Hawks could get high priced STAR

[TheNorthCydeRises]

. . this summer, by using the picks and the young talent the Hawks have acquired for the past 3 years. We all know what we "need". Problem is, we probably can only get 1/2 of what we need via the draft. And if we trade for a center, there is no guarantee that we'll get one that is worth a damn. For the most part, teams aren't giving up their big man, if he's an adequate player.

So the next alternative, is to use our picks and some of our young talent, to trade for a STAR PLAYER on another team, or a borderline star.

Folks, the fact is that the NBA is built around STARS. You need more than one STAR on your team, regardless of position, to really see your squad make that jump to the next level. If a team acquires two star players, you may can get away with surrounding them with mediocre talent, and still be able to win . . and possibly win big. The history of the league has shown this trend time and time again.

So maybe the mindset of fans need to change on this board. Instead of acquiring players with "potential" at "need" positions, maybe we need to just acquire veteran STAR talent, regardless of the position they play.

We're in a position to really bring a big time player here, and not some young kid with potential. And we'll be able to do this RIGHT NOW, if we have to.

Here are some names to look out for this summer. More will probably be looked at.

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Paul Pierce ( 4 yrs - 74 million left on his deal )

When you look at Pierce, you see a guy who has played an an all-star level for the past 6 years. Unfortunately for Paul, he's in the exact same situation that Joe Johnson is in here in ATL. Surrounded by a lot of young talent with "potential", without another guy. The best player he's ever played with, has been Antoine Walker. Both were good enough back in 01 - 02 to see take the Celtics to the Eastern Conference Finals.

For the Hawks, a JJ - Pierce dynamic duo would be hard to stop offensively. The trick would be to surround these guys with smart, hard-nosed defensive players, even if they lack great offensive skills.

For Boston, it gives them a chance to completely start anew, and get Pierce's 74 million off of their books. With the #3 and #5 picks in this year's draft, they could go a long way in rebuilding that franchise the way they want to. Add a player like Marvin Williams, and they would really have a lot of young talent to choose from, if they chose to trade Pierce.

#3 + Marvin + Lue + Wright . . gets that deal done, if Boston wants to acquire talent plus get 1/2 of Pierce's money off the books by next summer.

Hawks potential lineup:

PG) Law . . G) Pierce . . F) JJ . . F) Smith . . C) ZaZa

Jermaine O'Neal ( 3 yrs - 62 million left on his deal )

Of course, this is the deal that would benefit the Hawks the most. It's an unlikely deal though, seeing that Indy probably isn't willing to part with Jermaine without getting a big time asset in return. The one thing in favor of the Hawks when dealing with Indy, is that they might be desperate right now. Dangling that #3 pick to them, after we took their #11 pick, may be enticing enough to pry O'Neal away from them.

Here's the problem, they'd probably want Josh Smith. No way we can do that. So we'd have to play "chicken" with Indy, to see how bad they want the pick. And the Pacers have a few bad contracts on the books, with Dunleavy and Murphy, so they might be willing to make a deal, just for picks and potential cap room. This is a deal in which maybe Marvin and Chill would probably have to go, plus expiring contracts, in order for the deal to work. Either that, or get more teams involved.

Hawks lineup:

PG) Law ( or Lue ) . . G) JJ . . F) Smith . . F) S. Williams . . C) O'Neal

Zack Randolph ( 4 yrs - 51 million left on deal )

A lot has already been said about Zack. And a lot of that is pure BS. Zebo is a baller, plain and simple. He's been a pretty steady 18 - 20 ppg and 9 - 10 rpb guy for the last 4 years. He's improved in areas in which he was weak. And he's learned how to effectively be a scoring option in this league. But it isn't his fault that he's played with a bunch of young players and old pot heads the past 4 years. As JJ will tell you, "I need help!!"

But Zebo is not a STAR. He's a borderline one, but not a star. He's a good 2nd option complimentary player to a star. Put it like this, he's the 2005 version of Al Harrington with a better low post game. Offensively, he's what we'd hope Josh Smith will be next year.

Question: Would you rather have a guy who you KNOW can get you 20 ppg and 10 rebs every night, or continue to wait to see if Marvin, Smoove or Chill develop? There's no right or wrong answer to this, especially if you think that Marvin or Smoove can be a 20 and 10 guy very soon. If not, then you at least have to consider the Zebo option here.

If Portland wants the #3 pick that bad, I'll take Zebo. But I'd offer Portland the absolute minimum I could, to get him here. ( #3 + Lue + Wright + Shelden ).

