Marvin Williams

[exodus]

Marvin represents everything wrong with our team. A guy who has all the potential in the world and plays randomly. Think about it... We have Marvin and Smoove.... both could be world beaters. Both are sometimy random players.

Moreover, You guys protect these guys as if they are rare commodities. I guarantee you, if Marvin played for Toronto right now, none of you would be crying for him saying we need to try to trade for this guy!! There may be one of you who would be the biggest UNC fan on the board who might say, that's guy is good... but for the most part, you would treat Marvin like we treat McCants.

I made that same argument about Childress last year. You didn't care much for it then. Last year we needed perimeter shooting which Childress doesn't bring but that didn't stop your save childress crusade.

Funny that you said for years that Marvin isn't that talented. Now you are saying he could be a world beater?

[Diesel]

Marvin represents everything wrong with our team? Yeah, we sure don't want guys who work hard in the off season to improve their biggest weaknesses (3 pt shooting and physical strength). We definitely don't want guys who listen to their coaches. We don't want guys with no ego who put the team first ahead of their own personal glory. We don't want guys who represent the team well both on and off the court. We certainly don't want guys like that.

Let's go get us a bunch of guys who come back with the same weaknesses every year, who blame the coaches for all of their shortcomings, who want to be the star without putting in the work and who get into trouble off the court. Yeah, those are the kinds of guys we want.

Trace, Trace, Trace... You don't know contract year improvements when you see them huh? I agree that Marvin has improved his three point shooting, but a lot of that is due to Mark Price being with the team - not some off season regimen. Marvin still doesn't put fourth the effort to be more aggressive unless he's playing in a must perform atmosphere. Uhm, Bibby and Josh are sick and Joe's playing badly... "I must perform". That should be something that is natural for him. I'll spot him a good game versus the Knicks because historically, he has always played well against the Knicks. BUt what after that?? Do you believe he will show up? Prolly not. Now.. somebody on this board wouldn't call him not showing up inconsistent... as long as he can get 6 rebounds. That's pooh trace. Pure Pooh.

[ATLSmith]

Marvin is putting up some good nimbers this year and his nimbers will only improve as he matures as a player and finds his place in the Woody system. Hooray for good nimbers.

[mrhonline]

Marvin is putting up some good nimbers this year and his nimbers will only improve as he matures as a player and finds his place in the Woody system. Hooray for good nimbers.

Three cheers for good nimbers!

[Diesel]

I made that same argument about Childress last year. You didn't care much for it then. Last year we needed perimeter shooting which Childress doesn't bring but that didn't stop your save childress crusade.

Funny that you said for years that Marvin isn't that talented. Now you are saying he could be a world beater?

Seeing that your explanation of Marvin is always Childress (who is gone by the way). I will say this.. Childress always knew his role on both sides of the ball and he played within that. He knew that he wasn't a superstar... so he did "dirty work". What is Marvin's role and does he play it? Everyday on this board, Marvin's role changes. The reason being is because everybody is always looking for a different excuse for Marvin.

Today, Marvin = "the future".

In a week, Marvin = " a good defensive player in the mold of Battier".

By Playoff time, Marvin = " a average Sf".

When he goes into his slump, as he always does (around March).. .I want you to watch the changing dynamic of who people say that Marvin is. When he's playing like a scared child, I want you to see how the board refers to him then... My guess is standout defensive player with defensive stats that can't be quantified.

[exodus]

Three cheers for good nimbers!

LOL @ his typo hat trick.

For some reason that old Red Stripe commercial popped into my head.

"Red Stripe, it's beer. Hooorraaaay beeeer."

[exodus]

Seeing that your explanation of Marvin is always Childress (who is gone by the way). I will say this.. Childress always knew his role on both sides of the ball and he played within that. He knew that he wasn't a superstar... so he did "dirty work". What is Marvin's role and does he play it? Everyday on this board, Marvin's role changes. The reason being is because everybody is always looking for a different excuse for Marvin.

Where are all these Marvin excuses? I must have missed them.

