"They Are Not Being Traded"

[BrazilianHawk]

Well if they're ready to rebuild then they should have let Millsap go to Orlando. Paul doesn't deserve to be a part of a rebuilding team. He's a winner. 

[pimp]

9 minutes ago, BrazilianHawk said:

Well if they're ready to rebuild then they should have let Millsap go to Orlando. Paul doesn't deserve to be a part of a rebuilding team. He's a winner. 

Not having Horford doesn't automatically mean we would be rebuilding.it's not like we are losing a superstar.
Horford has had season ending injuries twice , and we kept winning at pretty much at the same rate without him.
 

Edited January 26, 2016 by pimp

[Jody23]

If the Hawks lock themselves back into treadmill mediocrity, then they deserve every bit non-attention, skepticism and dismissal from the national media that will come their way.

[BrazilianHawk]

1 minute ago, pimp said:

Not having Horford doesn't automatically mean we would be rebuilding.
Horford has had season ending injuries twice , and we kept winning at pretty much at the same rate without him.

True, but... What other C would the Hawks sign/trade for in order to remain competitive (or better than that) in the East? The East has improved a lot since last year, so I don't think the Hawks would even fight for a playoff spot next seasons without a decent center.  That's why I think trading Horford or letting him walk would be bad for the team.  

And please, you tankers out there, please don't get me started with that old "building through the draft" BS plan.  IMHO, we need to sign a rebounding big in addition to re-signing Al, Who knows, some guys take a long time to develop, maybe Tavares could be that guy. He's looked good sometimes, but also lost and raw.  I still think he's a promising big and Bud should play him more.

[Jody23]

1 minute ago, BrazilianHawk said:

True, but... What other C would the Hawks sign/trade for in order to remain competitive (or better than that) in the East? The East has improved a lot since last year, so I don't think the Hawks would even fight for a playoff spot next seasons without a decent center.  That's why I think trading Horford or letting him walk would be bad for the team.  

And please, you tankers out there, please don't get me started with that old "building through the draft" BS plan.  IMHO, we need to sign a rebounding big in addition to re-signing Al, Who knows, some guys take a long time to develop, maybe Tavares could be that guy. He's looked good sometimes, but also lost and raw.  I still think he's a promising big and Bud should play him more.

You don't have to have a great center to win in this league.  The Hawks don't have to get a center back in a trade for Horford.  They can get and do need talent at other positions.

[pimp]

3 minutes ago, BrazilianHawk said:

True, but... What other C would the Hawks sign/trade for in order to remain competitive (or better than that) in the East? The East has improved a lot since last year, so I don't think the Hawks would even fight for a playoff spot next seasons without a decent center.  That's why I think trading Horford or letting him walk would be bad for the team.  

And please, you tankers out there, please don't get me started with that old "building through the draft" BS plan.  IMHO, we need to sign a rebounding big in addition to re-signing Al, Who knows, some guys take a long time to develop, maybe Tavares could be that guy. He's looked good sometimes, but also lost and raw.  I still think he's a promising big and Bud should play him more.

 I don't know who the free agents are this year or who will be on the trading block,
but if Horford leaves ,we  will have the money to make a " "Millsap type 2013 signing"
Like we did when we let Josh Smith walk.

[BrazilianHawk]

4 minutes ago, pimp said:

 I don't know who the free agents are this year or who will be on the trading block,
but if Horford leaves ,we  will have the money to make a " "Millsap type 2013 signing"
Like we did when we let Josh Smith walk.

Well then we would have to call Danny Ferry back, because almost everyone on this site was upset by the Millsap and Carroll signing back on the day. Danny has made a great job, and I really doubt Bud could do it, considering the very suspect hirings he's made  so far. 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, BrazilianHawk said:

Well then we would have to call Danny Ferry back, because almost everyone on this site was upset by the Millsap and Carroll signing back on the day. Danny has made a great job, and I really doubt Bud could do it, considering the very suspect hirings he's made  so far. 

Funny how people forget the Millsap and DMC signing squawk meltdown.  Lol.

All the crying we let Josh leave for nothing, we only signed Sap and who?....yuck yuck.

Maybe I should dig up that thread, should have some doozies in it.

[pimp]

2 minutes ago, BrazilianHawk said:

Well then we would have to call Danny Ferry back, because almost everyone on this site was upset by the Millsap and Carroll signing back on the day. Danny has made a great job, and I really doubt Bud could do it, considering the very suspect hirings he's made  so far. 

i wasn't upset..
Almost everyone on the squawk  was looks silly now for being upset about that now  don't they.
Matter of fact i bet they wished he had given Sap and carroll long term contracts instead of 2 year contracts.
We would have Sap now for around 10mil instead of 18 and Carroll for 3 mill instead of the 15 he got fromToronto.

