PG in 3 yrs... However, it's 6 yrs later and he's still calling himself a "GUARD'... IT was a foregone conclusion that Darko would be a dominant player in three years... However, I wonder if Darko can even get off the bench in Detroit?

It was a foregone conclusion that Yao would be the most dominate C in the game by now. However, the only thing he dominates is Allstar votes because of Nationalism.

The point is this... All there is is a lot of hope that Marvin and the joshes turn out. However, the truth is that we are just as unsure about them turning out as we were about JT becoming a point guard. It's possible but we don't know for sure.

About Al's numbers...

The numbers aren't great? But the numbers are not bad. Anytime a player can consistently get you 20, lead the league in 3 point shooting, and be a low post scorer... It's not bad. If the numbers were as you say, then re-signing Al to a cheap contract should be easy.. right?

[exodus]

Quote:

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Anytime a player can consistently get you 20, lead the league in 3 point shooting,

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Again more fabrications. Al has never averaged 20 and isn't leading the league in 3s. In fact he has had only 1 month of good 3 pt shooting in his career.

[exodus]

Al has made fewer 3s, and shoots a worse percentage, than these noted 3 pt marksmen:

Delonte West

Shane Battier

Earl Watson

Jameer Nelson

Austin Croshere

[mudderfudder77]

Quote:

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About Al's numbers...

The numbers aren't great? But the numbers are not bad. Anytime a player can consistently get you 20, lead the league in 3 point shooting, and be a low post scorer... It's not bad. If the numbers were as you say, then re-signing Al to a cheap contract should be easy.. right?

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Point was already clarified.

[Diesel]

Find another forward that can match that.

[exodus]

LOL can't stand having your delusions exposed I see.

[Diesel]

You can squash my delusion by finding some forwards that match those numbers.

Until you do, no insults are name callings will do. You only justify my point with your begging of the question...

What's up Ex... Did I stump the statman??

[exodus]

No actually I do have to get some work done. And I realize what you are doing. You just want to argue over every player which I don't have time for.

it is enough for me that your delusions about Al have been exposed.

[bralin1]

Diesel,

Why would you waste your time defending a guy who plays such poor defense? If you want to build at least a division winner...you need willing defenders. AL should be traded NOW. Marvin will surpass expectations here in short order...he is making progress. Lets leverage AL in a trade and get some real value...a PG and/or a draft pick. We don't need AL or his lousy defense here any longer. His defense is rubbing off on the young guys. Enough already.

[Diesel]

Because Dominque played very poor defense and it was good having him here...

I think that sometimes... you have to play with the cards you have and throw away a good card because you wished you had something else.

I'm not defending AL's defense. I readily admit that I WISH he were Artest like on defense.

BUT..

I realize that a player of Al's offensive ability don't come along often. Especially not one that works well with what we already have.

Now, look at Indy. They traded Al to us. Now they want him back. They are a championship team. Why do you suppose they want such a defensive liability.. especially in the wake of Losing Artest??

Probably because they realize that they have the coaching and the team to overcome Al's defense.

Well, why is it that our Welfare mentality fans can't think the same way??

We're so busy trying to find a fault in Al, that we totally miss the fact that his offense is something that you don't get everyday. take the challenge... find a forward in NBA History that put up the numbers above... then let's talk about it?

Otherwise, join the Welfarementality of those who don't appreciate good things and can't think beyond the top of the lottery.

[exodus]

First of all Indy would have no interest in Al if Artest hadn't wigged out.

Secondly Indy plays very good team D so they may be able to cover for Al. We can't.

Also Indy fans in general aren't thrilled with the prospect of Al coming back. Just go to any Indy board and ask what they think of Al and you will see what I mean.

[bralin1]

Man, you are grasping badly. Comparing Al Harrington to Dominique? Saying that offensive talent like Al's doesn't come along very often? Are you kidding? Are we talking about Dwayne Wade, Kobe, Iverson? No, we are talking about a no-defense, hot and cold, 18 ppg scorer. You need a little reality here, man.

Al has been in the league a long time and has a lot of miles for a 25 year old. We can leverage this guy to help build a better future. We have some nice young pieces to help pick up the slack and as long as Woodson is here we aren't winning anything anyway.

If we keep Al we are even more stupid in management than I thought. Which is saying something because I don't think we are very smart. In the meantime, get a decent argument because the ones you have out there are not very good.