As far as Childress "playing his role" what that really means is that he wasn't capable of putting up big numbers when other guys are out and the team needed him to score.

[Diesel]

Marvin is putting up some good nimbers this year and his nimbers will only improve as he matures as a player and finds his place in the Woody system. Hooray for good nimbers.

We say this every year.

[Diesel]

Where are all these Marvin excuses? I must have missed them.

As far as Childress "playing his role" what that really means is that he wasn't capable of putting up big numbers when other guys are out and the team needed him to score.

Neither is Horford or Smoove... The only guys capable of imposing their will on another team and scoring big numbers is JJ and sometimes Bibby. As a matter of fact, if you realized how rare it is that a player can do what you ask... you wouldn't have even mentioned it.

[macdaddy]

I'm glad Marvin is doing well but lets not go crazy. Who cares if he's 'only' 22. How old is Lebron. Why does Marvin doing well have to mean that Smoove needs to be traded? I've seen some crazy stuff on this board but this thread is weird man. My concern is who our PRESENT is and not our FUTURE. Jason Terry and Demarr Johnson were once our future.

[exodus]

Neither is Horford or Smoove... The only guys capable of imposing their will on another team and scoring big numbers is JJ and sometimes Bibby. As a matter of fact, if you realized how rare it is that a player can do what you ask... you wouldn't have even mentioned it.

What did Marvin do when JJ was out? What did he do when Smith and Bibby were out? What did he do last night?

[tonegully]

I'm glad Marvin is doing well but lets not go crazy. Who cares if he's 'only' 22. How old is Lebron. Why does Marvin doing well have to mean that Smoove needs to be traded? I've seen some crazy stuff on this board but this thread is weird man. My concern is who our PRESENT is and not our FUTURE. Jason Terry and Demarr Johnson were once our future.

Lebron is 24 years old. He will be 25 this year. I dont want Smoove to be traded. Marvin is going to be a star. I keep saying his age because he has 4 NBA seasons under his belt and if you are watching the Hawk games and cant tell Marvin is a star in the making you must be blind.

[Traceman]

Trace, Trace, Trace... You don't know contract year improvements when you see them huh? I agree that Marvin has improved his three point shooting, but a lot of that is due to Mark Price being with the team - not some off season regimen. Marvin still doesn't put fourth the effort to be more aggressive unless he's playing in a must perform atmosphere. Uhm, Bibby and Josh are sick and Joe's playing badly... "I must perform". That should be something that is natural for him. I'll spot him a good game versus the Knicks because historically, he has always played well against the Knicks. BUt what after that?? Do you believe he will show up? Prolly not. Now.. somebody on this board wouldn't call him not showing up inconsistent... as long as he can get 6 rebounds. That's pooh trace. Pure Pooh.

So Mark Price just showed up and improved Marvin's 3 pt shooting but he made Smoove's foul shooting worse? I'm sure Price helps Marvin, but it is obvious that he spent a good deal of time working on his 3 pt shot in the off season.

As for Marvin being aggressive on offense, I don't think it has ever been about effort but rather he has simply deferred too much to players like JJ, Smoove and Bibby at times. Much like Al, he is simply being a guy who wants to fit in and play his role on the team. What he needs to realize is that the team is better when he is aggressively looking for his shot because it open things up for others.

You call his improvement a contract year performance but I think he is simply getting better as he gets more mature. That was always the plan with him. All the skills that people saw that made people think he had so much potential are starting to show. The shooting, the ballhandling, the rebounding, the athleticism and the D are all terrific for a guy his size. The great thing is that he is still only 22 and he is not as consistently good as he is going to be. He is going to be much better going forward as he gets naturally stronger and develops more go to moves.

There is no doubt that Marvin will have bad stretches going forward as JJ, Smoove, Bibby, Al and Flip have all gone through bad stretches this year but I think the bad stretches are going to be fewer and farther between for Marvin because he is simply a better player than he was last year. You can let your hate make you unable to appreciate his game but the kid is playing some dang good ball right now and I for one am LOVING it!

