Dangit, we finally trade

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, Vol4ever said:

Wonder why Houston wants him?  

Question of the decade! Possibly Cp3 is his friend is all I can think. The Rockets essentially lose Luc and Ariza and add Melo. 

[High5]

14 minutes ago, AHF said:

Carmelo isn’t totally washed up by any means.  He can still play.  But he isn’t close to being a superstar today.  At the height of his powers his selfish play and lack of focus on D had him below superstar level for me but at least there was an argument to be had the .

northcyde’s comparison to Dwight is a good one.  Both can still play but both are flawed and not what they used to be.

Statistically Melo had a strong argument for being the most detrimental player in the league last season. He was terrible. But he scored 45 points in a loss 18 months ago so we obviously swindled the Thunder and should keep him.

[Dragitoff]

2 hours ago, Vol4ever said:

Wonder why Houston wants him?  

Because they'll be paying him the MLE or less.  

[Brotha2ThaNite]

It’s sad to see this. When I heard that people were saying they want Melo to stay on Twitter and Facebook, I was like those aren’t true Hawks fans. Those are the fans that only go to the game to see the “star” players when they come to town. To see it on here is saddening. I hate calling people names but it hurts to see that Hawks fans can be this dumb to want to keep Melo... ?

[JayBirdHawk]

10 minutes ago, Brotha2ThaNite said:

It’s sad to see this. When I heard that people were saying they want Melo to stay on Twitter and Facebook, I was like those aren’t true Hawks fans. Those are the fans that only go to the game to see the “star” players when they come to town. To see it on here is saddening. I hate calling people names but it hurts to see that Hawks fans can be this dumb to want to keep Melo... ?

Exactly

[Thomas]

17 hours ago, Brotha2ThaNite said:

It’s sad to see this. When I heard that people were saying they want Melo to stay on Twitter and Facebook, I was like those aren’t true Hawks fans. Those are the fans that only go to the game to see the “star” players when they come to town. To see it on here is saddening. I hate calling people names but it hurts to see that Hawks fans can be this dumb to want to keep Melo... ?

As said earlier Melo will rule HORSE on a city park court not so long from now. Shades of John Drew on the way down, minus Melo's threes of course (and Drew's affair with Bertha). Drew absolutely ruled Chastain Park before it all unwinded. 

[AHF]

On 7/21/2018 at 0:41 PM, High5 said:

Statistically Melo had a strong argument for being the most detrimental player in the league last season. He was terrible. But he scored 45 points in a loss 18 months ago so we obviously swindled the Thunder and should keep him.

I have to say I don't agree with this. 4 of OKC's top 5 man lineups had Carmelo in them and their bottom 3 lineups all were missing Melo so it is hard to say he was a huge detriment to their play on the floor.  Despite what was obviously a bad fit in an offense designed by one of the worst and simplest offensive minds in the league (Billy Donovan), he still did fine job on the boards and average 18.5 and 6.5 per 36 last year.  That adds up to me to be a better comparable to Dwight than to the most detrimental player in the association.

I don't want him in Atlanta but he still has a place in the NBA, IMO.

[kg01]

On 7/21/2018 at 4:23 PM, Brotha2ThaNite said:

It’s sad to see this. When I heard that people were saying they want Melo to stay on Twitter and Facebook, I was like those aren’t true Hawks fans. Those are the fans that only go to the game to see the “star” players when they come to town. To see it on here is saddening. I hate calling people names but it hurts to see that Hawks fans can be this dumb to want to keep Melo... ?

Heh.  For me, it just lets me know who I shouldn't be taking really seriously when it comes to discussing basketball opinions.  I don't even get mad at them anymore.  Well, not too mad.  I cope with it by making fun of them on a level I'm sure they don't understand.

