The Unassuming, Unknown Superstar Status of Al Horford

[nathan2331]

Supes, Horford ain't that good. His daddy wouldn't even say he's as good as Malone. This is the first year we've seen the Hawks have this success. Malone had winning teams for years. I hear what you're saying, but it's an impossible point to prove.

[Admin]

Well All-defensive team votes go to guys on good defensive teams.  He might have a chance this year if we keep it up.

 

Yeah I know it's not the end all be all award to measure his defensive ability, but even without that I don't put him in an elite category. He's not a game changer defensively. He's very very solid and he'll make some big plays but again I only put a few guys in the elite defensive category and I don't know that there's any who are elite right now. DeAndre Jordan, Joakim Noah, and Tyson Chandler are probably as close as it gets to elite defensively at C.

[Sothron]

I honestly don't understand how supes thinks Al is a better player than Malone. I went back and watched some videos of Karl to be fair to his side and try and see it with a fresh take. I just don't see it. Karl Malone was...actually is...the golden standard of a pick and roll player and he was also a great low post scorer as well. He rebounded extremely well, he had a high basketball IQ, he set great picks, I mean everything Al gets credit for by supes are the same things Malone did but simply better. Karl Malone has a legit case of any player in the NBA to be considered the best ever at his position.

 

I watch Al and I see Wes Unseld. Which is a great player but not on the same level as Malone. I just  can't see it. I also hate that this thread has went from being about how good Al is to an unfair comparison between him and Malone. It would be like someone comparing Korver to Bird.

Yeah I know it's not the end all be all award to measure his defensive ability, but even without that I don't put him in an elite category. He's not a game changer defensively. He's very very solid and he'll make some big plays but again I only put a few guys in the elite defensive category and I don't know that there's any who are elite right now. DeAndre Jordan, Joakim Noah, and Tyson Chandler are probably as close as it gets to elite defensively at C.

 

I'd put M. Gasol in the elite defensive category as well.

[Plainview1981]

Over the last several years he is the best shooter at around 17 feet at his position hands down, and among the best at any position! How is that not elite???

 

That's nice.... But the top players in this league are either elite scorers, rebounders, defenders or passers.

 

Supes just tries to argue that Al is better than everyone else because he is fundamentally sound.

 

Sorry, but give me a Shaq over a more fundamentally sound Al.

Edited January 14, 2015 by Hotlanta1981

[Admin]

I honestly don't understand how supes thinks Al is a better player than Malone. I went back and watched some videos of Karl to be fair to his side and try and see it with a fresh take. I just don't see it. Karl Malone was...actually is...the golden standard of a pick and roll player and he was also a great low post scorer as well. He rebounded extremely well, he had a high basketball IQ, he set great picks, I mean everything Al gets credit for by supes are the same things Malone did but simply better. Karl Malone has a legit case of any player in the NBA to be considered the best ever at his position.

 

I watch Al and I see Wes Unseld. Which is a great player but not on the same level as Malone. I just  can't see it. I also hate that this thread has went from being about how good Al is to an unfair comparison between him and Malone. It would be like someone comparing Korver to Bird.

 

I'd put M. Gasol in the elite defensive category as well.

 

I think Gasol is overrated as a defender. He's very solid but he's not a game changer. 

[Atlantaholic]

That's nice.... But the top players in this league are either elite scorers, rebounders, defenders or passers.

 

Supes just tries to argue that Al is better than everyone else because he is fundamentally sound.

 

Sorry, but give me a Shaq over a more fundamentally sound Al.

 

If Al was putting up shots at the rate some of these elite scorers do he would be putting up monster numbers too. Obviously not Shaq numbers (arguably a top 5 player all time) but certainly Lamarcus Aldridge/Blake Griffin type of numbers.

[NBASupes]

There are very few guys whom I'd consider elite defensively. That word implies that he's the best of the best and that's just not the case. Has he ever even gotten votes for an All-Defensive team? 

Most people consider defensive anchors elite myself included. Lebron proved last year you don't have to be a rim protector to be a truly elite defensive center. Maybe Al is defensively elite. His team defense is and he protects the paint decently. What else can you say. He's not my typical idea of an elite defender but I see why someone would mention him.

[NBASupes]

I honestly don't understand how supes thinks Al is a better player than Malone. I went back and watched some videos of Karl to be fair to his side and try and see it with a fresh take. I just don't see it. Karl Malone was...actually is...the golden standard of a pick and roll player and he was also a great low post scorer as well. He rebounded extremely well, he had a high basketball IQ, he set great picks, I mean everything Al gets credit for by supes are the same things Malone did but simply better. Karl Malone has a legit case of any player in the NBA to be considered the best ever at his position.

 

I watch Al and I see Wes Unseld. Which is a great player but not on the same level as Malone. I just  can't see it. I also hate that this thread has went from being about how good Al is to an unfair comparison between him and Malone. It would be like someone comparing Korver to Bird.