[gsuteke]

I'm glad Marvin is doing well but lets not go crazy. Who cares if he's 'only' 22. How old is Lebron. Why does Marvin doing well have to mean that Smoove needs to be traded? I've seen some crazy stuff on this board but this thread is weird man. My concern is who our PRESENT is and not our FUTURE. Jason Terry and Demarr Johnson were once our future.

You're comparing Marvin to the best player of his generation. I don't think that's a fair comparison.

[Traceman]

I'm glad Marvin is doing well but lets not go crazy. Who cares if he's 'only' 22. How old is Lebron. Why does Marvin doing well have to mean that Smoove needs to be traded? I've seen some crazy stuff on this board but this thread is weird man. My concern is who our PRESENT is and not our FUTURE. Jason Terry and Demarr Johnson were once our future.

Marvin doing well should have nothing to do with Smoove in my opinion. I think their skill sets compliment each other well and they will compliment each other even more as both guys get stronger and more mature. The only way I see it possibly mattering is if we could get an All Star caliber YOUNG big man for Smoove like Bosh or Amare (I would obviously trade Marvin for those guys too). I wouldn't trade Smoove for the likes of Dalembert, Tyson Chandler or Kaman no matter how good Marvin gets.

[mrhonline]

Marvin doing well should have nothing to do with Smoove in my opinion.

Mine either, and I get tired of this 'zero sum' argument when it comes to Hawks' players. It is perfectly reasonable to like them all.

Except Speedy, of course. That's not reasonable.

[AtLaS]

Marvin is going to be a star. I keep saying his age because he has 4 NBA seasons under his belt and if you are watching the Hawk games and cant tell Marvin is a star in the making you must be blind.

Hold it, now. Marvin has improved but lets wait before we anoint him a "star" in the making.

[Diesel]

So Mark Price just showed up and improved Marvin's 3 pt shooting but he made Smoove's foul shooting worse? I'm sure Price helps Marvin, but it is obvious that he spent a good deal of time working on his 3 pt shot in the off season.

As for Marvin being aggressive on offense, I don't think it has ever been about effort but rather he has simply deferred too much to players like JJ, Smoove and Bibby at times. Much like Al, he is simply being a guy who wants to fit in and play his role on the team. What he needs to realize is that the team is better when he is aggressively looking for his shot because it open things up for others.

You call his improvement a contract year performance but I think he is simply getting better as he gets more mature. That was always the plan with him. All the skills that people saw that made people think he had so much potential are starting to show. The shooting, the ballhandling, the rebounding, the athleticism and the D are all terrific for a guy his size. The great thing is that he is still only 22 and he is not as consistently good as he is going to be. He is going to be much better going forward as he gets naturally stronger and develops more go to moves.

There is no doubt that Marvin will have bad stretches going forward as JJ, Smoove, Bibby, Al and Flip have all gone through bad stretches this year but I think the bad stretches are going to be fewer and farther between for Marvin because he is simply a better player than he was last year. You can let your hate make you unable to appreciate his game but the kid is playing some dang good ball right now and I for one am LOVING it!

Aggression is an attribute that doesn't change much. I think you will see the shrinking violet return in a few games. I'm just really shocked by how much love Marvin gets versus any of our other players.

Horf puts up 22/20 and he gets a couple of mentions... But Marvin scores 30 and all the sudden, he's the future??

This is not an either or but I believe that Marvin fans overcompensate because of the success of CP3...

[EazyRoc]

More of the propaganda. Marvin Williams has been calling for the ball aggressively for the past month no matter who was guarding him. There's only so many shots to go around. He's finally got the confidence he needed to be aggressive and demand the ball from his teammates. You watch the Hawks games, so you should have seen this already. You can also attribute Marvin's newfound attitude with the fact that it's playoff season now, and he, like Horford, don't want to be sitting on the couch to watch it.

[tonegully]

Hold it, now. Marvin has improved but lets wait before we anoint him a "star" in the making.

Dude Marv is going to be a star. He may not be Lebron James(even though he can play some hella defense on him) but he is going to be a force if we(hawks) ever decide to use him and give him the ball.