Atlanta overpaid for Dwight at this stage and should have never paid Bazemore

[NBASupes]

Free agency was a wash. The draft was the only positive of the off-season.

Dwight is simply just a decent center at this point. He does somethings really really well and some most things bad. 

Bazemore wasn't good last year and he's even worse this year. Bud should be fired as a GM as I said in the offseason. This team makes too many bad GM decisions for the hardwood.

[Duff_Man]

At this point I would take three smaller dudes standing on each other's shoulders than Howard. 

[Sothron]

Dwight has been everything we thought he would be. He has been an exceptional signing to this team. Unlike Horford, Dwight actually rebounds and plays interior defense.

Once again, you are tilting at windmills. Dwight is not the problem. We have two effective starters on our team in Dennis and Dwight. Everyone else is suspect.

Bazemore is shaping up into Allan Henderson 2.0 the wing version. Now that he's gotten his fat contract he's not giving a rip about his on court production.

 

[Bankingitbig]

Overpaid for a guy averaging a double-double? Top 5 in rebounds and top 10 in PPG for Centers? When guys like Mozgov get $64M/4years and Noah get $72M/4years, I am not sure you can call it an overpay. Biyombo got $72M/4years to be a backup center. Oh and let's not forget Horford getting $113M/4years..

Same people that complain about these signings would complain about the Hawks not using $ in free agency and going after players. Always something to complain about without actually looking at any facts and trying to truly decide what the market value is for a player.

Edited December 15, 2016 by Bankingitbig

[Guest]

There's that crazy Supers again.  @NBASupes, Soth got you here.  After Dennis/Dwight, just throw all the other "starters" in a bag.  They're just taking turns suckin'

1 hour ago, Sothron said:

Dwight has been everything we thought he would be. He has been an exceptional signing to this team. Unlike Horford, Dwight actually rebounds and plays interior defense.

Once again, you are tilting at windmills. Dwight is not the problem. We have two effective starters on our team in Dennis and Dwight. Everyone else is suspect.

Bazemore is shaping up into Allan Henderson 2.0 the wing version. Now that he's gotten his fat contract he's not giving a rip about his on court production.

 

POTD.  I disagree slightly on Skip BazeLess.  It's not that he doesn't care, it's that he cares too much.  He's trying too hard to "live up to the contract".  So much so that he's overplaying everything.  I said before he's going out there like his name's now Paul George, Jr.  Stay in your lane, Skip.

[macdaddy]

Yes.  I think Dwight is an absolutely steal and he's by no means maxed out what he's going to do for us.   This is from yesterday:

Quote

 Budenholzer said he sees continued improvement in Dwight Howard in the pick-and-roll game – specifically the half roll where he gets the ball immediately off the screen and has options to go to the basket or pass to outside shooters. He said getting Howard to see an expanded court is part of his early learning curve.

“That’s where he is learning and growing,” Budenholzer said. “Last night, he had the right idea, the right mindset. Now, it’s just taking it and executing it better. I’m actually encouraged. I think he’s seeing and thinking about the whole court. It’s a skill that is somewhat new. I think with time and repetition, he’s going to get better with it. It’s going to take some time.”

I'll give you that Baze is looking like a bad signing but we're a couple months in.   That could change.   

What if we hadn't signed Dwight.  Horford still would have left and we'd be starting Moose at Center.  

[AUhawksfan]

2 hours ago, Duff_Man said:

At this point I would take three smaller dudes standing on each other's shoulders than Howard. 

So...how many games have you actually watched?

[Thomas]

None, some folks just like to take a sharp tongued jab at the team or fans here and there and offer nothing else.

[Sothron]

12 minutes ago, AUhawksfan said:

So...how many games have you actually watched?

LOL good question. Dwight's putting up a double double and people complain about his play. I mean seriously? We have TWO GUYS that are doing a good job this season in Dennis and Dwight. Where's the heat on Bazemore? Korver? Millsap?

