Hawks want to use Rockets' rebuilding model

[iDash]

...Hawks general manager Danny Ferry has emerged as a guy envied by his peers. Since getting the job in Atlanta in June of last year, Ferry has unloaded three players (Josh Smith, Joe Johnson and Marvin Williams) whose contracts had been choking the team’s flexibility and gave the Hawks some semblance of youth with the drafting of big man Lucas Noguiera and point guard Dennis Schröder this year—last season, the only player under 25 to average more than 15.0 minutes was point guard Jeff Teague.

“We’re well-positioned for many reasons,” Ferry told Sporting News in a phone interview. “We have good players who will work hard and will be very competitive this year. We have salary-cap flexibility this year, with some space, but also space going forward. We have all our draft choices going forward as well. We have the opportunity to be competitive, but to continue to build on what we’re doing.”

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http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2013-08-20/danny-ferry-atlanta-hawks-news-roster-nba-free-agency-rockets-mavs-josh-smith

[yungsta]

I dont like following the rockets model because you are relying on another team to make the dumb mistake of giving away young star talent due to not wanting to pay them.

In a league where all the star playing are now teaming up and forcing their way into big markets you will now see more smaller market teams doing every possible to keep their young star talent.

Edit: Unless there is another freak situation like OKC where a small market team is decked out with star talent and have an ownership that doesnt want to pay for a yearly championship contender. Which is VERY unlikely.

Edited August 21, 2013 by yungsta

[nathan2331]

I think Harrison Barnes/Klay Thompson will be the next start to get traded. The Warriors core of Curry, Lee, Thompson/and Barnes cannot all get paid (not without going into luxury tax).

[yungsta]

I think Harrison Barnes/Klay Thompson will be the next start to get traded. The Warriors core of Curry, Lee, Thompson/and Barnes cannot all get paid (not without going into luxury tax).

Barnes is due for a new contract when lee expires which is the offseason of 2016 and im sure that New ownership is willing to pay for a winner regardless.

[nathan2331]

Barnes is due for a new contract when lee expires which is the offseason of 2016 and im sure that New ownership is willing to pay for a winner regardless.

Maybe so, and I'm not pretending to have insider information or anything, but if they throw money at Curry and Thompson they may have to make a decision between Barnes and Lee. And considering they just signed Igoudala, that may not be an easy decision to make.

[yungsta]

Maybe so, and I'm not pretending to have insider information or anything, but if they throw money at Curry and Thompson they may have to make a decision between Barnes and Lee. And considering they just signed Igoudala, that may not be an easy decision to make.

They played extremely well when lee got injured and barnes was playing the small ball 4. I think its an easy choice to choose a prime harrision barnes over a 33 year old david lee when its extension time and iggy will be on the last year of his deal by then and will probably be on a sharp decline and be a backup.

Also you are not factoring their new ownership that is willing to pay for a winner unlike OKC and being in a larger market.

[nathan2331]

They played extremely well when lee got injured and barnes was playing the small ball 4. I think its an easy choice to choose a prime harrision barnes over a 33 year old david lee when its extension time and iggy will be on the last year of his deal by then and will probably be on a sharp decline and be a backup. Also you are not factoring their new ownership that is willing to pay for a winner unlike OKC and being in a larger market.

You're right I haven't factored all that in, but I still have a hunch Barnes or Thompson will be traded. Another player I could see being traded is Kevin Love. These are players who I could see being traded under market value that could help us towards winning a championship.

[MaceCase]

Ah, the Rocket model, blow it all up for draft picks and young prospects but luck into trading for a star on the eve of the first game of the season.

[kerrypack]

atl could trade with a team looking to tank this year. I think that is atl's best shot.

[Ebert]

Every team would like to be as Rockets

They have had a positive record every year, have changed the whole team and now they are a contender.

Its what every fan of every team would like i think, make a contender team but without tanking and watching good basketball every year

But... there's only one Daryl Morey

[Ebert]

I think Harrison Barnes/Klay Thompson will be the next start to get traded. The Warriors core of Curry, Lee, Thompson/and Barnes cannot all get paid (not without going into luxury tax).

Harrison Barnes would be a wet dream. Even if it supposes loss Al Horford... but we have to assume that is difficult to win with Al because we wont have a contender team until a few years

[DrReality]

The no mention of trading seems to be an obvious omission. Meaning that's what DF is pondering at the deadline

[Wretch]

Ah, the Rocket model, blow it all up for draft picks and young prospects but luck into trading for a star on the eve of the first game of the season.

Not to mention y'know....having a couple of lottery picks to throw around in a trade. Those are always good to have when you wanna trade for a guy looking to break out.

[Ebert]

There's absolutely no way Morey "planned" for Harden to fall in their laps.

IMO the only part that can/should be duplicated is the process of stockpiling trade-able assets. The actual pieces they ended up with were due to circumstances that won't be repeated.

Also, Kevin Love's not making anyone a contender. JMHO

He tried during the summer trade for DH12 with young pieces. His plan was clearly trade for a star trading young players/picks

Obviously all has ended better than what he expected because he acquired Harden giving... Steve Adams and Jeremy Lamb XD

[AHF]

Not to mention y'know....having a couple of lottery picks to throw around in a trade. Those are always good to have when you wanna trade for a guy looking to break out.

Agreed. Low % odds of seeing another Harden but if it happens then you better have multiple lottery picks to give like the Rockets did if you are looking to follow that model.

I actually think the Houston model is quite dangerous. Remember, they have made the playoffs 1 out of the last 4 years. They have been mediocre enough not to suck but only have harvested low lottery picks in the process. They have had to rely on savvy trades and opportunism to build their assets.

