Walter, I wanna play 25 players better than dirk!!

[Diesel]

I didn't post under your command because ...

1. I'm not BHD.

2. That thread is terribly long.

But here goes... Set the clock:

This is my list of if I were picking MY TEAM, who goes before Dirk.

1. Shaq.

2. Kobe.

3. AI

4. CWebb

5. TMAC

5. Vince

7. KG

7. Duncan

9. Kidd

10. Pierce

11. Walker

12. Alonzo

13. Gary Payton

14. SAR

15. Andre Miller

16. Micheal Jordan

17. Baron Davis

18. Steve Francis

19. DIRK

20. Jamison

21. Karl Malone

22. Rasheed Wallace.

23. Ray Allen

24. Jason Terry

24. Micheal Finley

24. Boss Hog, Stackhouse.

24. Peja.

24. Jalen Rose

Welp, I only made it to 19... However, if Malone wasn't so old.... And Wallace didn't play for Portland...and Jamison was a better Shooter... Dirk would have easily been 23.

[Admin]

Picking your team for what? A pickup game at the park or to build a franchise with. I sure hope it isnt the latter because that old a** team wouldnt last the entire season.....Jordan that high up? Come on....GP? Did you see how Parker used him in the playoffs? Duncan 7th? Thats just plain insantity. Mourning even in the top 25 is a laughable.....he is barely a shell of his former self, and even in his best days I would barely take him over Dirk now.

[Guest]

Dirk is better than Zo now.I hate to say that because Zo is

a GREAT person and a guy I'd love to have on our team.ZO

pro healthy problems would destroy Dirk one on one.

Baron is a better player than Andre is.Baron will be the type

of player that can dominate a game.Steve Francis is also

better than Miller.

Is that in Order???Duncan at number 7???

Zo is ranked too high.

How can you put Antwan Jamisom above Karl Malone when

Karl STILL lead his team to the playoffs and Jamison plays

on the biggest gutter team in the league.

1)Shaq

2)Tim Duncan

3)Kobe

4)Tmac

5)KG

6)Iverson-Although Philly is starting to sink

7)Wince Carter

8)Dirk

9)Cwebb

10)Jason Kidd

11)Paul Pierce

12)Gary Payton

13)Baron Davis

14)Steve Francis

15)Karl Malone

16)Shareef Abdur Rahim

17)Antonie Walker

18)Andre Miller

19)Micheal Jordan

20)Elton Brand

There is your top 20

[Diesel]

Jordan... Yeah, he's worthy of 16th.

Duncan should be higher than 7th. Duncan is the only player next to Shaq who can totally dominate a game.

GP.... Come on, he put up allstar numbers again this yr and it was him who was dragging No Lewis having Seattle to the playoffs.

Mourning is still a very good quality C. He's still top 3. You would take Dirk over a top 3 C? Give me a break.

[Diesel]

Dirk better than Kidd, Pierce, and Reef???

What the hell are you smokin??

[Guest]

Kidd only lead the Suns to the first round in the west.Just

because he moves to the weak east.Dirk would destroy

Kidd one on one.

"Pierce, and Reef??? "

Yeah,you know I am a PP fan but that doesn't stop me from

telling the truth.

[Diesel]

Dirk's a good team player but one on one he folds.

What happen to him when they played CWebb? I heard a lot of Braggin goin into that series but on the other side.....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketbal.../mavs_kings_ap/

http://www.basketballnews.com/content/nba/...s_series2_3.asp

[Guest]

Webber would fire jumpers and miss like he always

does.

Webber folds one on one too so maybe they would

draw?

[ATLien_]

I would like to believe to be considered top tier you would be a good all around player. While Dirk is a excellent offensive player his D stops him from being top 10.

Call me crazy but I actually think Michael Finley is the best player on that team. He doesn't score as much because he kind of defers to Dirk for scoring, but he can definitley put up Dirk type offensive numbers if given the touches and he is way better on defense.

[cyman3]

The "name 25 players better than Nowitski" was started by BlackHawkDown and me. The average fan, DIESEL, composed a rank of players.

IT DOESNT MATTER if Dirk is 24th best or 10th best, what matters is that he is a top 25 player (which BHD disagrees with).

Diesels rankings above and below NOWITSKI is totally irrelevant.

"However, if Malone wasn't so old.... And Wallace didn't play for Portland...and Jamison was a better Shooter... Dirk would have easily been 23."

but the truth is that MALONE is old, Jamison does not shoot well, and who knows how well Wallace would do in another town. My theory was that as of the NBA today, DIRK is a worthy top 25 player. I NEVER SAID THE HISTORY OF THE NBA. In that case, who knows how far hes ranked.

