Being mediocre sucks!

[HawkItus]

I'm sitting here watching the trade chatter, looking at the standings and shaking my head.

We've done it again. The Hawks have reached mediocre ville and we don't have any chance of getting much better.

Remember the Nique days? We could win 50, but couldn't get past the 2nd round because 3 teams were clearly better than us.

Remember the Mookie/Smitty/Dikembe days? We could win 45-50 games, but couldn't get past the 2nd round because 3 teams were clearly better than us.

See our situation today? We can win 50 games probably for the next 5 years, but we can't win the conference because 3 teams are clearly better than us.

Being average sucks and I hate knowing that is where we reside for the near future.

[NJHAWK]

I dont think so. We are still very young and our players can still improve. Also if Sund plays his cards right there are alot of assets to make a major move in the offseason to improve. The Mookie teams had very little flexibilty and couldnt really do much to add pieces after we got Deke. We could never get another solid player and could never get much of a bench because of Babcocks terrible drafting.

[HawkItus]

I dont think so. We are still very young and our players can still improve. Also if Sund plays his cards right there are alot of assets to make a major move in the offseason to improve. The Mookie teams had very little flexibilty and couldnt really do much to add pieces after we got Deke. We could never get another solid player and could never get much of a bench because of Babcocks terrible drafting.

We have this summer and that's pretty much it. If we decide t re-up Bibby and Marvin, or just one of them. That's pretty much it.

[Admin]

I'm sitting here watching the trade chatter, looking at the standings and shaking my head.

We've done it again. The Hawks have reached mediocre ville and we don't have any chance of getting much better.

Remember the Nique days? We could win 50, but couldn't get past the 2nd round because 3 teams were clearly better than us.

Remember the Mookie/Smitty/Dikembe days? We could win 45-50 games, but couldn't get past the 2nd round because 3 teams were clearly better than us.

See our situation today? We can win 50 games probably for the next 5 years, but we can't win the conference because 3 teams are clearly better than us.

Being average sucks and I hate knowing that is where we reside for the near future.

Was this meant to be sarcastic? :doh:

We're what the 5th youngest team in the NBA? As opposed to those other teams who were mostly on the downside of their careers. We still have draft picks, trades, FA dollars, etc. to improve this team and that's not even considering natural progression among our youth and possibly upgrading the coach at some point.

And as to being average, we're already better than average since we're 4th out of 15 eastern conference teams which puts us in the upper quarter and well above average.

[HawkItus]

Was this meant to be sarcastic? :doh:

We're what the 5th youngest team in the NBA? As opposed to those other teams who were mostly on the downside of their careers. We still have draft picks, trades, FA dollars, etc. to improve this team and that's not even considering natural progression among our youth and possibly upgrading the coach at some point.

And as to being average, we're already better than average since we're 4th out of 15 eastern conference teams which puts us in the upper quarter and well above average.

I don't see it Dolf. Our young guys save for Acie and Horf aren't really young guys. By their 4th year, stars are stars. We keep hoping Smith will make that jump. But, come on this is year 5. It's about time for him to do it. Marvin? He is getting better, but he isn't a franchise guy. He has a chance I suppose to upgrade still. But, I don't see it with his mentality.

[Admin]

I don't see it Dolf. Our young guys save for Acie and Horf aren't really young guys. By their 4th year, stars are stars. We keep hoping Smith will make that jump. But, come on this is year 5. It's about time for him to do it. Marvin? He is getting better, but he isn't a franchise guy. He has a chance I suppose to upgrade still. But, I don't see it with his mentality.

If the young guys weren't 21-23 years old then yes I'd agree but these guys (especially Marvin!) are still getting used to their bodies and have some growing up to do mentally as well.

None of our players are likely to ever be a superstar (Joe is the closest but I don't think that he will make it) but for the most part they are all improving slightly each year and collectively it means we improve quite a bit each year. How else do you explain what should be a 10 game improvement this year over last year with only minor changes?

Let's wait until we hit our peak before we start worrying about whether or not we can win a championship.

[AtLaS]

2 years ago, the Lakers were stuck in mediocrity and hardly had any assets, and Kobe wanted out. All of a sudden Bynum emerged and they got Gasol for cheap. Now they are contenders.

Great players become available and often can be had for much less than they are worth. Bosh and Amare are ones out there now. There will always be a supply of stars to trade for.

[Packfill]

If the young guys weren't 21-23 years old then yes I'd agree but these guys (especially Marvin!) are still getting used to their bodies and have some growing up to do mentally as well.