2 playoff wins over 4 years leading up to this summer is not a formula to energize the fan base or to attract free agents -- unless you hit that home run with someone like Harden. Had Houston actually gotten what they wanted and landed Pau Gasol instead, I think they would be in the bottom rungs of the WC playoff picture instead of looking like a big up and comer so they not only enjoyed some luck to land Harden (the fact that a team had 3 players they wanted as their foundation over a guy with All-NBA talent) but they were lucky enough to protected from themselves as well (Morey should be sending Stern fruit baskets for vetoing the Paul/Gasol trade).

[Vol4ever]

We have been stuck in mediocrity for several years. I believe the facts are we were going nowhere with the players we had here and that has been proven to be true. Now we have moved those players we are going nowhere with the ones we have now also. The Hawks no matter how you look at it have to build with young pieces and hope like hell that a star player will come here via free agency (which doesn't look very promising) or we get a very good player wanting out somewhere else, which would be a miracle.

Anyway you look at it this team is no better than the past and will not be sniffing the ECF anytime soon.

That is just the facts!

[yungsta]

The rockets model you still have to stockpile lottery picks and young talent just like any other rebuilding team. Morey was just savy enough to do it without tanking.He had 3 1st rounders in the 2012 draft which was considered a very deep draft. Then he tried to trade those picks for a d12 rental. (LUCKY the magic turned him down)He then tried to trade one of the picks with kyle lowry to move up a few spots in the draft ( LUCKY the raptors turned him down you will see why later)Jeremy lamb who was was a lottery talented and projected to go like 8 dropped down to him and he picked him (LUCKY)After the draft he got the terrible raptors gm (BC) to give a lottery pick for lowry after he turned down the lowry trade early. The earlier trade BC could of had lowry if he moved back a few spots in the draft.Then some how harden was available cause of terrible management not wanting to pay him. I heard the okc gm wanted the world for harden then morey somehow negoiated into just giving the raptors lottery pick, jeremy lamb, and kevin martin. And the rest is history. You see how much luck morey had on his side? This is denitely not a model that can be followed with much sucess.

[Wretch]

Agreed. Low % odds of seeing another Harden but if it happens then you better have multiple lottery picks to give like the Rockets did if you are looking to follow that model.

I actually think the Houston model is quite dangerous. Remember, they have made the playoffs 1 out of the last 4 years. They have been mediocre enough not to suck but only have harvested low lottery picks in the process. They have had to rely on savvy trades and opportunism to build their assets.

2 playoff wins over 4 years leading up to this summer is not a formula to energize the fan base or to attract free agents -- unless you hit that home run with someone like Harden. Had Houston actually gotten what they wanted and landed Pau Gasol instead, I think they would be in the bottom rungs of the WC playoff picture instead of looking like a big up and comer so they not only enjoyed some luck to land Harden (the fact that a team had 3 players they wanted as their foundation over a guy with All-NBA talent) but they were lucky enough to protected from themselves as well (Morey should be sending Stern fruit baskets for vetoing the Paul/Gasol trade).

Surely. These guys weren't thinking lottery or middle of the pack. They were thinking, "Rebuild while staying competitive." But they seriously lucked up. Not once but several times...

#1) The Toronto pick...I wish we could get that lucky

#2) Harden wanting out and actually breaking out

#3) The Chris Paul veto

#4) The Lakers total meltdown

And you think about the net results of what they've done over the past 4 seasons or so...

Coming in on the tail end of the playoffs every year: worst playoff position to have. Coming in at the back end of the lottery: worst lottery position to have. How does that sound promising?

I don't think there is a magic formula for success - because the random nature of people and timing is just too unpredictable. However, I do think true success can be linked to an intelligent rebuild - which involves securing at least one asset through the lottery. What we're doing right now...is NOT rebuilding. It's retooling. We have systematically replaced players with similar players who are equal or more efficient/cost efficient on paper. I don't see that as a tear down and build.

Ultimately, I think it's a mistake to try and emulate any particular method for team building while taking a hard stance against ANY avenue for talent acquisition. You're just shooting yourself in the foot. There are certain kinds of players that will jumpstart a rebuild/culture change. Those guys are hard enough to come by without burning bridges to get to them.

I guess the hope is that Horford can transcend a tier and maybe this team can do it by committee with hard work. That sounds REALLY dangerous to me because short of a finals appearance, or at least a game 7 ECF's...there is no way ATL supports a blue collar team like that. While at the same time, I have my doubts about us even getting there.

[macdaddy]

If the team wins. If the team DOESN'T get embarrassed everytime they play on a big stage. The fans will come out. I agree there is no one formula for success so to say that what we're doing now won't work isn't true. I for one would much rather have a good basketball team to watch then be a perennial lottery team hoping for a good ping pong ball.

[Diesel]

All the things you luck promoters say is true. But here is the real question:

Why not us?

We were standing right there when Morey made all those moves and they were moves that we could have made.

Nobody starts from the top. The true top is Morey sent Carl Landry to the Kings with Cash for Kevin Martin.

Then all the rest of it goes from there.

You guys keep saying.. Luck, luck, luck, luck... At some point, you got to give Morey his due and say that he's a very skilled GM. What he did right is keep tradable assets on hand and was not afraid to trade them.

For us... We make our sacred cows and we stick to these LOSING ASS sacred cows until they have no more value.

Josh Smith - Sacred Cow

Marvin Williams - Sacred Cow

Al Horford - Sacred Cow.

Here's my quote for you... if we ain't winning it all, everybody is on the blocks. - Diesel.

That's the model we should run with. IF we ain't winning it all, everybody is on the blocks.

Give me a GM with true Vision and not one with a preference.