Hawks tried to trade Horford at the deadline?

[NBASupes]

He actually just turned 29 in February. And besides nobody said anything about him trying to trade Millsap.

Dolf, no way in hell Sap is our best player. This is up there with the Jamal lovers in his time in ATL.

[Admin]

Dolf, no way in hell Sap is our best player. This is up there with the Jamal lovers in his time in ATL.

That's fine if you'd like to make an argument for Al, but the fact is that he's missed 2 of the last 3 seasons and even when he plays he's pretty much 1 dimensional on offense whereas Sap can step out to the 3pt line, can beat you off the dribble, can score inside, from mid-range. They're about equal as defenders and rebounders as well.

[tonegully]

Dont trade Horf, Im tired of buying jerseys lol

[macdaddy]

That's fine if you'd like to make an argument for Al, but the fact is that he's missed 2 of the last 3 seasons and even when he plays he's pretty much 1 dimensional on offense whereas Sap can step out to the 3pt line, can beat you off the dribble, can score inside, from mid-range. They're about equal as defenders and rebounders as well.

I think Al is better but you can't overlook the fact that he has missed the majority of the last three seasons. Especially when you have Sap who seems pretty indestructible. I think Al is a better defender mainly because he is bigger and Al is certainly a better mid range shooter. Plus he runs the floor as well as any guy his size in the league. I'm not knocking Sap though. The dude is better inside offensively and a better rebounder despite being shorter. It's an embarrassment of riches at PF right now.

[MaceCase]

He actually just turned 29 in February. And besides nobody said anything about him trying to trade Millsap.

Ouch, bringing the heat today.

[Admin]

I think Al is better but you can't overlook the fact that he has missed the majority of the last three seasons. Especially when you have Sap who seems pretty indestructible. I think Al is a better defender mainly because he is bigger and Al is certainly a better mid range shooter. Plus he runs the floor as well as any guy his size in the league. I'm not knocking Sap though. The dude is better inside offensively and a better rebounder despite being shorter. It's an embarrassment of riches at PF right now.

Not taking anything away from Al, I'm just more impressed with Sap's versatility and his longevity given that he plays pretty physical. He's a much better defender than I ever expected him to be as well. I just think that for me, Sap is the better overall player.

[GameTime]

I have a bad feeling that if we don't go to at least the Conference Finals in the next two years, Al Horford is a goner.

[macdaddy]

Not taking anything away from Al, I'm just more impressed with Sap's versatility and his longevity given that he plays pretty physical. He's a much better defender than I ever expected him to be as well. I just think that for me, Sap is the better overall player.

This being the case the question becomes would you rather have Al at center or someone else? Or use Al to get a wing and play a lesser center alongside Milsap? I guess that's a, b, or c.

a. roll with Sap and Al at 4 and 5

b. roll with Sap and good or better center (if we can get one) at 4 and 5

c. use Al to get a wing and do Sap and decent center

[hawkman]

This being the case the question becomes would you rather have Al at center or someone else? Or use Al to get a wing and play a lesser center alongside Milsap? I guess that's a, b, or c.

a. roll with Sap and Al at 4 and 5

b. roll with Sap and good or better center (if we can get one) at 4 and 5

c. use Al to get a wing and do Sap and decent center

C. If that trade for a top 3 pick is available you take it and use it to get your franchise player. IMHO, that would be Jabari Parker. Then bring in a serviceable center. That's a pipe dream though. I did like how AL and Sap played together though.

[Admin]

This being the case the question becomes would you rather have Al at center or someone else? Or use Al to get a wing and play a lesser center alongside Milsap? I guess that's a, b, or c.

a. roll with Sap and Al at 4 and 5

b. roll with Sap and good or better center (if we can get one) at 4 and 5

c. use Al to get a wing and do Sap and decent center

For me I'd like a C who can rebound, block shots, set great picks and get garbage points. I don't need him to be a star player. Someone like Splitter is just about perfect. Then have a guy on the bench like Bonner who can stretch the D that you can bring in when match ups dictate it like in the Spurs - Thunder series.

Let the other 4 guys get the majority of your points. So for me that would mean moving Al for the best 2-3 I can find or the highest draft pick I can get. I really like Sap and if we can get him back for 4 more years in this salary range I'd jump at the chance.

[macdaddy]

For me I'd like a C who can rebound, block shots, set great picks and get garbage points. I don't need him to be a star player. Someone like Splitter is just about perfect. Then have a guy on the bench like Bonner who can stretch the D that you can bring in when match ups dictate it like in the Spurs - Thunder series.

Let the other 4 guys get the majority of your points. So for me that would mean moving Al for the best 2-3 I can find or the highest draft pick I can get. I really like Sap and if we can get him back for 4 more years in this salary range I'd jump at the chance.

Seems like we basically didn't have a pick and roll game after Al went down. I don't know if Sap just isn't a pnr guy or teague was't as good at it without Al. Would we go away from that or do you think Sap could be a good pnr 4?

[Admin]

Seems like we basically didn't have a pick and roll game after Al went down. I don't know if Sap just isn't a pnr guy or teague was't as good at it without Al. Would we go away from that or do you think Sap could be a good pnr 4?