It's why I'm always messin' with ... {name redacted to protect the guilty}

[High5]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

I have to say I don't agree with this. 4 of OKC's top 5 man lineups had Carmelo in them and their bottom 3 lineups all were missing Melo so it is hard to say he was a huge detriment to their play on the floor.  Despite what was obviously a bad fit in an offense designed by one of the worst and simplest offensive minds in the league (Billy Donovan), he still did fine job on the boards and average 18.5 and 6.5 per 36 last year.  That adds up to me to be a better comparable to Dwight than to the most detrimental player in the association.

I don't want him in Atlanta but he still has a place in the NBA, IMO.

OKC had a terrible bench and Melo played the vast majority of his minutes with the starters. I don't believe that's a great measurement of a player's impact. However, only 11 qualified players had a worse BPM than his -3.8 and most of them were young players on bad teams (our very own Isaiah Taylor took the title at -5.4). And his -1.1 VORP was tied for 3rd worst. He had a horrendous .503 TS%. Then of course in the playoffs he took 72 shots to score 71 points. He also had 2 assists in those 6 games. All the while making $24.5 million. Even on a minimum contract you see projections decreasing Houston's chances at a championship by adding him. 

[AHF]

2 hours ago, High5 said:

OKC had a terrible bench and Melo played the vast majority of his minutes with the starters. I don't believe that's a great measurement of a player's impact. However, only 11 qualified players had a worse BPM than his -3.8 and most of them were young players on bad teams (our very own Isaiah Taylor took the title at -5.4). And his -1.1 VORP was tied for 3rd worst. He had a horrendous .503 TS%. Then of course in the playoffs he took 72 shots to score 71 points. He also had 2 assists in those 6 games. All the while making $24.5 million. Even on a minimum contract you see projections decreasing Houston's chances at a championship by adding him. 

All OKC starters played the vast majority of their minutes with the starters.  Now I agree about his poor scoring efficiency last year, but I also think that is a bit of an outlier for him.  He was coming off 5 consecutive years of TS%s between .530 and .560.  I blame a lot of the inefficiency on Donovan who likes to roll guys out and tell them "go score."  Lots of standing around watching everyone do their individual thing.  I expect his TS% to rebound this year on a different team to his more historic norms.  His rookie year is his last season without a TS% of at least .525 TS%.  I think this also cratered his BPM and VORP.  If you look at his career, last season stands out dramatically as the worst year of his career.  It is  his only season ever with a negative VORP, for example.  I attribute much of that to Donovan's schemes and the fit of the personnel in OKC.  IMO, Anthony is still much closer to a league average player for impact and should be able to fill a low grade starter or solid reserve role.  He has his place in the league.

His pay is irrelevant to the discussion but obviously he was grossly overpaid.  

[Spud2nique]

5 hours ago, kg01 said:

Heh.  For me, it just lets me know who I shouldn't be taking really seriously when it comes to discussing basketball opinions.  I don't even get mad at them anymore.  Well, not too mad.  I cope with it by making fun of them on a level I'm sure they don't understand.

It's why I'm always messin' with ... {name redacted to protect the guilty}

I’m so confused ...this could be sturt or the Dr. that checks to see if you have hemroids...

[High5]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

All OKC starters played the vast majority of their minutes with the starters.  Now I agree about his poor scoring efficiency last year, but I also think that is a bit of an outlier for him.  He was coming off 5 consecutive years of TS%s between .530 and .560.  I blame a lot of the inefficiency on Donovan who likes to roll guys out and tell them "go score."  Lots of standing around watching everyone do their individual thing.  I expect his TS% to rebound this year on a different team to his more historic norms.  His rookie year is his last season without a TS% of at least .525 TS%.  I think this also cratered his BPM and VORP.  If you look at his career, last season stands out dramatically as the worst year of his career.  It is  his only season ever with a negative VORP, for example.  I attribute much of that to Donovan's schemes and the fit of the personnel in OKC.  IMO, Anthony is still much closer to a league average player for impact and should be able to fill a low grade starter or solid reserve role.  He has his place in the league.

His pay is irrelevant to the discussion but obviously he was grossly overpaid.  

