Smoove takes 3's because no one else does

[Blunt91]

To be fair to Smoove I think he takes all those long range jumpers because no one else in the starting lineup besides Joe will shoot the 3. Marvin needs to develop a 3point shot or either we need to go out and find a Small Forward who can shoot the 3pointer with regularity. Maybe if Salim played more with Josh Smith, then J-Smoove would take less long range shots and go and post up under the basket.

[Sothron]

I don't think that is the main reason why he does it but you correctly pointed out a big failing of our starters: we don't have enough three point guys to spread the court. Marvin absolutely has to step up in that role and make threes to get our offense more movement.

[TroyMcClure]

Very true. That's Woody's fault, imo. Josh needs a strict environment offensively. We have the absolute opposite of that. He wouldn't be doing this in Utah, Miami or San Antonio. Marvin just doesn't have the range. He never will, imo. What's with that John Battle like thing he does sometimes with his legs? It's like he halfway springs and flattens out. Never really rises.

[atlien]

Acie and Chill

for

Calderon and Kapono

We need 3-point shooting.

[AHF]

I don't think we have anyone who is taking the half-court shots for us. I nominate Shelden to start taking those. That would give him a bigger role in the offense. When teams have us covered out to the three point line, then they can swing the ball to Shelden for an open half-court three. No one else on the team takes them so it must be a good idea!

Seriously, we are better off exercising good shot selection and never shooting a single 3 than we are shooting perimeter shots for the sake of shooting 3s.

[Diesel]

The coach can't run a team all willy nilly.

I'm not looking at the stats, but Smoove's shooting what from the 3 pt line? 22, 23%??

If he's not over 36% from 3, then he needs to stop!

Last year, he attempt some ridiculous number of threes... Something like 150-160 or so. So far, it fills like he's putting up 3-4 a night. That means, we can expect him to pace at 240-280 3 pters this year.

STOP the Woody experiment.

Get a coach in here that knows what he's doing that will make Smoove Stop or send him to the bench!

[coachx]

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Acie and Chill

for

Calderon and Kapono

We need 3-point shooting.

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Colangello values 3 point shooters. Evident in him over paying for Kapano.

I would not deal with Colangelo. He is to smart and would rip BK off.

I want to see more then 6 games from Law before you give him the boot....Don't ya' think ?

[AnakinJoe]

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To be fair to Smoove I think he takes all those long range jumpers because no one else in the starting lineup besides Joe will shoot the 3.

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Huh? Is there a new rule that says a team must take a minimum number of 3s in order to win a game?

Last night, he mostly stayed away from wild 3s. Instead, he tried to drive the ball. But against another long and athletic player like Tyrus (or Deng), he wasn't able to beat them off the dribble or simply leap over them. Every shot was contested and thus, a horrific shooting night. In cases like that, he needs to pass up shots and recognize that maybe another teammates has a better match-up.

Tonight, he should play better because he can beat Yi or Villanueva off the dribble and the same Friday evening against West and the Hornets.

[TroyMcClure]

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Seriously, we are better off exercising good shot selection and never shooting a single 3 than we are shooting perimeter shots for the sake of shooting 3s.

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This is the NBA, man. I guess in theory you could not shoot any long jumpers and win a game or two. No way could you excel in a season though, imo. And that's for any team. Great inside play leads to open outside shots. The length of the average defender at the NBA level is absurd, as well. You almost have to be back to a certain point just to stretch the defense. When talking about a team like ours, what you've suggested is just not in any way practical. We have no inside offensive presence. We have to hit jumpers. It seems like almost every game we win is because Joe or Lue have hit some 3's. We need Marvin to get some range or Smoove to get some game, because it ain't coming from anywhere else.

[Johnnybravo4]

Most of the time it isn't smooves fault. when we clear the lane for JJ to run off of screens, Smoove is moved to the perimeter. We then pass the ball to him with 3 sec left on the clock and say "do something" and he is forced to shoot a long 3. This also happens when JJ drives and is in trouble and throws an out pass to Smoove..usually he is wide open..so should Smoove just pass up the shot and try a fruitless drive from the 3 point line all the way to the hole? Our offense creates bad shots, Steve Nash wouldn't be able to solve our problems in that regard.

[AtLaS]

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Marvin just doesn't have the range. He never will, imo.

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I know I have been a big Marvin basher in the past, but I definitely think he can add three point range. He already has a good shot out to 20 feet and is only 21, I definitely see him adding that in the future. He'll never be a Ray Allen, but I think he'll definitely add it too his arsenal.

I honestly don't see why he doesn't take them every ONCE in a while now. He will take the shot from one step in front of the line and hit it all the time, but he won't take a three? WTF. Maybe he just isn't confident with it.

[BeeSwatter]

You got to remember though, There is a reason that Smoove is standing at the three point line with absolutely no one on him. Other teams want him to shoot that shot!

[troubleman]

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You got to remember though, There is a reason that Smoove is standing at the three point line with absolutely no one on him. Other teams want him to shoot that shot!

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Yeah, but by offensive design he should not be there. I can see it happening occasionally, but not darn near every possession. Woody needs to go, unless he can figure out an offense that plays to the strength of each individual.

[BeeSwatter]

I agree with you there, I wonder if it is by design or if he just "floats" his way to the open spot.