We don't necessarily need Zack, but he would be a talent upgrade here. If we did acquire Randolph, the Hawks would seriously have to consider playing Smoove as an athletic 5.

Hawks Lineup:

PG) Law . . G) JJ . . F) Marvin . . F) Zebo . . F) Smoove

If you like Golden State's style of play, that's a team that you can run with, and still have players like Chill, Marvin, Salim, ZaZa and Solomon to come off the bench.

Shawn Marion ( 2 yrs - 33.5 million . . player option in 08 )

Funny that I even mention a Phoenix player in this mix. Contrary to rumors, I don't believe for one second that Phoenix will trade Amare, so I won't even list him in a trade scenario. But they will trade Marion . . . in a heartbeat. And they'll do it not only to keep from going into Luxury Tax land next year. They'll do it to possibly make more room for Diaw to really have a chance to earn his money.

This deal was mentioned yesterday by a Phoenix fan on another board.

Speedy + Marvin + Chill . . for Marion.

Granted, I don't think any team would trade for Speedy, and his contract. But it's not as "dumb" as it may seem on the surface.

For Phoenix, Speedy ( if he became healthy ), could serve as their defensive backup PG for Nash. Right now, no one really fills that role, seeing that Barboas plays NO DEFENSE whatsoever. When talking about Childress, he's a guy that may really become good in a running system like that. ( many of you have mentioned that he'd be good on a Western team, because they play more uptempo ). But Marvin is the wildcard in this. Would giving up Marvin be a little too much, for just Marion? I think it would. Instead, I'd offer them ZaZa or the #11 pick instead.

For the Hawks, Marion improves this defense, especially in the 1/2 court, by leaps and bounds. He would immeadiately become our defensive stopper when guarding the superstar 2's and 3's in this league. And he's shown the ability to effectively guard very good 4's in this league as well. The great fallacy of this fan base is that we lose games because of the issues at PG. It's a factor in why we lose, but it isn't the biggest reason.

The Hawks lose, simply because they can't defend GOOD FRONTCOURT PLAYERS. Whether it be at the 4 or the 5, we have a problem slowing down the good players, and a hard time stopping even scrubs who come against us. Add Marion to the mix, and it would go a long way to addressing that, especially since there is no defensive center on the horizon that we can probably get.

Hawks lineup . . from original trade involving Speedy, Chill, and Marvin:

G) Law (#11) . . G) JJ . . F) Marion . . F) Smoove . . F/C) ZaZa . . . . with Lue, Salim, Solomon, (#3) Wright and Shelden backing them up.

One major problem with acquiring Marion. He has a player option at the end of the 2008 season. That means that he could be here only one year, then bounce right out of here. If the Hawks were to deal for Marion, they'd have to make sure that they could re-sign him to an extension. And that extension would probably have to be somewhere less than 10 million per.

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The point is this folks. We're probably making a move to bring in an established talent here with this #3 pick. No more time to wait on potential. And since there are no star or impact players who can be BIG TIME right away after Oden and Durant go off the board, it's probably best that we trade the pick to get a talent like that.

Drafting Conley has the same parameters that drafting Chris Paul had. If we take him at #3, you better damn well make sure that he's isn't the next T.J. Ford . . but the next Isaiah Thomas or the next Nate "Tiny" Archibald.

You don't settle for just the best PG in this draft, if he doesn't look like he'll be a star right away. But if you have a chance to trade that #3 pick for a star, even if it's a star in a position you don't need, you make the move. If you take the PG, make sure that he has star written all over him, not just "good, fill the need PG".

Tim Duncan won a title with Rasho Nesterovic as his center. Karl Malone got to the finals with Greg Oestertag in the starting lineup. Kobe and Shaq won titles with Derek Fisher "running" the point. LeBron is in the conference finals, without a legit PG and just a decent offensive center. Stars are who take you to the promise land. Role players help you win the whole thing.

We're at a point now where we need to get the star talent where we can, then fill the needs elsewhere with quality players.

Remember . . BK is probably running out of time as well. So whatever moves he makes this summer, will have to be moves that really put us in position to make the playoffs NEXT YEAR . . not in 2 - 3 years.

And the quickest way a team can do that, is to add another player the caliber, or just below a Joe Johnson . . even if he is another forward or 2-guard. You just put him beside JJ, and see if both of them can get it done, with the help of the remaining young talent left on the squad.

[BHayley]

And posts like these are absolutely why you are the best poster on here or ESPN boards PERIOD.