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Sothron said:

LOL good question. Dwight's putting up a double double and people complain about his play. I mean seriously? We have TWO GUYS that are doing a good job this season in Dennis and Dwight. Where's the heat on Bazemore? Korver? Millsap?

Yeah sorry, anyone who thinks Howard is the problem here is either not watching or is named NBASupers.

He's certainly made some mistakes, some bad plays.  But on the list of thangs wrong, he's way down under the guys you mentioned along with Budz, DelaneySucks, @AHF and @JayBirdHawk, Muscala, etc.

[Thomas]

2 hours ago, Sothron said:

LOL good question. Dwight's putting up a double double and people complain about his play. I mean seriously? We have TWO GUYS that are doing a good job this season in Dennis and Dwight. Where's the heat on Bazemore? Korver? Millsap?

Agree about Dwight. Got to say the heat has been turning up for the other cats too but no one deserves it more than Baze getting what he wanted and instead of hitting the gym or court this offseason he perfected his million dollar smile. As Spud said should have worked his tail off and laid off the bread products. Pretty shameful.

[Thomas]

2 hours ago, kg01 said:

Yeah sorry, anyone who thinks Howard is the problem here is either not watching or is named NBASupers.

He's certainly made some mistakes, some bad plays.  But on the list of thangs wrong, he's way down under the guys you mentioned along with Budz, DelaneySucks, @AHF and @JayBirdHawk, Muscala, etc.

The quote from Bud about Dwight seeing the court better is encouraging. Hoping to see good results from that moving forward.

[Gray Mule]

This reminds me of a time, long ago, before most of you were a twinkle in

your dad's eye.  It comes from the Pittsburg Pirates baseball club.

Ralph Kiner was on that team.  He was an all star and deserved the honor.

He ask the owner for a raise, befitting his all star position.

"We ended up in last place this past season with you on the team.  "We

could have ended up in last place without you.  Requested raise denied."

So.  D8 rebounds bunches and scored bunches and the Hawks are getting

blown away, game after game.  He makes lazy turnovers which gives our

opponent extra points.  On the plus side, he is hitting his free throws better.

Is he improving?  I hope so.  He's a Hawk and will remain a Hawk for a long

time.  Dennis the Menance has improved.  Everyone seems to think that every

one else on the team stinks.  Really?  Most all other Hawks have been here

for a while and we won with them.  They didn't decline that much that fast.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Duff_Man said:

At this point I would take three smaller dudes standing on each other's shoulders than Howard. 

I know one small dude in @kg01. It's possible that he could round up two more minions from the sac (cul de)!

[Lurker]

I'm giving it two more weeks, but two things are very obvious:

1. This is Howard's last chance. If yet another team continues to resemble a Howard cancer team and do so after just 11 games, that's it for him in the NBA.
2. Bazemore is nothing special but without space he will not survive. It's not going to get better for him.

[AUhawksfan]

1 hour ago, kg01 said:

Yeah sorry, anyone who thinks Howard is the problem here is either not watching or is named NBASupers.

He's certainly made some mistakes, some bad plays.  But on the list of thangs wrong, he's way down under the guys you mentioned along with Budz, DelaneySucks, @AHF and @JayBirdHawk, Muscala, etc.

Exactly.  Dwight is not free of criticism and he's left me scratching my head many times but he's like #7 on the list of our problems.

If we're blaming Dwight we might as well blame Dennis for his early inconsistencies this season too.  They have stuff to work on but it's not our immediate issue.

[AHF]

40 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

Everyone seems to think that every

one else on the team stinks.  Really?  Most all other Hawks have been here

for a while and we won with them.  They didn't decline that much that fast.

I think you are oversimplifying that.  It is mixed reviews on the others - some positive, some negative.

I'll say this on the other players.

Sap - Still believe in him but his head doesn't seem to be in the game this season like in the past.  Like he is pissed about something.  I hope it isn't him being shopped around that has soured him.  The talent is there if he isn't suffering major health issues and isn't disgruntled.