None of our players are likely to ever be a superstar (Joe is the closest but I don't think that he will make it) but for the most part they are all improving slightly each year and collectively it means we improve quite a bit each year. How else do you explain what should be a 10 game improvement this year over last year with only minor changes?

Let's wait until we hit our peak before we start worrying about whether or not we can win a championship.

The real questions is since it will be at least two years before the frontcourt begins to max out, does it make sense to bring Bibby back knowing that he will be on the downside when the frontcourt is finally ready?

Another thing to think about is whether it is the backcourt that is driving the teams success, and if so, does it make sense to part with one of the young front court players in exchange for a veteran (the idea being two young guys is o.k., but another vet might help maximize results in the here and now) and go into "win now" mode.

My biggest fear going forward is that Brook Lopez keeps developing and the Nets bring in LeBron to team with Lopez and Devin Harris and surround them with shooters (power forwars with range like Anderson and Yi then make sense) and hustle guys. That could lock up the east for a while.

[coachx]

See our situation today? We can win 50 games probably for the next 5 years, but we can't win the conference because 3 teams are clearly better than us.

Being average sucks and I hate knowing that is where we reside for the near future.

Boston will not be getting any better any time soon. Father time is going to hit the big 3 all at the same time. that could very well be next year or even in playoff battles this year.

The Magic are likely to loose Turkelough or over bid to keep him.

The Cavs are a mystery. Is Lebron willing to spend the entire prime of his career in Cleveland ?

The teams right behind us do not have the brightest of futures:

1. Detroit - Then need a serious roster over haul. AI and Sheed will be gone next year. Rip and Prince will just be a year older and no better then they are now.

2. Miami - that is one messed up roster. J. O'Neil got hurt and left the game in his first game with the Heat. Who is surprised by that ?

3. Philly - Miller will be a FA at 32 next year. He is their engine that makes them any good. Without him they are nothing. They just signed Brand, who will be 20 next season and seems to be damaged good. An aging 6'8'' post player is now what the center piece of any franchise should be built around.........Granted Iggy and Young are very talented and young but they are wing players which are a dime a dozen.

As of right now the Hawks have a very bright future in the East. A lot can happen this off season but Atlanta has more flexibility then most teams this off season:

1. Rights to Chills to sign him or trade his rights

2. RFA rights to match any deal Marvin gets or do a sign and trade (like the JJ deal)

3. Bibby's $15 mill is coming off the books

4. ZaZa has $4 mill coming off the books

5. Flip is falling off the books.

6. We still have our 1st and 2nd round picks.

7. Smith BYC status will fall off

8. Speedy's expiring deal will finally be movable

That is alot of ammunition right there to make moves if Sund so chooses.

Plus FA will be signing for less money then in years past with the salary cap and luxury tax threshold being lowered. That means no teams will be breaking the bank to go after Bibby, Marvin, ZaZa, or Flip. Hopefully we can keep them all for less aggregate money then we paid them as a group last year.

I am really interested in seeing if our 1st with the rights to Chillz is worth anything at all, especially when you couple it with Speedy's salary falling off the books. If nothing else the rights to Chillz will be a sweet pot sweetner in a deal IF Chillz decides he wants back in the good ole' USA.

I do not think it would suprise anyone if Sund gets creative and tries to round out this roster to be a better team with his own finger print on it this off season.

[AtLaS]

The real questions is since it will be at least two years before the frontcourt begins to max out, does it make sense to bring Bibby back knowing that he will be on the downside when the frontcourt is finally ready?

Another thing to think about is whether it is the backcourt that is driving the teams success, and if so, does it make sense to part with one of the young front court players in exchange for a veteran (the idea being two young guys is o.k., but another vet might help maximize results in the here and now) and go into "win now" mode.

My biggest fear going forward is that Brook Lopez keeps developing and the Nets bring in LeBron to team with Lopez and Devin Harris and surround them with shooters (power forwars with range like Anderson and Yi then make sense) and hustle guys. That could lock up the east for a while.

LeBron ain't going to the Nets. It's the second smallest market in the NBA and they aren't moving to Brooklyn anytime soon. Yeah, Jay-Z is the owner, but it's just not going to happen.

[Plainview1981]

If the young guys weren't 21-23 years old then yes I'd agree but these guys (especially Marvin!) are still getting used to their bodies and have some growing up to do mentally as well.

None of our players are likely to ever be a superstar (Joe is the closest but I don't think that he will make it) but for the most part they are all improving slightly each year and collectively it means we improve quite a bit each year. How else do you explain what should be a 10 game improvement this year over last year with only minor changes?

Let's wait until we hit our peak before we start worrying about whether or not we can win a championship.

Marvin isn't that good.

