what , are you scared to talk about Al punk Horford

[exodus]

So if Josh were to play out of position at center like Horford does, going up against bigger and stronger guys all season, would Josh be a two time all star? I doubt it. Let the apologists now begin their enlightening rants, just like Josh after a no foul call.

Noah is not bigger or stronger than Horford. He is just playing with heart and effort while Horford is playing like a dog with his tail between his legs.

If the competition at the 4 was as weak as the cometition at the 5 they Smith would certainly be an All-Star. This is a historically bad era for centers.

[Eddielives]

Noah is not bigger or stronger than Horford. He is just playing with heart and effort while Horford is playing like a dog with his tail between his legs.

If the competition at the 4 was as weak as the cometition at the 5 they Smith would certainly be an All-Star. This is a historically bad era for centers.

There has never been an era where there has been a plethora of great centers. Every generation, there might be 1 or 2 to shine with a number of average guys. So there is really no difference now than in previous eras. The point is that Horford is a undersized center playing out of position against stronger and bigger guys most nights but still puts up strong numbers and was one of the best in fg% this past year thus he's an all-star as recognized by his peers and coaches around the league. So he's cold shooting right now and being played well by Noah. That definitely sucks and we need better out of him to win this series. But let's not forget to look at the big picture. All I'm seeing from this board recently is a divide amongst Al and Josh supporters. Simply finding reasons to criticize Al in retaliation for the Josh Smith comments only makes the Josh apologists look like Josh looks on the court....like crybabies. Listen to all the analysts around the league when Josh is brought up. You hear words like enigma, headcase, terrible shot selection, problems with coach, etc. Nothing more really needs to be proven on this Al vs. Josh debate. Do you want the guy who whines, plays out of control too often, doesn't play towards his strengths or do you want the guy who is a more mature person/player, plays within his skillset, shoots a fg% that is among the league's best, doesn't whine and take himself out of plays to complain to refs? The choice is obvious to me. I can forgive Al for falling off his production for a few games. I can't continue to forgive Josh for being a head case for most of the season.

[exodus]

There has never been an era where there has been a plethora of great centers. Every generation, there might be 1 or 2 to shine with a number of average guys. So there is really no difference now than in previous eras.

Who was Al's competition other than Howard? Noah was hurt. Bargnani and Lopez can't rebound for crap. Bogut can't shoot a lick after his elbow got destroyed. They listed Amare as a forward even though he started most of his games at center. His competition was a joke.

There is no Ewing, Zo or Deke to compete against and those guys were secondary stars compared to Shaq, Dream and Drob.

Saying there is no difference between this era and other eras is ridiculous.

Edited May 8, 2011 by exodus

[niremetal]

Who was Al's competition other than Howard? Noah was hurt. Bargnani and Lopez can't rebound for crap. Bogut can't shoot a lick after his elbow got destroyed. They listed Amare as a forward even though he started most of his games at center. His competition was a joke.

There is no Ewing, Zo or Deke to compete against and those guys were secondary stars compared to Shaq, Dream and Drob.

Saying there is no difference between this era and other eras is ridiculous.

The game is different today than it was back in the 80's and 90's. Frontcourt players are faster, guards are stronger, the restricted zone was introduced and the changes in rules governing defenses (zones allowed + defensive 3 second rules), frontcourt players are faster, refs are more strict about offensive 3-second calls than they were back in the 90's (when Shaq and Hakeem were allowed to camp out in the lane without penalty), and did I mention that frontcourt players are faster? Teams collapse so quickly when a player gets the ball in the post that there's no team to do 3 or 4 pump fakes without getting stripped like McHale and Dream could do.

There are differences, but it's not a matter of "better" or "worse." Comparing players and teams across eras is futile.

Edited May 8, 2011 by niremetal

[pimp]

The game is different today than it was back in the 80's and 90's. Frontcourt players are faster, guards are stronger, the restricted zone was introduced and the changes in rules governing defenses (zones allowed + defensive 3 second rules), frontcourt players are faster, refs are more strict about offensive 3-second calls than they were back in the 90's (when Shaq and Hakeem were allowed to camp out in the lane without penalty), and did I mention that frontcourt players are faster? Teams collapse so quickly when a player gets the ball in the post that there's no team to do 3 or 4 pump fakes without getting stripped like McHale and Dream could do.

There are differences, but it's not a matter of "better" or "worse." Comparing players and teams across eras is futile.

All those rule changes have made the game worse IMO

They need to bring back all the old rules.

They can start by bringing back hand checking , and dumping

that bent elbow/ forearm crap.