Baze - He shot over his head the first half of last season and then fell back to earth.  Even with the great start, he still ranked among the very worst starting SFs in the league by several measures.  Didn't like the signing and didn't think he'd live up to it.  I will say he can and should be a useful rotation player and should be better than he has been.  Not above being benched until he gets straightened out.  Simplify his responsibilities and let him succeed on what he executes to start that restoration.

Thabo - Has been great on D.  He has never shown much offense so no one should be surprised that he hasn't maintained his early excellence on that end.  Has been by far the best defensive wing this season.  Earned his starts.

Korver - The decline is on defense.  It isn't just not getting the same recovery help that he did in the past.  It has been bad and real and is worrying because there isn't a solution that jumps out for this.  He can still be a useful reserve especially given the team's lack of jump shooters and his shot is still excellent but that D seriously diminished.

Timmy - I think everyone is thrilled with his development from last year.  With Horford gone and his passing gone, we have a greater need at the SG spot for some ballhandling.  He has been killing it from 2pt range this season and is enjoying career high scoring, FTA, and TS% rates this season to go with sustained improvement on the defensive end of the floor.  A bit of worry with his shooting falling off of late, but his 3pt% and ft% should absolutely improve going forward so that will help balance some of his coming back to earth on the 2pt shots.

Delaney - Started the season well but has been brutal lately.  Shooting has been terrible and defense has been terrible.  Makes it hard to put him on the floor.

Moose - Started the season on fire, just phenomenally good but has fallen off sharply of late.  Hard to predict what path he'll take.  He showed real improvement and solid play two season ago that had many of us fired up on him and then stunk the joint up last season.  Hope he gets back on track but I'm not a big believer in his talent level.  I do think having to defend fewer Cs would help him.

Humphries - Averaging 13 and 10 per 36.  Not great shooting so far (better from 3 than all our non-KK wings, though).  Not sure why he isn't getting any burn as we have seen a need for more muscle when Dwight is out.  Has received 37% of the minutes that Moose has this year.

Splitter - Will he ever play again in Atlanta?  That is the only question people are asking now.

Scott - See Splitter.

Kelly - Fine job carrying towels this season.  Looked like crap on the floor.  Seems like long-shot insurance for Scott and Sap.

Prince - Everyone wants to see more of him.   Everyone.  Has struggled at time and shown some very nice moments.  Represents the only guy who has good tools on both ends of the floor at SF.

Bembry - See Prince with even less PT and a broken jumper.

Eddy - RIP.

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, AHF said:

I think you are oversimplifying that.  It is mixed reviews on the others - some positive, some negative.

I'll say this on the other players.

Sap - Still believe in him but his head doesn't seem to be in the game this season like in the past.  Like he is pissed about something.  I hope it isn't him being shopped around that has soured him.  The talent is there if he isn't suffering major health issues and isn't disgruntled.

Baze - He shot over his head the first half of last season and then fell back to earth.  Even with the great start, he still ranked among the very worst starting SFs in the league by several measures.  Didn't like the signing and didn't think he'd live up to it.  I will say he can and should be a useful rotation player and should be better than he has been.  Not above being benched until he gets straightened out.  Simplify his responsibilities and let him succeed on what he executes to start that restoration.

Thabo - Has been great on D.  He has never shown much offense so no one should be surprised that he hasn't maintained his early excellence on that end.  Has been by far the best defensive wing this season.  Earned his starts.

Korver - The decline is on defense.  It isn't just not getting the same recovery help that he did in the past.  It has been bad and real and is worrying because there isn't a solution that jumps out for this.  He can still be a useful reserve especially given the team's lack of jump shooters and his shot is still excellent but that D seriously diminished.

Timmy - I think everyone is thrilled with his development from last year.  With Horford gone and his passing gone, we have a greater need at the SG spot for some ballhandling.  He has been killing it from 2pt range this season and is enjoying career high scoring, FTA, and TS% rates this season to go with sustained improvement on the defensive end of the floor.  A bit of worry with his shooting falling off of late, but his 3pt% and ft% should absolutely improve going forward so that will help balance some of his coming back to earth on the 2pt shots.