Just cause the majority of the squawk likes something or is upset about something doesn't' mean they are right.
I remember when the majority of Hawksquawk wanted to draft Marvin Williams, then they called BK an idiot when drafted him and  Marvin flopped
Even though they wanted Marvin all along lol
There is nothing that we can do this off season that will make everyone on the Sqawk happy.Just try not to overreact to every move. 
 

[Sothron]

The sad fact is that Horford does not deserve a max deal and yet we will give him one. Al this season is like 3/5th of the Horford we've seen since his rookie season.

[cam1218]

The hardest part is we don't know what Al we actually have. 

Is Al playing scared because of his contract? Is he playing soft to be healthy because he knows we will be in the playoffs? Or is this actually the Al Horford we will see the next 5-6 years?

I think a lot of us are scared this is the new Horford but we will see the truth as the season goes on.

[Mdizzle5]

5 hours ago, Lurker said:

Let Horford walk or do a sign and trade. Trade every veteran except for Millsap and do what Portland did last offseason. Try to avoid the playoffs next season but if not, enter them as a low seed and play spoiler.

I've actually read rumors that they are going to be balk-ish at signing Horford to a 20+ million dollar deal, which pretty much means they're strongly considering pulling a Portland and letting their franchise player go and rebuild.

The Hawks? Rebuild? Unlikely. Bud comes from the SA school of continuity and Wilcox is just Bud's puppet. 

[pimp]

Al had a good game tonight offensively. He actually aggressively attacked the basket a few times
But he still only managed 2 rebounds in 27 mins

[BigDog90]

11 hours ago, Jody23 said:

From Basketball Insiders:

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/nba-am-they-are-not-getting-traded/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Al Horford, Atlanta Hawks

Like Howard, Al Horford will be an unrestricted free agent in July. Horford also becomes eligible for a salary starting at what could be north of $25 million per season, which becomes a tough decision for the Hawks.

As things stand today the Hawks are the four seed in the East, but not nearly the dominant and cohesive team they were this time last year. Horford is posting reasonably strong numbers this season, but is off his career averages in a pretty significant way, posting 14.4 points and 7.5 rebounds so far in 2016; not exactly max-contract type numbers.

Hawks sources found the notion of trading Horford laughable, pointing to how important he was to the team dynamic in Atlanta and that he’s a core guy in Mike Budenholzer’s system.

There is a sense among NBA insiders that a hefty offer could steal Horford away from the Hawks, especially if the team continues to regress from their record setting form from last season.

As things stand today, the Hawks have $52.717 million in 2016 salary cap commitments, which means they could have $38 million in useable cap space in July. Horford’s salary cap hold is $18 million, so the Hawks could have roughly $20 million in cap space to spend and then exceed the cap to retain Horford.

The question facing the Hawks is do they want to pay market value for a long-term max level contract with Horford in July? As things stand today, it seems the Hawks are staying to course with Horford and believing they have the means to retain him in July – making him a name you can take off the board.

I couldn't see the Hawks trading Al before the season ends, we haven't seen a healthy Teague and Korver play alongside him this season. I think they'll ride the year out and see what happens. 

I don't think Al is worth 25 mil a season but there really isn't a better option available this summer to replace him and they can't tank next season when majority of their roster will be FAs. It's either pay Horford or bid over a broke down Noah, Hibbert and Big Al.

[Jody23]

7 hours ago, BigDog90 said:

I couldn't see the Hawks trading Al before the season ends, we haven't seen a healthy Teague and Korver play alongside him this season. I think they'll ride the year out and see what happens. 

I don't think Al is worth 25 mil a season but there really isn't a better option available this summer to replace him and they can't tank next season when majority of their roster will be FAs. It's either pay Horford or bid over a broke down Noah, Hibbert and Big Al.

Just because their isn't a better option this offseason does mean you lock yourself in to mediocrity.  Keep the flexibility.

[gopack10]

12 hours ago, pimp said:

i wasn't upset..
Almost everyone on the squawk  was looks silly now for being upset about that now  don't they.
Matter of fact i bet they wished he had given Sap and carroll long term contracts instead of 2 year contracts.
We would have Sap now for around 10mil instead of 18 and Carroll for 3 mill instead of the 15 he got fromToronto.