Yeah they definitely didn't run it well like Al and Teague did. Maybe they just need more time to work on it together.

If Al didn't have this alarming injury history we wouldn't even be considering trading him.

[Guest]

I think people are being a little unfair with Simmons on here. He has never pretended to be a real reporter or tried to hide the fact that he is heavily biased towards his Celtics. His schtick has always been that he is a common man fan who writes some entertaining opinion pieces. As his audience has grown, he has gotten a few actual contacts in the league and now he is getting overexposed but nobody should confuse the guy with or have the same expectations as someone like David Aldridge. He isn't a source for breaking news - he is the guy who gives you his opinions on a game he loves intermixed with pop culture references.

Now to the extent Simmons and Lowe (who is supposed to be a real reporter) are quoting Simmons "mailbag" pieces as "reporting", then they have only themselves to blame when they get blasted for lacking real sources.

I take it you did not listen to the podcast (cut to the 41 minute mark and listen to 5 minutes worth).

Bill Simmons most definitely reported that Horford was shopped. As did Zach Lowe. And they reference that Bill Simmons wrote about it...the only reference I could find was Simmons' mailbag. Maybe there is another outlet that Bill Simmons reported it. But Bill and Zach are definitely making the claim that Horford was shopped...

I trust Bill and Ted more than I trust Bill and Zach.

[AHF]

I didn't listen to it. I have read a lot of Simmons over the years and it is clear to anyone who reads him that he is not a reporter and shouldn't be taken as one. If he is now going to pretend to be a reporter, that may end the already diminishing returns on his going forward work product.

[Guest]

I didn't listen to it. I have read a lot of Simmons over the years and it is clear to anyone who reads him that he is not a reporter and shouldn't be taken as one. If he is now going to pretend to be a reporter, that may end the already diminishing returns on his going forward work product.

Yeah, if you listen then you will see what this thread is all about. Bill Simmons is claiming this as truth...now whether or not his "reported" outlet from him was the mailbag I referenced is up for debate. There could be another outlet that Bill Simmons reported this from that I haven't seen.

I'm sick of these Grantland people trying to churn out page-views. I also cannot stand their esoteric rants on pop-culture, they routinely put out 10,000+ word articles that go nowhere. People need to stop paying attention to them so hopefully they go away.

[NBASupes]

That's fine if you'd like to make an argument for Al, but the fact is that he's missed 2 of the last 3 seasons and even when he plays he's pretty much 1 dimensional on offense whereas Sap can step out to the 3pt line, can beat you off the dribble, can score inside, from mid-range. They're about equal as defenders and rebounders as well.

So movement offense is while shooting at an extremely high clip, high FG% without a thousand dunks like DeAndre and D12 is one dimensional?

Stop playing yourself Dolf. You are acting like a Jamal fan hating on Joe. If you want to talk about two freak injuries, fine but you are talking crazy talk right now. He still average more points a game and shot at a much higher clip being one dimensional as you claim.

Dead! You said they are about equal as defenders. Come on, that isn't even close to accurate. Not even close. Al is one of the most verstate defenders in the NBA. Sap is merely average. Undersized. Can't protect the rim, can defend the perimeter worth a flip but he isn't great at defending the paint either. His best defensive trait is his defensive BBIQ which Al is better at him at that too.

Edited June 2, 2014 by nbasupes40retired

[NBASupes]

Dolfan might as well make a thread saying Ryan Tannehill is better than Andrew Luck thread. That's how much merit his Horford-Sap comparisons have.

Edited June 2, 2014 by nbasupes40retired

[Admin]

So movement offense is while shooting at an extremely high clip, high FG% without a thousand dunks like DeAndre and D12 is one dimensional?

Stop playing yourself Dolf. You are acting like a Jamal fan hating on Joe. If you want to talk about two freak injuries, fine but you are talking crazy talk right now. He still average more points a game and shot at a much higher clip being one dimensional as you claim.

Dead! You said they are about equal as defenders. Come on, that isn't even close to accurate. Not even close. Al is one of the most verstate defenders in the NBA. Sap is merely average. Undersized. Can't protect the rim, can defend the perimeter worth a flip but he isn't great at defending the paint either. His best defensive trait is his defensive BBIQ which Al is better at him at that too.

Dolfan might as well make a thread saying Ryan Tannehill is better than Andrew Luck thread. That's how much merit his Horford-Sap comparisons have.

Yeah cause I'm the one here with credibility issues. #scout4life

[NJHAWK]

Healthy Horf is the better player. However if we got a good trade offer from a team who said they would take one or the other Id have to seriously consider keeping Sap and trading Al because of his injury issues.

[JonKoncak]

. I would trade Horfod for a lottery pick. The guy seems to have this injury bug lately. I think the team needs a true C. A Noah or Asik type player. I would actually roll with Muscala at the 4. He shoots well.. could bulk up a bit but I like his decent potential. With the lottery pick, draft a guy like Saric who I think will be the next Peja Stoijakovic. With the 15th pick I would draft a big man. But that's just me. I would not hesitate to trade Horford for a lottery pick.