Delaney - Started the season well but has been brutal lately.  Shooting has been terrible and defense has been terrible.  Makes it hard to put him on the floor.

Moose - Started the season on fire, just phenomenally good but has fallen off sharply of late.  Hard to predict what path he'll take.  He showed real improvement and solid play two season ago that had many of us fired up on him and then stunk the joint up last season.  Hope he gets back on track but I'm not a big believer in his talent level.  I do think having to defend fewer Cs would help him.

Humphries - Averaging 13 and 10 per 36.  Not great shooting so far (better from 3 than all our non-KK wings, though).  Not sure why he isn't getting any burn as we have seen a need for more muscle when Dwight is out.  Has received 37% of the minutes that Moose has this year.

Splitter - Will he ever play again in Atlanta?  That is the only question people are asking now.

Scott - See Splitter.

Kelly - Fine job carrying towels this season.  Looked like crap on the floor.  Seems like long-shot insurance for Scott and Sap.

Prince - Everyone wants to see more of him.   Everyone.  Has struggled at time and shown some very nice moments.  Represents the only guy who has good tools on both ends of the floor at SF.

Bembry - See Prince with even less PT and a broken jumper.

Eddy - RIP.

Applause, AH.  This is probably your best work to date.

There's no way Sap wasn't jaded by the trade rumors over the summer.  It's hard to basically find out the only reason you're still here is 'cause wHorford punkt out and left.  I know the organization expects him to be a pro and just move on but when you preach family and all that, a trade rumor like that is probably very jarring.

[Sothron]

1 hour ago, Gray Mule said:

This reminds me of a time, long ago, before most of you were a twinkle in

your dad's eye.  It comes from the Pittsburg Pirates baseball club.

Ralph Kiner was on that team.  He was an all star and deserved the honor.

He ask the owner for a raise, befitting his all star position.

"We ended up in last place this past season with you on the team.  "We

could have ended up in last place without you.  Requested raise denied."

So.  D8 rebounds bunches and scored bunches and the Hawks are getting

blown away, game after game.  He makes lazy turnovers which gives our

opponent extra points.  On the plus side, he is hitting his free throws better.

Is he improving?  I hope so.  He's a Hawk and will remain a Hawk for a long

time.  Dennis the Menance has improved.  Everyone seems to think that every

one else on the team stinks.  Really?  Most all other Hawks have been here

for a while and we won with them.  They didn't decline that much that fast.

That analogy only shows how, no offense, utterly silly that argument is. Saying one guy having a great season means nothing because the team loses is just silly. That player still performed at a high level which quite frankly makes it stand out even MORE because of the poor play around them.

Dwight rebounds bunches and scores in bunches...and that is exactly what he should be doing. He is doing his job. It isn't his fault the Hawks are getting blown out.

You said the other Hawks have here for awhile and we won with them. Those guys are getting older. In Korver's case he is simply done. He has never been the same player after that $%^&* Delladova hurt him in the playoffs. Kent Bazemore has simply disappeared after getting his large contract. Millsap seems like he is pouting and not even trying on defense this season after being in trade rumors.

Blaming Dwight (or Dennis) for the team losing when they are the only starters actually playing well is just mind boggling.

[Thomas]

2 hours ago, AHF said:

Moose - Started the season on fire, just phenomenally good but has fallen off sharply of late.  Hard to predict what path he'll take.  He showed real improvement and solid play two season ago that had many of us fired up on him and then stunk the joint up last season.  Hope he gets back on track but I'm not a big believer in his talent level.  I do think having to defend fewer Cs would help him.

Humphries - Averaging 13 and 10 per 36.  Not great shooting so far (better from 3 than all our non-KK wings, though).  Not sure why he isn't getting any burn as we have seen a need for more muscle when Dwight is out.  Has received 37% of the minutes that Moose has this year.

Weird favoritism there by Bud. Just don't see the logic of Moose backing up the C. He is what he is. Had no idea Kris was that efficient so far and its really hard to tell much with his tiny sample size. Like last year no one but Bud understands that limited minutes thought process. Jeez.