Could the Hawks really look to trade Josh Smith?

[AHawks89]

I won't for a second claim to know what any of the decision-makers in Atlanta are thinking, but some rumors make you wonder if they are at all. Tim Povtak of NBA FanHouse posted a story linking the Hawks to Shaquille O'Neal (not crazy about it the idea, but why not?), and as something of a footnote, dropped this on us:

The Hawks have recently been exploring the possibility of trading power forward Josh Smith as part of their summertime makeover, according to sources around the league.

Oh, okay well that's -- wait, what? First the Hawks give Joe Johnson an absolutely insane amount of money to preserve the status quo, and now they're bent on destroying it? Somehow this report makes absolutely no basketball sense and plenty of managerial sense (or rather, stands in line with the Hawks' somewhat zany precedent) for Atlanta.

Josh Smith is at least one of the two most productive Hawks. He's a great defender as long as he's not asked to defend wings and a produces like a star even if he's not a go-to option. Smith became a more efficient offensive player in '09-'10 (he posted a career-high field goal percentage at .505), which had a fair bit to do with his continued rise. Yet the Hawks want to take that, they want to take one of the most gifted, young power forward in the game, and swap him out with another player who isn't likely to be as gifted or productive.

Maybe the Hawks have fielded offers that have piqued their interest, but I just can't imagine this ending well. It's so hard to get fair return for talented players (particularly ones), and considering Smith's established role and familiarity with his teammates (as well as new Hawks head coach Larry Drew), doesn't it just make more sense for Atlanta to stick with the All-Star-caliber power forward that they already have?

The answer is yes, unless there's something huge lurking behind the curtain. Obviously if Smith can be moved for one of the league's established studs (and we're talking the LeBron James, Dwyane Wade, Chris Paul, Dwight Howard mold here, folks), the Hawks should try their damnedest to make it happen. But if they're simply moving Josh for, say, a decent replacement point guard, Atlanta would be dooming themselves to mediocrity.

With Joe Johnson set to make a king's wage over the next five seasons, Atlanta won't be a major player in free agency in the foreseeable future. They pretty much have to make modifications through trades, or else depend on the internal improvement from Smith, Al Horford, and Jeff Teague. Neither is likely to produce extremely positive results; Smith and Horford are terrific and Teague is certainly talented, but there's no reason to believe they'll make enough progress to seriously improve the Hawks as a while. Smith, Horford, and Teague will get better and better, but Atlanta needed a serious upgrade to take the next step as a franchise, and instead they gave Joe Johnson what will become known as the worst contract in basketball.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/07/could-the-hawks-really-look-to-trade-josh-smith.php

Honestly, I totally agree with this article. I look over all the NBA message boards and there is at least one topic about getting Josh Smith. Everyone wants Josh Smith. Why? I think we all know.

I commented on a few of the boards and it seemed as if no one cared about Horford, only Smith. Who is better? I'm not sure, but in my opinion (Smith). Who is harder to replace? Josh Smith - no doubt. I wish we could keep both Horford and Smith, and add a big man to help out, but it seems this whole Horford vs Smith is getting out of hand.

Ultimately, it's an issue of trust. After everything we've seen from the Hawks as an organization with this core in place, do you trust them to get the right returns on a Josh Smith trade?

]Josh Smith aka J-Smoove could possibly see his exit lane out of Atlanta open up – not that he’ll want to take it because he loves playing here. When asked who my favorite player is on the Hawks I will tell anybody that it is Josh Smith. Folks would say that Al Horford was the MVP of the team last year but I’d argue that it was Josh Smith. On a nightly basis his energy was there and he did it all on both sides of the ball. I’m also willing to say that it’d be harder to replace what Josh gives a team compared to even “that guy”. So the idea of trading Josh is in every way bad, but it would almost become a certainty if the Hawks brought in Shaq.

