Unless Atlanta willing to spend over the LT this year

[NBASupes]

Just now, JayBirdHawk said:

That's unfair though. This team wasn't built to win - how quickly we forget we were TANKING to get those high draft picks.

You can't pick and choose when you want to use the 'winning not winning line.

We did this in 1 offseason to win: Capela, Gallo, Bogi, Snell, Solo.....we actually got vets to try and win a season ago.

What are you talking about? Did you not remember, the year we had the most issues was the year we fired LP. That was when the 1/4 PnR was really struggling to even produce a good PPP. Nate changed it up and our offense went through the roof with vets like Solo and Snell starting. 

[JayBirdHawk]

2 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

What are you talking about? Did you not remember, the year we had the most issues was the year we fired LP. That was when the 1/4 PnR was really struggling to even produce a good PPP. Nate changed it up and our offense went through the roof with vets like Solo and Snell starting. 

No. Lol

1. Cam and Hunter being out with injuries coinciding with Solo and Snell - so more vets less young guys.

2.  Capela also getting healthy was big, but the biggest 

3. Was the return of Bogi from the knee injury.

 

 

[Peoriabird]

Y'all  keep trying to sway supes opinion about John for what reason? He is dug in and has been for a while. He will say anything to support his opinion even if it means distorting the facts. Man...I think I just describe our current political climate. Are you in politics @NBASupes ? Lol!

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, nathan2331 said:

Correllation ≠ Causation. We started running the 1/5 PnR because it's what best suited our lineup. The 1/4 PnR is still lethal, you make it sound like we cut it out the offense completely. We started winning because Capela is a much better center then the scrubs we were trotting out there, our young guys got more experience and we made other key upgrades around the roster like Bogi and Gallo. 

You may see things differently, but I think JC is our best roll man and one of the best in the league. The fact that he stands in the corner now is because Capela is limited on offense, not because the 1/4 PnR has been sussed out. Like I said, JC should get much more credit for his adaptability, especially when it's come at a detriment to his stats.

It wasn't unstoppable. This passed year was the most lethal it's been with a 1.44 PPP which is the same PPP as Okongwu. It's gives us generally a high PPP but Trae likes to score off of the PnR as a PnR Handler, he struggles to do that with JC, even when JC is paired with Gallo and Gallo just stands at the 3pt line. 

Let's look at the Hawks during LP: https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular Season&DateFrom=12%2F22%2F2020&DateTo=03%2F01%2F2021

Look at them, after. https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular Season&DateFrom=03%2F01%2F2021

Our offense got 4 spots better and moved up a lot in those games. But the defense went up from 24 to a tie for 10th. That's amazing: 

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular Season&DateFrom=03%2F01%2F2021

 

 When we run JC at the 5 or when we have him with Gallo, the PnR with JC doesn't improve metrics wise for us. 

[terrell]

26 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Plus John just finished the 1st year of a 5 year contract and somehow he has under performed during the entirety of the contract? How is this possible??? Makes no sense!!!

Yeah Yeah Yeah......

Overpaid and Overrated...

It must be pretty tiring for Trae to know someone with a big mouth(JC) who seems to only eat if you feed them. They rarely prepare their own meal. But complain when you don't put enough gravy on their plate. smh

Edited June 26, 2022 by terrell

[NBASupes]

5 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

No. Lol

1. Cam and Hunter being out with injuries coinciding with Solo and Snell - so more vets less young guys.

2.  Capela also getting healthy was big, but the biggest 

3. Was the return of Bogi from the knee injury.

 

 

The defense was the best it's ever been in Atlanta during that period. 10th in the NBA

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular Season&DateFrom=03%2F01%2F2021

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

Yeah Yeah Yeah......

Overpaid and Overrated...

It must be pretty tiring for Trae to know someone with a big mouth(JC) who seems to only eat if you feed them. They rarely prepare their own meal. But complain when you don't put enough gravy on their plate. smh

They don't get it, it's amazing. He's getting 25 million and paid like he's a star but he's not giving us that in return. You can like JC and want more from him. Hell, I want more from Trae.

[JayBirdHawk]

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

The defense was the best it's ever been in Atlanta during that period. 10th in the NBA

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular Season&DateFrom=03%2F01%2F2021

No one has EVER disputed that but that was not the discussion point.

Let's just agree to disagree and move on.

This was a well disguised thread topic though. Kudos! 

If you want to have a genuine LT implication discussion and how the Hawks can best build the team around it....I'm in.

[RedDawg#8]

Idk why but I just feel the need to post this right here:

20-21 Hawks Regular season

With Cam: 10-16 (.385) 
Without Cam: 32-16(.667)

21-22 Hawks Regular Season

With Cam: 20-29 (.408)
Without Cam: 23-10 (.679) 

That’s with the same injuries and covid issues on the roster as everyone else. Blame whatever you want, whoever you want, but that is pretty consistent correlation to a guy who reportedly did not want to be here.

I just don’t get the obsession with focusing on JC when there are plenty of other scapegoats to go around.

JC does not single-handedly hold us back from anything .

[gurpilo]

I think everyone is following the social rumbling but we are in no hurry to trade JC, he provides good value and is our best PF.

Our weakest position is SG and we need to trade Huerter or Bogi for a SG that can defend. We need to trade Gallo as well to make room for OO and JJ.

FA signings and trades should be focused on sending Bogi or Huerter and Gallo out. FA signings should be focused on combo guards and wing defense, and there are players out there that can fill that role.