Why not consider Garnett too? I'd think the Wolves want a shake-up by now. I see the Zack Randolph trade somewhat possible, if we draft Conley at #3 and throw in a player or two. I'd love to get him, and he's not terribly expensive.

I completely agree we need quit getting 20 year old projects (STOP GETTING YOUNGER) and get some vets in here. I've been saying this for 2 years now. Of course I'd want Oden, but we must move on.

I'm very worried BK will go after Joakim Noah right now. I don't know.

Great post.

[leftwich]

I think getting Zach Randolph would be a mistake, Marion's iffy, but J. O'neil/Pierce would be a welcome addition.

I don't see how Atlanta can trade for anyone not in their rookie contract, however.

[KB21]

The most intriguing option to me is Zach Randolph. There are clearly some positives to getting him.

First, Zach Randolph would give the Hawks a legitimate interior scoring threat. Offensively, the Hawks could base their offense around a tremendous two man game between Joe Johnson on the perimeter and Zach Randolph in the post. Zach has posted two 20 PPG and 10 RPG seasons in the past four years, and over that time span, he has averaged 20.7 PPG and 9.6 RPG. The guy is a tremendous player.

Second, Zach Randolph will only be 26 years old at the start of the season. He's owed a lot of money over the next four years, but his age suggests that he will see his prime during this contract. Joe Johnson will also be 26, so this would give the Hawks two 26 year old players as their focal points.

Now, there are clearly some negatives to getting Zach Randolph.

First, you have to take his character into account. Zach Randolph has not been a high character player so far in his career at Portland. Do we want to risk the future of this franchise on a player who has been in quite a bit of trouble in the past?

Second, while Zach is a great offensive player, he's not so hot on defense. I think the playoffs are showing that defense is the key to going far in the playoffs once again, and I would like to see the Hawks make moves that will improve the team defensively.

A lot would have to depend upon what the Hawks would have to give up to get Zach Randolph on board. If it costs the Hawks a player like Marvin Williams or Josh Childress and the #3 pick, I'd probably pass on the deal.

[leftwich]

Here's a third negative, Zach Randolph is neither a center nor a point guard.

Which of the undersized PF's will play center?

I see Zach Randolph creating as many problems as he solves, and throw in his huge contract, attitude problem, defensive issues...

I hope he stays in Portland.

[Packfill]

The only one of those deal I really like is for JO because he fits what the Hawks need: Interior scoring and interior defense.

Let's face it, if the Hawks do make a big trade like this they have to get a big out of the deal.

Marion and Pierce are really good players, but getting them would effectively leave the team with no assets to acquire a defensive oriented big man or big man with a post game. That is a bad situation. I don't think you are going to win in the NBA with two wing players as the main men unless one of them is named Jordan.

Randolph's poor defense scares me especially if the Hawks are still going to role with Zaza at center. That would be the worse case defensively.

In the end though, I think this is all moot because the ownership situation will preclude a deal of this size getting done.

[KB21]

I don't think I would touch O'Neal with a ten foot pole.

Yeah, he brings exactly what the Hawks need IF HEALTHY.

However, Jermaine O'Neal hasn't played 70 games in a season in over three years now. He's been injured for a big part of the last two seasons, missing a total of 44 games over the last two seasons.

[AtLaS]

Yeah let's pay Randolph 18 million in 4 years... He doesn't play defense, isn't very efficient, is undersized, is a headcase, and doesn't play PG or Center.. No thanks.

[TexasPete]

Atlas, I'm with you. I don't have any faith in Billy but he usually doesn't bring rotten apples to town. Randolph took a leave of absence to attend the funeral of a friend thgis year and ended up in a strip club. I guess he had to grieve with strippers. The dude is one you run from...he is someone elses big contract and headache.

He does score in the paint. He also gives up more than he scores. He has no interest in defense.

If we blow these picks with the likes of Randolph I'm finished with the Hawks.

[dig]

I like the idea of getting a proven star but I don't think any of these deals will work. Marion, Pierce, and Randolph -- while superior players -- duplicate the building blocks we already have, and acquiring them would cripple our organization from a financial and personnel standpoint [remember we have no pick next yr and our tradeable assets will largely be exhausted to get these guys].

J. O'Neal would be awesome but it would be very difficult to get that salary to work and I'm not sure the Pacers would want the guys we could give up to make it work. With all the examples you mentioned the team either had a dominant big man [shaq, Duncan, even Malone has post skills and Rebounding] and/or a solid PG [stockton; LeBron essentially mans the point, is a special player, and the Cavs still aren't top 5 in the NBA]. Also those teams are well-coached and most established stars want to go to a winning envt.