Tell me this I wonder on average how many times a game we actually post anyone up. I am not talking about JJ backing someone down either. I am talking about someone going to the block and spreading out and us attempting to get the ball to them.

[AHF]

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Seriously, we are better off exercising good shot selection and never shooting a single 3 than we are shooting perimeter shots for the sake of shooting 3s.

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This is the NBA, man. I guess in theory you could not shoot any long jumpers and win a game or two. No way could you excel in a season though, imo. And that's for any team. Great inside play leads to open outside shots. The length of the average defender at the NBA level is absurd, as well. You almost have to be back to a certain point just to stretch the defense. When talking about a team like ours, what you've suggested is just not in any way practical. We have no inside offensive presence. We have to hit jumpers. It seems like almost every game we win is because Joe or Lue have hit some 3's. We need Marvin to get some range or Smoove to get some game, because it ain't coming from anywhere else.

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I am not suggesting that we don't shoot 3's. I am suggesting we should only shoot good 3's. On the whole, JJ shooting 3's, Lue shooting 3's, Salim shooting 3's, Chill shooting open 3's, etc. are all good perimeter shots. I have no problem with that.

I agree that you need to be able to spread the floor to succeed in the NBA. But shooting 3's for the sake of shooting 3's DOESN'T stretch the floor. Teams watch Josh Smith shoot a 3 and laugh. They say "thank you sir, may I have another." It doesn't open the floor for other people in the slightest. It gives them exactly what they want - a poor perimeter shooter taking low % perimeter shots and taking himself out of position to impact the game with his rebounding and put-back ability. They will just continue to pack it in and stifle everyone else and gladly accept Smith taking 3's until he sticks seveal of them in row or stops taking them.

There is no justification for Smith taking those 3's - certainly no justification for him being in position to take them by design. He should be near the basket (even if on the weakside) when JJ is taking the ball into the lane. If Smith's man goes to double JJ, I will take my chances with an unmarked Josh Smith under the basket rather than out on the perimeter even if it is a significantly tougher pass to get it to him inside (although his hops give some room for error).

[Sothron]

In our kind of offense with ZERO attempts at low post scoring you absolutely need a valid three point threat on offense. Actually you need more than one. Our offense is predicated on movement, screens and rolls. That allows a defense to contract and makes it harder to execute on offense if you don't have someone that can sit on the arc and make teams pay for it. We don't have any starters like that except Joe and he's the guy we are usually doing the screens *for* which takes him out of the equation.

Ideally we should have Marvin on the other side of Joe almost all the time and let Marvin kill from three point land or move in for a jumper (or attack weakside defense by going straight to the rim) but he won't/can't do that.

[BeeSwatter]

The thing is I thought Horford was supposed to be our low post threat? That is what you read but yet he gets absolutely no back to the basket touches in the low post. No one does. Even last night Smitty was calling for us to post up Duhon and I don't think we have a set where we can. I don't see how you can have an NBA offense and never even attempt to post up anyone.

Look back Flip Saunders exploited a mis match at the end of the Pistons game and put Jarvis Hayes in the post against Lue for how many straight possessions? I don't know if Josh Smith has a back to the basket game or not, I have never seen him attempt to post up. I wonder if Shaq was on this team would he be setting up at the free throw line facing the basket?

[Sothron]

I blame Woody for zero attempts to establish a low post game. Every single NBA champ has had at least one guy that could go into the post and get some points/trips to the foul line. Horford CAN score in the post but he's never given a chance.

[BeeSwatter]

That is one thing that I absolutely blame Woody for. I mean when our offense is struggling that is exactly where we should go straight into the post. We get an advantage there and then the double teams have to start coming and that opens everything up on the perimeter. I don't care who it is, Horford, ZaZa, JJ, Smoove, somebody needs to goto the post. I won't put lack of effort on Woodson but this is my biggest fault with the offense. We look like all we do is come down and run the pick and roll. Chicago hit us with all kinds of things on offense last night. It is almost like we go out and try to out athletic everyone.

[AnnArborHawk]

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Very true. That's Woody's fault, imo.

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To be more specific, it's Woody's fault that our offense has Horford on the high post setting screens for 4 guys who stand around outside the 3-point line.

The fact that Josh actually takes the shot is his fault. Defenders know Josh can't make a 3 and don't defend him out there, he just can't discipline himself to lay off of an open shot.

In fact, I have to believe that part of the reason we can't get much of a low post game going is due to the fact that Smith (whether through coaching or otherwise), is hanging out beyond the 3-point line where he doesn't need to be defended. That allows 2 defenders to hang out in the paint, b/c they'll give Josh that 3 all day.

Marvin's 18-21 foot range keeps the defense honest on him, even outside the 3-point line. You have to play Joe out there. Any defense will man up our PG at the top of the key. Really the only guys that don't get respected out there are Smoove and Horford. Still, our offense has Smoove standing out there waiting for an open shot and Horford on the high post setting screens. With their defenders able to stick close to the paint, it's no wonder we have a hard time getting anyone into the paint.

And Woody's idea of a low-post game being to post up AJ on a smaller PG with our forwards and centers out on the perimeter is a joke. The Hawks are probably the easiest team in the league to defend.