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Idk why but I just feel the need to post this right here:

20-21 Hawks Regular season

With Cam: 10-16 (.385) 
Without Cam: 32-16(.667)

21-22 Hawks Regular Season

With Cam: 20-29 (.408)
Without Cam: 23-10 (.679) 

That’s with the same injuries and covid issues on the roster as everyone else. Blame whatever you want, whoever you want, but that is pretty consistent correlation to a guy who reportedly did not want to be here.

I just don’t get the obsession with focusing on JC when there are plenty of other scapegoats to go around.

JC does not single-handedly hold us back from anything .

Cam got traded dog. Your point proves you maybe right but he's gone. 

[nathan2331]

Just now, RedDawg#8 said:

Idk why but I just feel the need to post this right here:

20-21 Hawks Regular season

With Cam: 10-16 (.385) 
Without Cam: 32-16(.667)

21-22 Hawks Regular Season

With Cam: 20-29 (.408)
Without Cam: 23-10 (.679) 

That’s with the same injuries and covid issues on the roster as everyone else. Blame whatever you want, whoever you want, but that is pretty consistent correlation to a guy who reportedly did not want to be here.

I just don’t get the obsession with focusing on JC when there are plenty of other scapegoats to go around.

JC does not single-handedly hold us back from anything .

Why bring up Cam though? He's got nothing to do with this discussion.

[Peoriabird]

This thread is precisely why some posters have a problem with @NBASupesas one of the inside rumor guys. Supes injects his strong opinions into what is suppose to be information or news.  Hawk fans are then confused by some of the unfavorable trade rumor that turn out to be fake news.

[nathan2331]

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

This thread is precisely why some posters have a problem with @NBASupesas one of the inside rumor guys. Supes injects his strong opinions into what is suppose to be information or news.  Hawk fans are then confused by some of the unfavorable trade rumor that turn out to be fake news.

This is a completely seperate thread, and you don't have to believe or agree with everything you read. Y'all don't even want to argue the subject. I don't agree with Supes conclusion, but that doesn't mean he doesn't have valid observations.

[NBASupes]

Just now, gurpilo said:

I think everyone is following the social rumbling but we are in no hurry to trade JC, he provides good value and is our best PF.

Our weakest position is SG and we need to trade Huerter or Bogi for a SG that can defend. We need to trade Gallo as well to make room for OO and JJ.

FA signings and trades should be focused on sending Bogi or Huerter and Gallo out. FA signings should be focused on combo guards and wing defense, and there are players out there that can fill that role.

Put me in that boat, you can't trade JC to trade JC so I am not rush to move him but that doesn't mean I am not disappointed in him. 

SF is our weakest position. We are decent at SG but is that good enough is ultimately the question. SF is a lot of teams weakest position because big wings are really f***ing hard to find. Most teams don't even bother because it's too hard whereas some teams collect them and develop them like Toronto and Boston.

We tried to trade Gallo but they want too damn much for him. He's likely to be cut. 

I don't believe they want to trade Kevin and no one is interested in Bogi unless they get an asset. His value is a lot worse than I heard it was months back. 

FA will look like resigning the Gleague guys and one vet to play the Solo Hill locker room role. 

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

This thread is precisely why some posters have a problem with @NBASupesas one of the inside rumor guys. Supes injects his strong opinions into what is suppose to be information or news.  Hawk fans are then confused by some of the unfavorable trade rumor that turn out to be fake news.

Cool. This isn't the insiders thread. Why are you expecting that from me in my own thread laced with my own opinions?

[Peoriabird]

1 minute ago, nathan2331 said:

This is a completely seperate thread, and you don't have to believe or agree with everything you read. Y'all don't even want to argue the subject. I don't agree with Supes conclusion, but that doesn't mean he doesn't have valid observations.

This may be true but casual visitor may not notice the difference

[NBASupes]

Just now, Peoriabird said:

This may be true but casual visitor may not notice the difference

If you are a casual visitor, you should join the site and post. Your opinions are readily accepted. 

[gurpilo]

hace 1 minuto, NBASupes dijo:

Put me in that boat, you can't trade JC to trade JC so I am not rush to move him but that doesn't mean I am not disappointed in him. 

SF is our weakest position. We are decent at SG but is that good enough is ultimately the question. SF is a lot of teams weakest position because big wings are really f***ing hard to find. Most teams don't even bother because it's too hard whereas some teams collect them and develop them like Toronto and Boston.

We tried to trade Gallo but they want too damn much for him. He's likely to be cut. 

I don't believe they want to trade Kevin and no one is interested in Bogi unless they get an asset. His value is a lot worse than I heard it was months back. 

FA will look like resigning the Gleague guys and one vet to play the Solo Hill locker room role. 

I agree, SG and SF are weak positions for us, you are right but I still have a lot of faith in Hunter, I think he would flourish with a decent defender at SG, even Delon Wright but also a guy like Gary Harris.

[RedDawg#8]

6 minutes ago, nathan2331 said:

Why bring up Cam though? He's got nothing to do with this discussion.

The stand pat crowd made an appearance. My point is basically in-line with the thinking that our team is way less flawed as is than using JC as a scapegoat.

If anything, it proves the importance of a healthy locker room, which is another reason you want JC around.

We are talking about 1/5 vs 1/4 PNR when clearly the biggest issue has been team chemistry and turnstile defense on the perimeter.

And yes, part of me IS hoping to sidetrack the discussion.