 

I'd put M. Gasol in the elite defensive category as well.

Bring the tape. Simple as that. Bring the tape. 

[Plainview1981]

If Al was putting up shots at the rate some of these elite scorers do he would be putting up monster numbers too. Obviously not Shaq numbers (arguably a top 5 player all time) but certainly Lamarcus Aldridge/Blake Griffin type of numbers.

 

Aldridge and Griffin can post up... Al can't that often. Those guys create contact and get to the foul line. Horford does not.

 

Al is comfortable being what he is now... The 3rd option on offense that also does the little things. That's great, but that's not a superstar.

Edited January 14, 2015 by Hotlanta1981

[Sothron]

I think Gasol is overrated as a defender. He's very solid but he's not a game changer. 

 

I can't disagree with that enough. He's already won a DPOY award.

[NBASupes]

Aldridge and Griffin can post up... Al can't that  as often. 

Edited. I do agree, Al can't create his own offense like LMA or Griffin. That's much is true. Add to the fact that he's out of position doesn't help. First game he started at PF all year and he's gets a triple double. 

Edited January 14, 2015 by nbasupes40retired

[Admin]

I can't disagree with that enough. He's already won a DPOY award.

 

I know he has. I didn't agree with it then and don't agree with it now. That award should be reserved for game changing defensive players.

[Plainview1981]

Edited. I do agree, Al can't create his own offense like LMA or Griffin. That's much is true. Add to the fact that he's out of position doesn't help. First game he started at PF all year and he's gets a triple double. 

 

Al does a lot of good things, but I cringe when he goes to post up and when I look at his free throw attempts.

[NBASupes]

Al does a lot of good things, but I cringe when he goes to post up and when I look at his free throw attempts.

If he is looking to make the best possible decision, why would his FT rate be extremely high. High FT rate doesn't correlate with great offensive player. Usually ball dominate and selfish come to mind. 

[Guest]

First game he started at PF all year and he's gets a triple double.

Philly. Edited January 14, 2015 by JayBirdHawk

[Atlantaholic]

Aldridge and Griffin can post up... Al can't that often. Those guys create contact and get to the foul line. Horford does not.

 

Al is comfortable being what he is now... The 3rd option on offense that also does the little things. That's great, but that's not a superstar.

 

Horford's back to the basket game is much improved and at least equal to Blake's. Blakes post up game consists of missing turnaround jumpers and crashing into the lane out of control and getting bailed out by "star" calls. Aldridge doesn't even post up anymore, he takes jumpers all game long. Go to basketball reference and look at the % of shots from post range and in and the FG%s and tell me Horford doesn't stack up.

[Guest]

I also hate that this thread has went from being about how good Al is to an unfair comparison between him and Malone. It would be like someone comparing Korver to Bird.

My thread got hijacked. And instead of just appreciating the pub he's getting that's so well deserved, and all the little things he does that goes unnoticed, it turns into this debate involving Karl Malone.

By the way: He's not better than Karl Malone :-).

[DS17Fanboy]

Wo cares about Al being a superstar or not when you have Al being all about making this team a title-contender? I srsly dont get it.

 

Also look at what one game playing PF did for Al his stats.

 

Many on this board need to wake up and smell the coffee and do away with their ESPN court gossip.  The Atlanta Hawks are in the process of solidifying a new basketball culture prolly never seen before in Atlanta. This requires different things from players than in the past and Al is the Spiritus Rector on the court of that culture. A culture in the process of breaking W/L records.

Edited January 14, 2015 by DS17Fanboy

[HawkItus]

My thread got hijacked. And instead of just appreciating the pub he's getting that's so well deserved, and all the little things he does that goes unnoticed, it turns into this debate involving Karl Malone.

By the way: He's not better than Karl Malone :-).

[Plainview1981]

Horford's back to the basket game is much improved and at least equal to Blake's. Blakes post up game consists of missing turnaround jumpers and crashing into the lane out of control and getting bailed out by "star" calls. Aldridge doesn't even post up anymore, he takes jumpers all game long. Go to basketball reference and look at the % of shots from post range and in and the FG%s and tell me Horford doesn't stack up.

 

Al is not as good of a post up player as Griffin... Griffin (like almost all bigs these days) seems to be going away from posting up and going to the basket.. But he is still better down there than Al when he wants to be. Same for LA. I saw some of Al's inside game against Detroit... It has not improved. He still hesitates and is still robotic in his movements.

 

Yeah, I know... Everyone else gets bailed out and the Hawks just never get any calls and that's why Al shoots under 2 free throws per game.

 

The biggest thing that separates Al from some of his fellow big men (like the guys mentioned above) is that they will get to the free line. It's not just about shooting a high percentage.