In a perfect world we’d be able to trade 2 of those 3 guys to dump those salaries so that Horford and Smoove can remain. In my mind those two guys are the true core of the Hawks team. I know a lot of people like to say that Horford is out of position and while I agree to an extent I have to say that I don’t believe he’d be better at the power forward position than Josh Smith who by all means should have also been an all-star last season. I thought earlier this off-season that it’d be nice to bring in a big that can start but the more and more I thought about it I don’t want Horford playing the 4 and I definitely wouldn’t want to see Smoove playing the 3 – that has disaster written all over it

http://leomc03.wordpress.com/

In my opinion, from what i've seen, it seems that NBA analyst & fans around the NBA know that Josh Smith is the better PF. I know that Josh Smith has the best market value, but is it really worth trading someone like Josh Smith? Like I said, what are the chances we keep Smoove and Horford down the road? I wouldn't mind it at all. Smith & Horford are my favorite players on the Hawks, but when it's time to make a decision - no doubt I rather keep Smoove.

[Wurider05]

You do what you need to do to get better. Everyone on the team became expendable once they overpaid JJ.

[LucastheThird]

The line are being drawn and sides are being taken; this is not going to end well. :kickcan:

[AHawks89]

:snowballfight:

[Sothron]

I think we need people to stop being fans of players and being fans of a TEAM. I don't care if they trade any single player on the Hawks as long as it gets a ring or in a position to contend for one.

[Jody23]

I think we need people to stop being fans of players and being fans of a TEAM. I don't care if they trade any single player on the Hawks as long as it gets a ring or in a position to contend for one.

Well said sir.

[Sothron]

Well said sir.

Thanks. :conversation:

[D.R.P.]

I think we need people to stop being fans of players and being fans of a TEAM. I don't care if they trade any single player on the Hawks as long as it gets a ring or in a position to contend for one.

I agree, however the hawks should not trade Josh Smith unless it's in a deal to get a true star caliber player (Paul, Melo, LeBron s&t). The Hawks front office must get over their love affair with the so-called core players, in order to build a true championship contender.

Edited July 6, 2010 by D.R.P.

[Wretch]

In a perfect world, we keep Smoove and Horf...and sign someone to go with those two and JJ in the starting lineup. As it stands though, we're missing that 2nd element in the starting lineup that can consistently get us scoring. Neither Horf nor Smoove provide that - and likely never will.

Josh is an incredible talent and my personal pick for team MVP. The guy changes the game in a way that is just rare - it's even more rare when you consider the position he's doing it from. In fact, it's downright retarded when you look at size and how he fills up a stat sheet. Problem is, he and Horf are just not the right compliment for each other.

"SAY WHAT, WRETCH!?!?"

Seriously. They play well together. Yes. They are good defenders. Yes. They rebound. Yes. They're big. Yes. They score...um...yeah they do but here's the thing. JJ is the only reliable scorer in the starting lineup. By reliable, I mean he's a guy that can create shots and make shots night in and night out (predictable 1 on 4 ISO-offense notwithstanding). Outside of JJ, we really don't have a 2nd scoring option. We have guys that score, but not SCORERS. The only other scorer on this team is Crawford off the bench.

Bibby used to be a scorer, Marvin is...Marvin, and behind those guys...*crickets* And while Smoove is a good energy guy and can get points, he is very clumsy off the dribble, needs work on the block, and we all know is jumper is beyond suspect. Horford...? He's bigger, has a MUCH improved jumper, and has quickness around the basket. He may have more upside offensively than Smoove, but he's still not a guy that you can just give the ball too. Most people agree that he likely won't ever be that. So you have these two cornerstones in the starting 5 that are great at providing energy, playing defense, and getting rebounds...but neither is a scorer. Where does the offense come from? Two choices:

A) You implement a Pistons-esque score by committee approach, where you got one guy (Rip Hamilton/Joe Johnson) that is the primary scorer and a bunch of guys around him that are not true scorers, but can hit shots regularly - and you MOVE THE BALL. With the current team we have, this might actually get us past the 2nd round - if Marvin could regain the form of a couple seasons ago.

B) You get another scorer. And this is where all the trade business comes in. The easiest solution is to trade one of these young front court studs we have, who's value is VERY high right now. With the right package, they may be able to fetch us a Chris Bosh, Chris Paul, or Melo (you don't do this for anything substantially less, BTW). Either would be a massive offensive upgrade over both Horf and Smoove and puts us in a serious position to do some post-season damage.