I'm not saying he hasn't been better or he won't be better, but the topic was last season and he was objectively one of the most negative players in the league (without factoring in the contract). He'll need to change his mentality to be a positive influence on the Rockets. Paul, Harden, and D'Antoni will have the ball moving around better than they did in OKC for sure, but Melo also shot 30.9% on his "open" 3's last season. He was just an all around poor player. And he's probably the most notorious ball stopper in the league so it can't all be blamed on his coach and teammates. That's his style of basketball.

[AHF]

4 hours ago, High5 said:

I'm not saying he hasn't been better or he won't be better, but the topic was last season and he was objectively one of the most negative players in the league (without factoring in the contract). He'll need to change his mentality to be a positive influence on the Rockets. Paul, Harden, and D'Antoni will have the ball moving around better than they did in OKC for sure, but Melo also shot 30.9% on his "open" 3's last season. He was just an all around poor player. And he's probably the most notorious ball stopper in the league so it can't all be blamed on his coach and teammates. That's his style of basketball.

Topic was about missing out on him going forward — not wishing we had him last year being coached by Billy Donovan!  I’ve never been a Melo fan but he is still has the skill to be a contributing player.  Needs to be Olympic Melo and accept a tertiary role within a system when on the floor to maximize his talents.  Since he will only likely get part of the way in that direction, he profiles as likely to be a good reserve for a team like Houston, imo.

[MaceCase]

8 hours ago, AHF said:

Topic was about missing out on him going forward — not wishing we had him last year being coached by Billy Donovan!  I’ve never been a Melo fan but he is still has the skill to be a contributing player.  Needs to be Olympic Melo and accept a tertiary role within a system when on the floor to maximize his talents.  Since he will only likely get part of the way in that direction, he profiles as likely to be a good reserve for a team like Houston, imo.

OKC was banking on the mythical "Olympic Melo" too but that player hasn't existed since 2012 when he tore up that London tournament shooting 53% from the field and 50% from 3.  In the 2016 tournament in Rio those numbers dropped drastically to 39% from the field and 40% from 3 despite being in the same role. 

Melo's catch and shoot numbers were substandard with 39% FG% and 54% EFG% in OKC too so I'm putting this less on the coach and more on the player.  I don't even think Donovan can be blamed for a simple drive and kick from Westbrook and George not being converted.

[AHF]

There is a big gulf from down year to unplayable.  I guess we’ll see if he the most or near most detrimental player in the entire league this season.  

[CBAreject]

On 7/21/2018 at 8:15 AM, Spud2nique said:

Carmelo Anthony is the single most overrated high profile athlete in the history of the NBA. He’s the Arod of ?. 

There’s no such thing as ball-sharing in baseball, and therefore, no such thing as an offensive black hole.  ARod was not overrated.  I can’t stand him, but I have to correct an absurd comparison.  

[Spud2nique]

4 hours ago, CBAreject said:

There’s no such thing as ball-sharing in baseball, and therefore, no such thing as an offensive black hole.  ARod was not overrated.  I can’t stand him, but I have to correct an absurd comparison.  

I was referring to being an overrated type of player who is a stat stuffer. Sure Arod won but he had to go to the Yanks to do it with Jeter. Melo is ridiculously overrated and a stat stuffer as well. That’s all I was saying.

[AHF]

ARod was a legit superstar.  Roid aided but not ridiculously overrated.  Look at Mike Trout with the Angels.  Baseball is not a sport where even the game's best player can win you anything of consequence without a full team around him.

[capstone21]

Melo wasn't good in OKC at all... of the games I went to he hurt them out there on the court... he should have been giving offense off the bench but felt he was to good for that.  He was inconsistent and didn't defend at all.  Didn't try to bang at all for rebounds  which should be expected for a PF.  He also got bullied by opposing teams power forwards.  The team should have kept Taj Gibson instead of going after Melo.  He would have been much more effective next to PG and Westbrook.