[HawkItus]

Boston will not be getting any better any time soon. Father time is going to hit the big 3 all at the same time. that could very well be next year or even in playoff battles this year.

The Magic are likely to loose Turkelough or over bid to keep him.

The Cavs are a mystery. Is Lebron willing to spend the entire prime of his career in Cleveland ?

The teams right behind us do not have the brightest of futures:

1. Detroit - Then need a serious roster over haul. AI and Sheed will be gone next year. Rip and Prince will just be a year older and no better then they are now.

2. Miami - that is one messed up roster. J. O'Neil got hurt and left the game in his first game with the Heat. Who is surprised by that ?

3. Philly - Miller will be a FA at 32 next year. He is their engine that makes them any good. Without him they are nothing. They just signed Brand, who will be 20 next season and seems to be damaged good. An aging 6'8'' post player is now what the center piece of any franchise should be built around.........Granted Iggy and Young are very talented and young but they are wing players which are a dime a dozen.

As of right now the Hawks have a very bright future in the East. A lot can happen this off season but Atlanta has more flexibility then most teams this off season:

1. Rights to Chills to sign him or trade his rights

2. RFA rights to match any deal Marvin gets or do a sign and trade (like the JJ deal)

3. Bibby's $15 mill is coming off the books

4. ZaZa has $4 mill coming off the books

5. Flip is falling off the books.

6. We still have our 1st and 2nd round picks.

7. Smith BYC status will fall off

8. Speedy's expiring deal will finally be movable

That is alot of ammunition right there to make moves if Sund so chooses.

Plus FA will be signing for less money then in years past with the salary cap and luxury tax threshold being lowered. That means no teams will be breaking the bank to go after Bibby, Marvin, ZaZa, or Flip. Hopefully we can keep them all for less aggregate money then we paid them as a group last year.

I am really interested in seeing if our 1st with the rights to Chillz is worth anything at all, especially when you couple it with Speedy's salary falling off the books. If nothing else the rights to Chillz will be a sweet pot sweetner in a deal IF Chillz decides he wants back in the good ole' USA.

I do not think it would suprise anyone if Sund gets creative and tries to round out this roster to be a better team with his own finger print on it this off season.

Okay, spelled out like this it does look a lot better. But, let me kick a little dirt on the blanket.

-Who says with the new economic atmosphere that Smoove's deal doesn't look like an albatross this summer?

-Most guys who are going to be available will have pretty bad deals

-Ownership might become a seller if we don't win big soon.

I don't know. I see your points and can see a glass half full perspective. But, I'm also adding a little bit of the Hawks/Atlanta sports karma here. When has anything ever worked out perfectly for an Atlanta team?

[exodus]

I am really interested in seeing if our 1st with the rights to Chillz is worth anything at all, especially when you couple it with Speedy's salary falling off the books. If nothing else the rights to Chillz will be a sweet pot sweetner in a deal IF Chillz decides he wants back in the good ole' USA.

Childress' rights can't be traded. The only way we can trade him in a SNT deal.

[OGRat]

Childress' rights can't be traded. The only way we can trade him in a SNT deal.

The rights to David Anderson maybe worth something?

[exodus]

The rights to David Anderson maybe worth something?

They give the Hawks the right to sign him. Given how badly we need more size off the bench i hope they do it.

But no his rights can't be traded.

[Hatertots]

Okay, spelled out like this it does look a lot better. But, let me kick a little dirt on the blanket.

-Who says with the new economic atmosphere that Smoove's deal doesn't look like an albatross this summer?

-Most guys who are going to be available will have pretty bad deals

-Ownership might become a seller if we don't win big soon.

I don't know. I see your points and can see a glass half full perspective. But, I'm also adding a little bit of the Hawks/Atlanta sports karma here. When has anything ever worked out perfectly for an Atlanta team?

Matt Ryan with the 3rd pick worked out pretty good.

[HawkItus]

Matt Ryan with the 3rd pick worked out pretty good.

If you've followed atlanta sports for a while you should better than to jinx us like that.

[AHF]

But, I'm also adding a little bit of the Hawks/Atlanta sports karma here. When has anything ever worked out perfectly for an Atlanta team?

How about the signings of Terry Pendleton, Greg Maddux and Fred McGriff?

[Hawk88]

Yeps, We had the No. 2, No. 3, and two No. 6 pics and didn't come out of them with a star. Good players but no star.

Should have put some kind of package together to get Chris Bosh in my opinion.

Hawk88

[HawkItus]

How about the signings of Terry Pendleton, Greg Maddux and Fred McGriff?

haha. I'll give you McGriff, but you do remember the stadium damn near burned down his first game right