IMO it would be best to put together a young nucleus of players (that includes a PG) and allow them to grow together rather than a star that helps us sneak into the playoffs for a year or two & bolts so we can rebuild again. Even with another superstar we wouldn't make it out of the Eastern Conference semis...

[Dejay]

Don't we have enough young guys on this team as is? If the top prospects we're looking at aren't absolutely the real deal, we have to consider moving the pick to get a veteran who can play, isn't past his prime or oft injured, and can't opt out of his deal next year. I know folks aren't too keen on that because of the SAR deal several years ago but this team has far more talent on the roster now than it did then; you want to compare any of the Joshes to Dion Glover or Zaza to Cal Bowdler?

Enough with the projects already. Its time to parlay some of this good fortune into some guys who can help this team win now.

[TheDude]

we'd still need a center and a point guard. other teams would exploit the hell out of us.

[Peoriabird]

Quote:

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we have to consider moving the pick to get a veteran who can play, isn't past his prime or oft injured, and can't opt out of his deal next year.

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Like who?

[Dejay]

While the theory appear sound, it never bears out. After a while, the losing gets to be too much to take; how many times you think the Joshes heard 'come play with a real team when your rookie deal runs out' while on the court. You have to give them and the fans for matter, something to look forward too. This would be a start.

[Dejay]

Hell if I know, I'm not the GM. But what other alternative is there? We can't continue with this endless cycle of bringing in young guy after young guy and expect all of them to develop and start winning on the same team, especially one that hasn't won in close to a decade. It may not be the best plan but do you have another one?

[Packfill]

Quote:

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I don't think I would touch O'Neal with a ten foot pole.

Yeah, he brings exactly what the Hawks need IF HEALTHY.

However, Jermaine O'Neal hasn't played 70 games in a season in over three years now. He's been injured for a big part of the last two seasons, missing a total of 44 games over the last two seasons.

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No question there would be a huge risk in making such a deal, but if the Hawks are going to do a deal which hamstrings their roster and cap flexibility for the rest of the decade it better be with someone who at least has the potential to fill a couple of the wholes in the existing roster.

[mrhonline]

Why these trade ideas don't work -->

1. It's almost impossible to get enough outgoing salary from Atlanta to make the deal work under the CBA AND still be a good trade:

Paul Pierce - $15M

J. O'Neal - $18M

2. Phoenix will not trade with Atlanta until after they receive the pick.

3. EC teams will not be terribly interested in sending their stars to another EC team unless they get a hefty return.

4. Knight & Co. seem in no rush to trade out the Hawks' cheap, young talent.

The real veteran options are IMO (in no particular order):

1. Mike Bibby

2. Luke Ridnour

3. Pau Gasol

4. Marcus Camby

5. Zach Randolph

[KB21]

That's true.

O'Neal's injury history and Randolph's baggage may make the Hawks go in a different direction.

Like Pau Gasol.

Like the other deals, I'm very mixed on that one as well. Pau would give us low post offense, but that guy is a horrible defender that has no desire to defend at all.

After thinking about it and reading the news this AM, I'm no longer intrigued by Zach Randolph:

Quote:

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•1995. Thirty days in juvenile detention for shoplifting.

•High school years: Thirty days of house arrest for battery.

•Thirty days in juvenile detention for receiving stolen property, a gun.

•2002. Underage drinking arrest in Marion, Ind., his hometown.

•2003. Team suspension by the Trail Blazers for sucker-punching teammate Ruben Patterson in practice and breaking his eye socket.

•2003. Arrested in Portland for driving under the influence of intoxicants and marijuana.

•2004. Accused by police of lying in an investigation of his brother shooting three men in an Indiana nightclub.

•2006. Suspended by the Trail Blazers for making obscene gestures to fans after a game in Indiana.

•2006. Sued by a Portland woman for sexual assault, though prosecutors didn't file criminal charges.

•2007. Left a strip club without paying the bill while he was on bereavement leave from the team and missed three games after the death of his girlfriend's cousin.

•2007. Earlier this month, police were called to the parking lot of a strip club where Randolph and teammate Darius Miles were part of a gathering and a gunshot was fired.

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That's just too much baggage, and it would be the equivalent of acquiring JR Rider.

The Hawks might facilitate a deal to get Randolph somewhere else though, because it appears the Trailblazers will dangle Jarrett Jack as well.