My point was that Dirk is a top 25 player, and Diesel proved me rite.

[PlayaPat420]

i am a dirk fan but correct me if i'm wrong, the Mavericks got knocked out in the first round this year right?... dirk COULDNT destroyed kidd because he couldnt defend him, he has no D at all.

[Guest]

Well Kidd can't shoot so it doesn't matter what kinda defense

Dirk plays.lol

" the Mavericks got knocked out in the first round this year right?..."

No the second round.Were Dirk destroyed KG.I know I know,KG didn't

have alot of help.That crap is so overused.They only play better

defense as a team.

[PlayaPat420]

if he cant keep up, he doesnt have to shoot, lay-ups all day...

[Guest]

Same goes the other way.A 6'5 player can't stop a 7 footer...

duh.lol

[kelston827]

IMO, there are only six players who I can definitely say are better than Dirk.

Shaq

Kobe

Duncan

Kidd

TMac

KG

I think it's extremely close between Dirk and the second crop of superstars. Dirk, AI, Pierce, CWebb are all very comparable and I could see how a case would be made for any one of them to be ranked the 7th best in the league, or the 10th best.

IMO, Dirk is right on the cusp of the 10 best in the league.

Yes I think Dirk is better than SAR (not by much though).

Yes I think Dirk is better than Walker, Vince, Baron, GP (again, not by much).

The thing about this whole debate that strikes me as narrowminded and illogical is the people who, and I'm not saying ALL Dirk detractors are like this, but the people who just plain don't like him because he's European. Mindless of his obviously immense offensive skills, mindless of his great stats and his versatility as a 7-footer, some posters have no valid reason for their distate other than his nationality.

Yes Dirk is a below-average defender. But every one of those players outside the top 6 have holes in their game, too. AI and Walker shoot way too much, GP is getting old, Vince is inconsistent (consequently I think he's one of the most overrated players in the league).

Not every single player is a "5-tool talent". That is what separates that top 6 from the rest. And hell, even the top 6 have holes. Shaq and his free throws and lack of range, Kobe and TMac the ballhogs, Kidd and his no shot, KG not being able to lead his team. It's really hard to find a weakness in Duncan's game though.

The point is, going over any NBA player's game with a fine-toothed comb is gonna unearth some weaknesses (unless your Duncan). But at least give the guy the credit he derserves. He didn't lead his team out of the first round, but look how young he is. How many other players his age (24) are being asked to do that and are succeeding??

Not many.

Last year:

23.5 PPG

10 RPG

1 SPG

1 BPG

48 FG%

40 3FG%

85 FT%

Playoffs last year:

28.5 PPG

13 RPG

2 SPG

ALL AT 24!!!

[Diesel]

In reply to:

---

IMO, there are only six players who I can definitely say are better than Dirk.

Shaq

Kobe

Duncan

Kidd

TMac

KG

---

That's it?

CWebb is not mentioned?

AI is not Mentioned?

BTW, why is there no love for AI on this board? Didn't you guys see AI WILL Philly to the Championship 2 yrs ago. He didn't have ANY help save Deke and he carried his team past good teams like:

Milwaukee and Toronto?

AI is a one man gang who was MVP, MVP of the Allstar game, etc... and he gets no credit?

Vince is not mentioned?

Payton is not mentioned??

damn, did you see what Payton did this yr. He carried lowly Seattle to the playoffs.

If Dirk didn't have Finley, he'd be lost.

[uga2006]

ATLien I also think Finley is their best player as well.

[ATLien_]

I wish we could get Finley. He is what we need as SF. His all around game is superb. He slashes well, he shoots well, and he defends well. He is the perfect SF for the hawks. Hopefully Cuban thinks Dirk can carry the team by himself and we can send them someone for Finley. We would win the East with him.

[kelston827]

I said Dirk, AI and CWebb are very comparable and all are in my top 10.

I mentioned GP and Vince, too. And like I said,

Vince Carter is one of the most overrated players in the NBA.

GP is getting old.

Both are facts...

Dirk Nowitski is 24 years old, averages 24 and 10, shoots a high percentage from any spot on the floor (FG%, 3FG% and FT%) and is a very good ballhandler for a 7-footer.

The fact that you'd even compare Antawn Jamison with Dirk is the studpidest thing I've ever heard. What the hell are you smoking??

Jamison sucks, and what's worse he sucks on a sucky team.

[Guest]

Dirk is 24 and Kidd is 30-31.....Dirk is surely better than

Kidd when he was 24.

Dirk is younger,can shoot,can rebound and he is a total

mismatch for almost everyone he faces.I'd rather have

a young Dirk right now.

Kidd is a great player and better than anyone we have...but

I'd rather have Dirk now.