Just cause the majority of the squawk likes something or is upset about something doesn't' mean they are right.
I remember when the majority of Hawksquawk wanted to draft Marvin Williams, then they called BK an idiot when drafted him and  Marvin flopped
Even though they wanted Marvin all along lol
There is nothing that we can do this off season that will make everyone on the Sqawk happy.Just try not to overreact to every move. 
 

I wasn't a member back then, but if people were seriously upset at letting Smooth walk then they obviously were speaking through their hearts and not their basketball minds since Josh was an Atlanta native and was a fan favorite for a few years.

I was a huge fan of Millsap.  Didn't like the DMC signing too much so I was clearly wrong about that one.

The truth of the matter is, there is no trade outside of us bringing in a super star, already signed to a long-term deal, that is team friendly, for our role players and zero draft picks involved that will make some on these boards happy.

[AHF]

1 hour ago, gopack10 said:

I wasn't a member back then, but if people were seriously upset at letting Smooth walk then they obviously were speaking through their hearts and not their basketball minds since Josh was an Atlanta native and was a fan favorite for a few years.

I was a huge fan of Millsap.  Didn't like the DMC signing too much so I was clearly wrong about that one.

The truth of the matter is, there is no trade outside of us bringing in a super star, already signed to a long-term deal, that is team friendly, for our role players and zero draft picks involved that will make some on these boards happy.

There were a few people upset that we let Josh walk but the majority of the site (by far) was ready to say goodbye to Josh at that point.

The Millsap signing had criticism primarily from two perspectives:

1. I am upset we didn't sign a star.  Why do we have to settle for pretty good players and never get the superstar?
2. We need to rebuild and now we are locking ourselves right back into a team with a first/second round exit as its peak.

I don't remember a ton of blowback on DMC (remember that we only paid him $2.5M per season) but I am sure there were some people who didn't think he would amount to anything or who were disappointed we didn't sign someone more high profile.

I was in the camp of people who thought we needed to rebuild and that we weren't getting out of the second round so I was wrong.  I never expected the success we had last season and expected a team more like we've shown so far this season.

[Wretch]

Quote

Hawks sources found the notion of trading Horford laughable, pointing to how important he was to the team dynamic in Atlanta and that he’s a core guy in Mike Budenholzer’s system.

This is what scares me.  This is WLOC type mentality and I hate it.  If it's true, then it's almost like having a bunch of homers run the front office.  I wonder if this is just posturing to drive the price up.  Either way, I hate to see this club get stuck in another middling trap.

 

39 minutes ago, AHF said:

There were a few people upset that we let Josh walk but the majority of the site (by far) was ready to say goodbye to Josh at that point.

The Millsap signing had criticism primarily from two perspectives:

1. I am upset we didn't sign a star.  Why do we have to settle for pretty good players and never get the superstar?
2. We need to rebuild and now we are locking ourselves right back into a team with a first/second round exit as its peak.

I don't remember a ton of blowback on DMC (remember that we only paid him $2.5M per season) but I am sure there were some people who didn't think he would amount to anything or who were disappointed we didn't sign someone more high profile.

I was in the camp of people who thought we needed to rebuild and that we weren't getting out of the second round so I was wrong.  I never expected the success we had last season and expected a team more like we've shown so far this season.

I was just about to say exactly this.  I'd also add that the perspectives weren't mutually exclusive.  I was a good mixture of both (Although I was appreciative of Millsap for what he was).  Regardless, there was all of about 2 posters who thought we could have the kind of season we had last year.  Everyone else expected the latter half of your 2nd perspective: a competitive team that would see a 1st or at best 2nd round exit.

[MaceCase]

Was a bit different with Joe in that the Hawks had very little cap space if he left and resigning him put the team right below the luxury tax foregoing any trades for larger salaries or the use of exceptions particularly with the notorious A$G.  If the team had the cap flexibility that it does now with expendable non-core pieces coming off the books in a year, a skyrocketing cap, and even if Joe had accepted a shorter deal there would be far less doom and gloom being projected onto Al. 

I personally don't think re-signing Al to a max deal hamstrings the Hawks flexibility (there's currently not a single guaranteed contract past 2017), my only concern is over the length of his deal because flexibility or not you're still looking at paying a player for a number of years past his prime.  A 3 year deal?  Mazel tov!  A 4 year deal?  Be it flat, without certain raises, or options then fine, but even if it lacks those I can bring myself to live with it.  A 5 year deal?  Hell no!

 

There's also always the possibility that a new amnesty clause will be included in the new CBA should the players chose to opt out and Almnesty can start anew!

[BigDog90]

@Jody23 True. I just hope they wouldn't do something dumb like let Al walk and sign David Lee because he'll be cheaper passing big man and once was an All-Star at center and try to have him shoot 3s.