[HawksFan87]

There has never been an era where there has been a plethora of great centers. Every generation, there might be 1 or 2 to shine with a number of average guys. So there is really no difference now than in previous eras. The point is that Horford is a undersized center playing out of position against stronger and bigger guys most nights but still puts up strong numbers and was one of the best in fg% this past year thus he's an all-star as recognized by his peers and coaches around the league. So he's cold shooting right now and being played well by Noah. That definitely sucks and we need better out of him to win this series. But let's not forget to look at the big picture. All I'm seeing from this board recently is a divide amongst Al and Josh supporters. Simply finding reasons to criticize Al in retaliation for the Josh Smith comments only makes the Josh apologists look like Josh looks on the court....like crybabies. Listen to all the analysts around the league when Josh is brought up. You hear words like enigma, headcase, terrible shot selection, problems with coach, etc. Nothing more really needs to be proven on this Al vs. Josh debate. Do you want the guy who whines, plays out of control too often, doesn't play towards his strengths or do you want the guy who is a more mature person/player, plays within his skillset, shoots a fg% that is among the league's best, doesn't whine and take himself out of plays to complain to refs? The choice is obvious to me. I can forgive Al for falling off his production for a few games. I can't continue to forgive Josh for being a head case for most of the season.

Tito is that u ???

[exodus]

The game is different today than it was back in the 80's and 90's. Frontcourt players are faster, guards are stronger, the restricted zone was introduced and the changes in rules governing defenses (zones allowed + defensive 3 second rules), frontcourt players are faster, refs are more strict about offensive 3-second calls than they were back in the 90's (when Shaq and Hakeem were allowed to camp out in the lane without penalty), and did I mention that frontcourt players are faster? Teams collapse so quickly when a player gets the ball in the post that there's no team to do 3 or 4 pump fakes without getting stripped like McHale and Dream could do.

There are differences, but it's not a matter of "better" or "worse." Comparing players and teams across eras is futile.

Nonsense. Today's centers are crap compared to 15 years ago. DRob and Dream were as fast as Horford easily. They would clown the centers of today. DRob was probably the fastest 7 footer in NBA history.

Is Bogut fast? How about Bargnani? Lopez? Yao? Duncan? Perkins? Bynum? Gasol? Please

Edited May 9, 2011 by exodus

[Eddielives]

Go through the years and name the great centers of the game for me. Now go through the list of great power forwards. Now go through the list of great small forwards and guards. The list is small for centers and much larger for other positions. Yet Al has somehow managed to be an all-star for 2 years of his 3 in the league. Such a b*tch as punk I tell ya.

Edited May 9, 2011 by Eddielives

[DrReality]

I think his old team mate pissed him off and he made it personal

[exodus]

Go through the years and name the great centers of the game for me. Now go through the list of great power forwards. Now go through the list of great small forwards and guards. The list is small for centers and much larger for other positions. Yet Al has somehow managed to be an all-star for 2 years of his 3 in the league. Such a b*tch as punk I tell ya.

Like i said saying this era is the same as any other era for centers is just nuts. the only center now who would be top seven 15 years ago is Howard.

Bringing up the All-Star game is lame because the competition is so weak. What good center did he beat out? I challenge you to name one.

FYI Horford has played 4 years, not 3. :sarcastichand:

Edited May 9, 2011 by exodus

[Duff_Man]

Like i said saying this era is the same as any other era for centers is just nuts. the only center now who would be top seven 15 years ago is Howard.

Bringing up the All-Star game is lame because the competition is so weak. What good center did he beat out? I challenge you to name one.

FYI Horford has played 4 years, not 3. :sarcastichand:

Ooh ooh!! I know the answer!!! It's: WHO GIVES A CRAP?

[BusBoyIsBack]

Like i said saying this era is the same as any other era for centers is just nuts. the only center now who would be top seven 15 years ago is Howard.

Bringing up the All-Star game is lame because the competition is so weak. What good center did he beat out? I challenge you to name one.

FYI Horford has played 4 years, not 3. :sarcastichand:

The fact that he's an undersized guy going out there putting it all out there on the line vs mostly guys bigger than him, some of you need to give the guy a freaking break

I mean sure even I've been hard on him because he hasn't shown up this post-season but my goodness some of you are taking this too far.

[HawksFan87]

AL was great tonight !! go hawks !!

[TRUEINTELLECTPLAYA]

That was better Al, you are the new X factor, they have not touch your best punch yet. They mave taken Teague. Joe, Jamal, and Josh's best punch but Boss still has not showed up yet. This game was close but not what Bossman can do to them. Great game though Al you gonna Boss them soon here and then, That's All She Wrote.

[lethalweapon3]

It feels like we're all waiting for the switch to be turned on... and by "we," I'm including Mr. Al-Star himself. When he finally bodied up on Noah and dunked the ball, we were screaming, "that's been there for you the whole series!" He got to stop playing matador D when he's matched up against Boozer. And on offense, we can all see his "Brad Miller Lite" shots aren't falling... he's got to get to the paint and demand the ball!

~lw3

Edited May 9, 2011 by lethalweapon3

[AUhawksfan]

He did better tonight but still doesn't have that swagger of his I'm used to seeing. Still looks a little uncomfortable out there.

Half the reason Horford did well was because of Josh's great interior passing. Got to give credit where credit is due on that one.

[sasuke]

I still don't understand why he's been so shy offensively.

[exodus]

Ooh ooh!! I know the answer!!! It's: WHO GIVES A CRAP?

Probably the guy who brought up the All-Star game in the first place to try to defend a guy who is MIA. The guy who said there is no difference between eras.

RIF