Ideally, we'd keep both and pair them with JJ and this incoming star. But is a package of some combination of Marvin/Teague/Bibby/Crawford/ZaZa/1sts enough? In all these sign and trade scenarios, possibly. The answer changes to definitely when you factor in Horf/Smoove. Though... The question then, as it has seemed to develop into, is...which one do we deal?

One thing is certain in my mind...bringing JJ back for all that money means we are either content to have a 2nd round team for the next 6 years or there are some BIG moves on the horizon.

[swanlee]

As young as Smith is and as much as he has already progressed I think we would be completely stupid to trade him. He has progressed every year and his potential is totally sky high he could be a legit superstar. I simply do not understand why anyone is talking about trading him

We should hang onto to Smith and Holford no matter the cost and build our team around them.

[tonegully]

I think we need people to stop being fans of players and being fans of a TEAM. I don't care if they trade any single player on the Hawks as long as it gets a ring or in a position to contend for one.

Amen.

[KB21]

As young as Smith is and as much as he has already progressed I think we would be completely stupid to trade him. He has progressed every year and his potential is totally sky high he could be a legit superstar. I simply do not understand why anyone is talking about trading him

We should hang onto to Smith and Holford no matter the cost and build our team around them.

I agree with this. Smith and Horford are both 24 years old. They have gotten better and should continue to get better. The two players combined to produce more than 20 wins for the Hawks this past season. I haven't looked at the stats, but I would venture to guess that the only power forward/center combo that produced more wins is probably the Lakers combo of Gasol and Bynum.

The best thing the Hawks can do is to convince these two players that the team is better with them at their current positions than they would be if they moved one to get a so called true center who won't be as good as either player. Is either player an elite player in the league? No. Are they likely to become elite players? It is possible, but the odds are against it. Are they both upper echelon players at their respective positions? Most definitely! Both Al and Josh are arguably among the top 5 at their respective positions in the league right now. Say what you want to, but you cannot convince me that a team with 5 upper echelon players cannot be better than a team with a mega superstar, an upper echelon player, and a group of scrubs surrounding them.

[Admin]

It is as simple as this for me, I can love J-Smoove and I can hate Josh Smith. While he has the potential to be the teams MVP and has been in many games, he also has the potential to be the LVP (least valuable player) or MDP (most destructive player) and has been in many games and I wouldn't want to build around someone who has that effect on the team. And while some may not be able to admit it there is a good chance that one or more of the players on the Hawks don't really like Josh Smith based on comments that we've heard over the years. With his value so high from last years improvement right now is the perfect time to trade him get that superstar player who at the very least will mentally come to play every night.

[ATLBob]

I think we need people to stop being fans of players and being fans of a TEAM. I don't care if they trade any single player on the Hawks as long as it gets a ring or in a position to contend for one.

Agree here.

It is as simple as this for me, I can love J-Smoove and I can hate Josh Smith. While he has the potential to be the teams MVP and has been in many games, he also has the potential to be the LVP (least valuable player) or MDP (most destructive player) and has been in many games and I wouldn't want to build around someone who has that effect on the team. And while some may not be able to admit it there is a good chance that one or more of the players on the Hawks don't really like Josh Smith based on comments that we've heard over the years. With his value so high from last years improvement right now is the perfect time to trade him get that superstar player who at the very least will mentally come to play every night.

Also agree with a lot of this here Dolfan, though I would reverse it: I want Josh Smith, a player who maximizes his talent, keeps playing smart, and catalyzes the team without getting in the way of winning team basketball, and not Smoove, the player who wants to be something he isn't, then sulks & quits when things don't go his way.

[capstone21]

It is as simple as this for me, I can love J-Smoove and I can hate Josh Smith. While he has the potential to be the teams MVP and has been in many games, he also has the potential to be the LVP (least valuable player) or MDP (most destructive player) and has been in many games and I wouldn't want to build around someone who has that effect on the team. And while some may not be able to admit it there is a good chance that one or more of the players on the Hawks don't really like Josh Smith based on comments that we've heard over the years. With his value so high from last years improvement right now is the perfect time to trade him get that superstar player who at the very least will mentally come to play every night.

I agree...his value is probably at its highest and if we were ever going to try to get that missing piece....Josh will probably be the one to do it.